Children Act 1989 (Amendment) (Female Genital Mutilation) Bill [ Lords ]
(Limited Text - Ministerial Extracts only)
Read Full debateMonday 25th February 2019
(5 years, 8 months ago)
General CommitteesChildren Act 1989 (Amendment) (Female Genital Mutilation) 2017-19 Read Hansard Text Amendment Paper: HL Bill 28-I Marshalled list for Committee (PDF) - (24 Oct 2018)
This text is a record of ministerial contributions to a debate held as part of the Children Act 1989 (Amendment) (Female Genital Mutilation) 2017-19 passage through Parliament.
In 1993, the House of Lords Pepper vs. Hart decision provided that statements made by Government Ministers may be taken as illustrative of legislative intent as to the interpretation of law.
This extract highlights statements made by Government Ministers along with contextual remarks by other members. The full debate can be read here
This information is provided by Parallel Parliament and does not comprise part of the offical record
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Lucy Frazer)
It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr McCabe.
I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Richmond Park for his support for the Bill, for sponsoring it through the House and for his commitment to protecting young women. Like him, I also pay tribute to Nimco Ali for her campaigning in this important sphere, and recognise the work of Lord Berkeley in bringing the Bill forward.
As others have said, female genital mutilation is a barbaric and illegal act. Many have referred to the effects of FGM; I will repeat them and refer to the leading judgment of Lady Hale in the Supreme Court case, where the question was whether the risk of FGM amounted to persecution. She held that it did, and in coming to that conclusion, she stated that the procedures
“are irreversible and…last a life time. They are usually performed by traditional practitioners using crude instruments and without anaesthetic. Immediate complications include severe pain, shock, haemorrhage, tetanus or sepsis, urine retention, ulceration... Long term consequences include…urinary incontinence…and sexual dysfunction… It is likely that the risks of maternal death and stillbirth are greatly increased”.
The Bill before this Committee is designed to further protect victims of this horrific practice. The Bill ensures that, if a local authority wishes to bring a care or supervision order in relation to a child at risk of significant harm, it can do so during proceedings for an FGM protection order, avoiding the need for separate applications and potential delay. This change in the process, which is the sole purpose of this Bill, is an obvious and uncontroversial remedy for this small gap in the law and will supplement the measures that this Government have brought forward to tackle FGM.
The hon. Member for Swansea East and my hon. Friend the Member for Mid Dorset and North Poole rightly highlighted the lack of prosecutions in this area. They are right to state that we must do what we can to increase prosecutions so that more people can be brought to justice for this horrific act, but, as the hon. Member for Ashfield rightly identified, one of the difficulties in bringing people to justice is that this act is committed within families. Another difficulty relates to the age of the victims, who cannot speak out when they are so young. This is an issue that affects not just this country; there have been only a small number of prosecutions across many countries in Europe.
Michael Tomlinson
The Minister is absolutely right when it comes to evidence, but are there any lessons that we can learn from jurisdictions abroad, even though there are equally small numbers of prosecutions in Europe? What more can we learn? What more can we do to ensure that of these 135,000 victims, more than just one case is prosecuted in this country?
Lucy Frazer
That is an important point and a challenge; I am sure the Crown Prosecution Service is looking closely at that. Others have made the broader point about education and the hon. Member for Ashfield has challenged the Government on what more we can do. Like my hon. Friend the Member for Richmond Park, I am very pleased that today the Department for Education has announced that education on the issue of female genital mutilation will take place in schools.
My hon. Friend the Member for Mid Dorset and North Poole also asked about how many cases will come before the court in respect of this private Member’s Bill. I answer honestly that we do not expect the number to be large. We cannot say with exact precision how many there will be, but, as others have said, if by some small amendment we can protect any women at all—whether that number is large or small—from the horrific consequences that many hon. Members have outlined, we should do so. Given the impacts, that is what we are doing through our support of this legislation.
