Urban Transport: Future Funding

Debate between Trudy Harrison and Gill Furniss

Thursday 31st March 2022 Westminster Hall

[Trudy Harrison]

I am delighted that the hon. Member has given me the opportunity to talk more about how we are rolling out the electric vehicle infrastructure strategy. It is not just about the number of chargers; we recognise that a broken charger is as much use as a chocolate fireguard. That is why we are mandating that there is open data, 99% reliability by charge point operators, transparent pricing, and the ability to pay by contactless, rather than having to download yet another app.

On generation and connection, we are working with Ofgem and identifying the ways in which we can secure reservations, particularly for motorway service areas, where we will need to future-proof with a “dig once” approach, particularly as we look forward to the introduction of heavy goods vehicles using battery-electric technology.

We recognise that we need a lot more chargers, particularly in areas outside of London. We recognise the need for reliability, which will be mandated for charge-point operators. We also recognise that people need to know where chargers are and when they are available. That is all being mandated, and we are bringing forward further legislation later this year.

We are working with Ofgem, National Grid, the distribution network operators across the country and, most importantly, local authorities, because they are our greatest partner in ensuring that a consistent charge point infrastructure is available for people who do not have driveways. We must be able to say, “No driveway is no problem”. That is why we have funds available for homeowners, businesses, local authorities, motorway service areas and purchasers, with plug-in grants across cars, vans and heavy goods vehicles. Our ambition is matched only by the financial incentivisation we are providing to people to make the most of the transition.

[Gill Furniss]

Like the Minister, I am more familiar with this matter than with buses—I am not a bus person. I want to ask about VAT rates on community charging. At the moment, it is just 5% VAT for people with a drive and 20% for people who charge their cars in the community. Not that I want the debate to go on much longer because I have a train to catch, but I have reservations about how community charging can be done. A lot of people I have spoken to say that chargers could probably be fitted into lamp posts. How will we do that on “Coronation Street”-type streets, where we are trying to discourage people from parking on pavements? Are people going to form a queue? Is there going to be a street brawl if someone has been parked next to a lamp post for a long time? I see chaos abounding if we do not get this right first time, so I welcome the Minister’s views on the matter.

[Trudy Harrison]

That point requires a longer debate; I would welcome the opportunity to talk more about it. In the first instance, I recommend that the hon. Member look at our recently published electric vehicle infrastructure strategy, because much of how we will do that is in there. We are also working with pioneers and inventors; in this country, we have shown time and again that we are up for the challenge. This is a nation of innovation that is abundant with engineers who find solutions to some of the grand challenges that we face. I have every confidence that we will find solutions to these difficulties. Some of that is set out in the electric vehicle infrastructure strategy.

We are working with organisations such as Motability to ensure that we have an inclusive revolution that works for everyone, everywhere. Through the initiatives I have described, it is clear that we are supporting local areas to drive forward the improvements they need, while moving towards a greener and more prosperous future. This Government are determined to create a great, green transport network that is available to everyone, everywhere, and that spreads opportunity and prosperity to all.

Once again, I thank the hon. Member for Sheffield South East for allowing me the opportunity to respond to this interesting debate, in which Members from across the House have demonstrated the importance of public—and, indeed, all—transport.

Draft Goods Vehicles (Licensing of Operators) (Amendment) Regulations 2022

Debate between Trudy Harrison and Gill Furniss

Monday 28th February 2022 General Committees

[Gill Furniss]

I absolutely agree with everything that my right hon. Friend said. If we are to get on the right path to our economy growing, we must do everything possible to encourage new people into the industry—and new start-up businesses, too. As I said earlier, it is just another example of a barrier put in the way of achieving what we would like. The extra £32.5 million announced to upgrade driver facilities is, of course, welcome, but it is just a drop in the ocean for fixing the problem.

Another area that the Government must get right, if these regulations are to be successful, is publicity. It is right that the new licences will be available to apply for from tomorrow, but three months is a tight timescale for operators to become compliant. I therefore ask the Minister what steps she is taking to contact operators and firms impacted by the changes to ensure that they know exactly what they need to do. That also includes the earlier issues referred to by the Minister, which I have asked for answers on.

Unfortunately, raising awareness of important changes has not been a priority for the Minister’s Department; when significant changes to the highway code were implemented earlier in the year, it waited until over two weeks after they were in force to launch a publicity campaign. The same mistakes cannot be repeated as these new rules come into force.

I will finish by once again paying tribute to HGV drivers, LGV drivers and everyone else in the logistics sector. Their work is vital but, all too often, they are under-appreciated. As operators adjust to the new regulations, the Government must work with the sector and trade unions to provide the tools they need to make the transition as smooth as possible. That is essential for the longevity of the sector, all the jobs it supports, and our wider economy.