Finally, I thank hon. Members from across the Committee for the united and consensual way in which we are proceeding with this legislation. This is the second Bill that I have had the honour of taking through this Parliament with cross-party support, and I see many hon. Members here who were party to the other proceedings on upskirting. These are examples of the Houses of Parliament at their finest, where we identify issues that affect people and bring them forward, plugging gaps in the law, in a cross-party, consensual way. I am privileged yet again to be part of this very important measure. I would also like to mention the contributions by my hon. Friends the Members for Erewash and for Faversham and Mid Kent. Finally, I am pleased to say that I and the Government support this Bill and commend the motion that the Bill be allowed to proceed to Second Reading.
The Chair
With the leave of the Committee, Mr Goldsmith, do you want to make a few brief concluding remarks?
Children Act 1989 (Amendment) (Female Genital Mutilation) Bill [Lords]
(Limited Text - Ministerial Extracts only)
Read Full debateMonday 11th March 2019
(5 years, 8 months ago)
Commons ChamberChildren Act 1989 (Amendment) (Female Genital Mutilation) 2017-19 Read Hansard Text Amendment Paper: Public Bill Committee Amendments as at 5 March 2019 - (5 Mar 2019)
This text is a record of ministerial contributions to a debate held as part of the Children Act 1989 (Amendment) (Female Genital Mutilation) 2017-19 passage through Parliament.
In 1993, the House of Lords Pepper vs. Hart decision provided that statements made by Government Ministers may be taken as illustrative of legislative intent as to the interpretation of law.
This extract highlights statements made by Government Ministers along with contextual remarks by other members. The full debate can be read here
This information is provided by Parallel Parliament and does not comprise part of the offical record
Zac Goldsmith
That is the very next point I was going to make, so I thank my hon. Friend for his intervention. I have said it twice already but I shall say it a third time: I am proud of the work that the Department for International Development does. It is a Department that is often hammered by our newspapers, but it does really important work. The £35 million that it has already spent has changed lives and saved lives, and if the £50 million that has been committed is spent properly—I am sure it will be—it will go on to save lives as well.
I mentioned Nimco’s work; I do not want to embarrass her, but I know that the amount of money that it took to get her to Somaliland to do the work that she did was so small as to barely qualify as a DFID grant. I know that the work of Jaha, whom I mentioned earlier, in the Gambia has cost so little that it would only just register or qualify as a DFID grant. There are so many people like that out there who could do with the kind of support that DFID can provide.
My hon. and learned Friend the Minister provided lots of reassurances when she spoke in Committee about what the Government are doing and how committed they are to tackling FGM. I do not know whether protocol means she will have the opportunity to repeat those reassurances later—
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Lucy Frazer)
indicated assent.
Zac Goldsmith
I see her nodding her head, so she will. I look forward to that.
If this tiny, uncontentious Bill protects just a handful of girls from undergoing the horror of FGM, we will have done something worth while and important in passing it into law. I close my speech simply by thanking all Members present for their support, which I hope the Bill will get at the end of the day. I particularly thank the Clerks, the Whips Office and the Ministry of Justice Bill team, who have been so helpful in getting us to this point. Finally, I thank Lord Berkeley again for winning the arguments next door and handing us a Bill in such good order.
Simon Hoare (North Dorset) (Con)
It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Rotherham (Sarah Champion), who is a bright beacon when it comes to this issue and the safeguarding of children—the most vulnerable in our communities up and down the land. I am tempted to say in passing that, at a time when our politics and this House are so divided on other issues, debates such as these remind us of one of the benefits of this job, which is the coming together of the House to discuss in a united, informed and respectful way an issue that matters to the future of our country and can certainly be deemed to be for the public good.
I listened with the most careful attention to the speech of my right hon. Friend the Member for Basingstoke (Mrs Miller). It was interesting that she used the term “prehistoric” to describe the way that this House can often look. It is not the first time that I have made this comment: I am the Member for North Dorset, and not everything that comes out of Dorset is Jurassic.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Lucy Frazer)
The Government are pleased both to support this Bill and to give it Government time. It is a very short piece of legislation. With two clauses, it is a simple Bill intended to fill a small and unintended gap in the law. It will further protect women and girls, and will allow our courts to make orders and to do so quickly—in a single proceeding—to protect children who are at harm. I thank all Members from across the House who have taken part in this important debate.
Many points have been made in the debate, and I will try to draw them all together. As my hon. Friend the Member for Richmond Park (Zac Goldsmith) started by saying, there has been a cross-party effort to bring this legislation through the House swiftly and with some consensus. I thank the hon. Member for Ashfield (Gloria De Piero) for her helpful comments. My right hon. Friend the Member for Basingstoke (Mrs Miller), in her powerful speech, drew attention not only to the cross-Governmental approach to addressing FGM, but to the presence of so many Departments on the Treasury Bench during this debate. I thank Ministers from the Home Office, the Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport, the Department of Health and Social Care, the Government Equalities Office, the Department for International Development, the Department for Work and Pensions, the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government, the Department for Education, the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy, the Wales Office and the Ministry of Justice for taking part in this debate through their presence today.
A number of Members have highlighted the importance of this Bill because of the effects on the victims. My hon. Friends the Members for Richmond Park, for Sleaford and North Hykeham (Dr Johnson), for Dudley South (Mike Wood), for Stevenage (Stephen McPartland) and for Walsall North (Eddie Hughes), and the hon. Member for Ashfield, all highlighted these effects. My hon. Friends the Member for Erewash (Maggie Throup) and for North Dorset (Simon Hoare), and the hon. Member for Rotherham (Sarah Champion), said quite rightly that FGM is child abuse.
That point was made in the sentencing remarks of the judge in a recent conviction for FGM. Perhaps those who marked the terrible effects most closely were those who told stories of the impact on the victims, such as the terrible story of Aminah told by my hon. Friend the Member for Faversham and Mid Kent (Helen Whately) and the horrific story told by my hon. Friend the Member for Redditch (Rachel Maclean), showing us so graphically the terror of the girls who are experiencing this crime and the impact on their lives for ever.
So what are we doing, as a Government, to address FGM? My hon. Friend the Member for Richmond Park mentioned the legislation that goes back several decades to ensure that we are taking steps on FGM. In 2015, we strengthened the law to improve protection for victims by, for example, introducing a new offence of failing to protect a girl from FGM, and allowing for protection orders. My hon. Friend the Member for Bolton West (Chris Green) asked what more can be done. I am very pleased to say that we are taking steps across Government to ensure that we wipe out this dreadful crime. The Home Office’s FGM unit has participated in over 100 outreach events to raise awareness of FGM. The Department of Health and Social Care has provided £4 million for the national FGM prevention programme, in partnership with NHS England. The Department for Education has announced its intention to reform the curriculum in schools to teach children about the effects of the emotional damage, and has provided nearly £2 million for a national programme to improve the social care response to FGM.
However, as my hon. Friends the Member for Redditch and for Chelmsford (Vicky Ford) pointed out, it is not just about tackling FGM in this country but tackling it overseas. DFID has done a significant amount of work. In addition to a £35 million package to end FGM across 17 countries in Africa, at the end of last year the Government announced a £50 million package to support an African-led movement to end FGM by 2030. That is the single biggest investment by an international donor.
Many Members referred to the statistics on those who have experienced this horrific crime. As the hon. Member for Ashfield rightly identified, we do not know the precise figures on those who are suffering from FGM in this country who have had that crime perpetrated here, but, as the hon. Member for Rotherham stated, we know that it is happening and that, as the hon. Member for Tooting (Dr Allin-Khan) said, it is happening to children at a very young age.