[Trudy Harrison]

I will try to run through some of the shadow spokesperson’s questions. To start, the “technically legal” phrase is because that is exactly what it is. It was perfectly legal, but this is about the policy aim of the actual SI. It became apparent, regrettably after the SI was laid, that the policy aim and intention of the SI would not be met, hence the requirement for resubmission.

The public service vehicle implications are really about an operator’s ability, should there be a challenge to the transport manager’s—not the driver’s—way of working, to bring them in front of a hearing. The hon. Member asks about what will happen if that does not go to plan; it would be using case law, which is what is currently being used to set the precedent for doing just that. I hope that is clear. It is not about the technical legality of the SI, but purely its policy aim.

[Gill Furniss]

I am still not clear on what the Minister just said. Clearly, the SI that we are talking about now comes into force tomorrow. Organisations will be able to apply from tomorrow. As we said earlier, the Minister is hoping that the next SI will start before this one, so is she actually moving the date for the beginning of this one, or will she just go ahead tomorrow and wait for the next SI? Could the Minister clarify that for me?

[Trudy Harrison]

It actually comes into force on 15 March, but I am referring to the SI that we are re-laying because of the irregularity in the initial presentation, which was because of the matter that I referred to earlier. On who it will affect, the hon. Member referred to a number of instances around how it would affect heavy goods vehicle drivers. Just to be clear, a heavy goods vehicle is over 3.5 tonnes. The measure is specifically for vehicles—including their trailers, potentially—between 2.5 tonnes and 3.5 tonnes; it is for light goods vehicles.

On what we are doing for heavy goods vehicle improvements for drivers, we have put 32 interventions in place, which have been really successful. We have seen a fabulous pick-up of people coming into the sector.

Some £32 million has been invested in infrastructure, including in truck stops and other measures to improve the wellbeing and welfare of the freight and logistics industry, which is about more than just truck drivers, and I will talk more about that throughout the next year, when we will be promoting work, jobs and careers in the industry. I had the joy of meeting some apprentices working in the freight and logistics sector during the Department for Education’s national apprenticeship week. The number of opportunities in the sector is vast, and we will be doing more to promote those opportunities over the coming months.

This measure falls below the de minimis level of £5 million, so an impact assessment was not required. The other aspect that is having an impact on our ability to recruit people into the sector is the boot camps, which we are working on with the Department for Education and which have been really successful.

I hope the shadow Minister will agree that we are taking tremendous steps forward to improve the recruitment and retention of people in the freight and logistics sector. This is a small, specific measure that will ensure that our relations with the EU can continue and UK drivers can continue to work in the EU without restrictions, which would be incredibly damaging to such a vital sector.

[Gill Furniss]

I am afraid that I cannot agree completely with the Minister. I agree to a degree about the things that the Government have put in place to recruit more drivers but, as I said earlier, £32 million is not a lot of money when we look at the infrastructure within which the drivers now have to work. There are other issues, about which I am sure the Minister is aware, including planning taking such a long time to get a better, newer way of ensuring that all the drivers have a dignified way of life while they are working and delivering things to our tables.

As my right hon. Friend the Member for Warley said earlier about the cost of insurance, I would like to see the Minister put forward a package of measures that will make a significant difference in the short term, not in the long term. We need proper action to do that. During the pandemic, these lorry drivers saved our bacon as well as delivering it. They were the unsung heroes who were out and about every day, travelling all over the continent and back to ensure our shelves were filled and that all things medical were delivered as well. Surely we owe them that thank-you to provide them with proper resources and Government support for them to do their jobs properly and with dignity.

[Trudy Harrison]

The shadow Minister and I agree on the value that is placed on the freight and logistics sector. That is exactly why we want to ensure that these regulations are in place to support this vital sector and the transport managers who will become an essential part of light goods vehicle transportation.

These changes are modest in scope and we have, in general, applied them to the minimum extent possible. With that in mind, I commend the regulations to the House.

Question put and agreed to.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Trudy Harrison and Gill Furniss

Thursday 3rd February 2022 Commons Chamber

[Gill Furniss (Sheffield, Brightside and Hillsborough) (Lab)]

Last year, the Chancellor told people to enjoy National Pothole Day before the potholes were all gone. He then slashed the road maintenance budget by £400 million—enough to fix millions of potholes. Thanks to those broken promises, the roads Minister’s own community has become the pothole capital of England. The Government talk about levelling up, but in reality they cannot even level up the surfaces of our roads. When will the Minister get a grip, reverse these broken promises and deliver the funding that communities need to sort out the mess on our roads?

[Trudy Harrison]

Actually, at the spending review, the Government announced £2.7 billion over the next three years for local road maintenance in places not receiving those city region settlements, which is enough to fill in millions of potholes a year, repair dozens of bridges and resurface thousands of miles of road. The three-year settlement will help local authorities plan effectively for managing their highway assets, tackling those potholes and other road defects across local road networks.