It is very, very difficult to prosecute this dreadful offence. Like my hon. Friend the Member for Congleton (Fiona Bruce), I would like to refer to the powerful speech that the judge made in a recent conviction of a perpetrator of FGM who committed an offence against her daughter. I will read a few of the words from that judgment, which are incredibly powerful. The judge said to the perpetrator:
“You were convicted following a trial of female genital mutilation…The person mutilated was R. R is your daughter. She was just 3 years old when you cut her. FGM has long been against our law. Let’s be clear: FGM is a form of child abuse. It involves deliberate physical mutilation. It is a barbaric practice and a serious crime. It is an offence which targets women, typically being inflicted on women when they are young and vulnerable. It is often done with the collusion of family members. And then it is hidden. This case contains all those features.”
For that particular crime, although there were convictions for other crimes, the judge sentenced the woman to 11 years. As my hon. Friends the Members for Faversham and Mid Kent and for Boston and Skegness (Matt Warman) rightly mentioned, what is so terrible about this crime is that it was done by someone the victim trusted and in a home where the victim should have felt safe. Those were both aggravating factors in the sentencing.
We are tackling this issue by increasing the protections that we offer to victims of FGM. The Bill will define FGM protection orders as family proceedings for the purposes of the Children Act 1989, which will provide for a simplification in the court process. That is a sensible and practical change, which will allow our courts to make orders quickly, in a single proceeding, to protect children at risk of harm.
I would like to answer a number of the points put to me in the debate. My hon. Friend the Member for Bolton West rightly referred to the different procedures and medical examinations that take place in France and elsewhere, but those take place in a different social and legal framework from the UK so are not directly comparable. Frontline medical staff have a mandatory duty to report known cases of FGM in under-18s to the police. As my hon. Friend the Member for Mid Derbyshire (Mrs Latham) said, there is a need for medical staff to report it.
The hon. Member for Ashfield asked what we are doing to get more prosecutions. There is now an FGM lead prosecutor for each area who liaises with the police. She also asked what we can do to educate more. The Home Office’s FGM unit has participated in more than 100 outreach events and is raising awareness of FGM across the country. As I mentioned, the Department for Education is reforming relationships and sex education and health curriculum guidance, to stipulate that secondary schools should address the physical and emotional changes caused by FGM.
The hon. Member for Rotherham rightly mentioned local authority funding. She is right to say that the Department for Education made more than £1.6 million available to run the National FGM Centre for three years. As she acknowledged, the centre hopes to become self-sustaining from April 2020. The University of Bedfordshire is evaluating the centre, and that evaluation is due to be completed by July this year. The Secretary of State for International Development mentioned to me that DFID and the NHS are looking at co-funding specialist expertise, to help deliver services such as those at Queen Charlotte’s Hospital, and she is happy to speak to the hon. Lady about that.
This is a small change, but it will add to the measures that the Government have brought forward to tackle FGM. No one who has spoken in this debate, and neither my hon. Friend the Member for Richmond Park nor the Government, has suggested that the Bill will end FGM. We cannot be complacent about the threats to women and girls. The Government will continue to work to prevent FGM here and abroad, to support the victims of FGM and to pursue those who cause or allow this terrible practice to continue. I am happy to make the commitment that my hon. Friend the Member for Richmond Park asked me to: we will continue to ensure that victims are protected. My hon. Friend the Member for North Dorset and the hon. Member for Tooting referred to their children. We need to continue to protect the children of others across the world.
I would like to end by thanking those who have taken part in the debate. I pay tribute to my hon. Friend the Member for Richmond Park, who has not only steered the Bill through the House so ably but, as we heard in his speech, has done so much to campaign so well with individual campaigners and cross-party to help solve FGM issues here and across the world. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Walsall North, who rightly pointed out that we need to thank both men and women who have taken part in this debate. This is not just a female issue solved by females; it needs a co-ordinated approach, cross-party and cross-gender. I congratulate Lord Berkeley on identifying the issue that a small change in the law could solve and on introducing the Bill in the other place. I thank the Members who sat on the Bill Committee, and I thank my Bill team yet again for the tremendous job they have done. It has been reassuring and heartening to see such solid cross-party support and clear commitment to the Bill. I commend it to the House.
Question put and agreed to.
Bill accordingly read the Third time and passed, without amendment.