Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Stephen Crabb and Huw Irranca-Davies

Wednesday 24th February 2016 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Crabb]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. First, though, let me put on record our congratulations to him and his wife, Clare, as it is a few days after the birth of their second child. It is wonderful to see him taking a break from paternity leave to stand here today championing the interests of his constituents in Cardiff. He is absolutely right on two counts. The first is on the success of bringing the Aston Martin deal to Wales, which is a great example of the Welsh and the UK Governments working together in a true team Wales approach. The second is on the importance of business and the fact that it is right at the heart not just of helping to create the city deal vision, but of delivering it as well.

[Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab)]

Let me pass on my congratulations to the hon. Member for Cardiff North (Craig Williams). I also congratulate the workforce in the St Athan area—in the seat of the Under-Secretary of State for Wales, the hon. Member for Vale of Glamorgan (Alun Cairns)—and the Welsh Labour Government on their support for that project, the Cardiff city deal and the Swansea city deal. Will the Secretary of State confirm that the support will be there for Cardiff and for the proposal by Terry Matthews for an “internet coast” that links Swansea and west Wales as well, as that is where we will drive the jobs into Wales?

[Stephen Crabb]

The hon. Gentleman has raised a number of different initiatives all together in one question. The common thread running through them was the nature of partnership working, and we need to see more of that. I am talking about the Welsh Government, the UK Government and local partners all working together. The Aston Martin deal shows the fruit that can be borne when we have the right kind of attitude and commitment from the Prime Minister, the First Minister, the Ministry of Defence and excellent local MPs such as the Under-Secretary of State for Wales. I have discussed the Swansea city deal with Sir Terry Matthews. We are really interested in understanding it in a bit more detail, and we want to work with the Swansea city deal partners as well as our partners in Cardiff.

Draft Wales Bill (Morning sitting)

Debate between Stephen Crabb and Huw Irranca-Davies

Wednesday 3rd February 2016 General Committees

[Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab)]

rose—

[Stephen Crabb]

I will give way to the hon. Gentleman who is shortly to be a Member of the Assembly.

[Huw Irranca-Davies]

Indeed, I have a vested interest in this in more ways than one. The Secretary of State is trying valiantly to play a very difficult hand, but I suspect he is running out of cards. How does he respond to this week’s report that highlighted in depth, with detailed analysis, both fundamental and detailed points of principle that were wrong? The conclusion was that that suggests an unwillingness to take Wales seriously. I ask him, in all seriousness, how he responds to that.

[Stephen Crabb]

I respond to the hon. Gentleman by saying, in all seriousness, that this Government take Wales very seriously. We take Wales so seriously that we did not do what his Administration did, when he was a Minister in the previous Labour Government, and bury our heads in the sand over the inequities of the Barnett formula. They have admitted that they were unwilling to address that issue. We are bringing forward the funding floor. This Government took the decision to have a referendum for the people of Wales on having full law-making powers.

[Huw Irranca-Davies]

This Bill does not do it.

[Stephen Crabb]

In the details of the report that came out today, and in other academic reports, there are some good and important points. We have taken the report away and are looking at it very closely. The whole point of having pre-legislative scrutiny is to use it as an opportunity to think again and take views from a very broad range of stakeholders.

I have to say, having read some of the evidence presented to the Welsh Affairs Committee and to the Welsh Assembly’s Committee, sometimes the people giving that evidence are asking a different question from the question we are asking. The question they are asking is, “How do we craft a piece of legislation that expands the remit of Welsh government and Welsh law-making?” If that is your only question, of course you will find failings and limitations in the Bill. If you are trying to balance that question with the question of how to regulate the interface between the two legitimate Governments for Wales: the UK Government and the Welsh Government—how to ensure clarity about who is responsible for what, how to build in respect for the devolution settlement so that we do not get Governments crossing over one another’s boundaries, changing each other’s functions without a clear consenting process in place—then you cannot avoid coming up with some of the procedures and mechanisms in the Bill.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Stephen Crabb and Huw Irranca-Davies

Wednesday 13th January 2016 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

Last but not least, I call the Chair of the Environmental Audit Committee.

[Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab)]

Swansea bay tidal lagoon and the other potential lagoons that may result from it provide amazing opportunities for exports of intellectual property, technology and supply chains across south Wales. Will the Secretary of State at least commit to making it happen and doing it as soon as possible?

[Stephen Crabb]

I repeat the answer I gave to the hon. Gentleman’s colleague. We recognise that this is a potentially very exciting and significant project, in delivering low-carbon renewable energy over a long period. We need to look carefully at the finances to ensure that it delivers value for taxpayers, who will be asked to put a large amount of subsidy into the project.

Government Policies (Wales)

Debate between Stephen Crabb and Huw Irranca-Davies

Wednesday 26th November 2014 Commons Chamber

[The Secretary of State for Wales (Stephen Crabb)]

I am delighted to follow the shadow Secretary of State for Wales and to have the opportunity to talk about the record of the UK Government in Wales. I notice that the Opposition changed their minds on the original motion that they sought to table. I believe it was originally entitled “The disastrous effect of Government policies on Wales”. It seems that they no longer believe that to be the case, and quite right too. We are winning the argument and we have not even begun our speeches yet.

We have to ask ourselves why, at this precise moment, the Opposition have tabled such a ludicrous motion and are trying to talk down the Welsh economy and present a black caricature of what is happening inside the Welsh economy when last week was such a successful week for Wales. On Friday, the Prime Minister, Labour’s own First Minister of Wales, business leaders and journalists stood together at Celtic Manor for the UK Investment Summit, rallying together to bang the drum for the huge strides made in the Welsh economy in recent years. Why would Labour choose to have such a debate at this time to talk down the efforts we are all making to secure new investment and new job creation in Wales?

[Huw Irranca-Davies]

I would applaud any jobs created in my constituency, but I will tell the Secretary of State why we are having this debate today. A guy came into my surgery two weeks ago and showed me his payslip. It was disgraceful. An umbrella company was taking more than £50 from him to contribute to its—the company’s—employer’s national insurance contribution, and deducting £35 as a contribution to his own annual leave. According to HMRC he was employed by the company. Does the Secretary of State condone or condemn such companies?

--- Later in debate ---

[Stephen Crabb]

I condone companies that invest in Wales and create jobs, which is the most important thing in driving up wages. Let us be clear about this on both sides of the House: we acknowledge and recognise that wages are not where we would like them to be in Wales. We want to see real wages going up in Wales. The best hope for workers in Wales to see real increases in wages is more job competition: the creation of more and higher quality jobs. That was exactly the purpose of last week’s investment summit. Welsh Labour Members really need to make up their minds. They say one thing at this end of the M4, but back down the road in Cardiff they say another thing about what is going on inside the Welsh economy. They need to make up their minds on whether they back Welsh business or not.

[Huw Irranca-Davies]

The Secretary of State is making a strong and forceful case. Will he argue as strongly and as forcefully for the groups of construction workers in my constituency who are now up to £100 worse off, for the youngsters who are at the beck and call of employers on zero-hours contracts with no continuity and no certainty of employment, and the people working in two part-time jobs because they cannot get one full-time job? Would he say that they are benefiting from the economy in the same way?

[Stephen Crabb]

We feel equally offended by the abuses in the workplace that the hon. Gentleman describes. The record of the coalition Government is actually very positive: increasing penalties for companies that do not pay the minimum wage properly, and consulting on the abuse of zero-hours contracts and taking action.

--- Later in debate ---

[Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab)]

I am delighted to follow that excellent contribution by my good friend the Member for Ynys Môn (Albert Owen), which struck the right balance between the necessary optimism and the vision we have for a better future and the real challenges.

It has been a passionate debate and I have been as passionate as many with my interventions, but I want to say first that when I speak for my constituents, I speak for all of them. Many of them are in small businesses and micro-businesses—one man or one woman operations that they intend to build up slowly. They drive the economy locally. I also speak, however, for people who work within the set-up of Raspberry Pi down at the old Sony site at Pencoed in my constituency, and who have reinvented a way to take computers forward, so that everybody can pull them apart and put them back together, and use them in schools and for developing nations, and have different applications for them. They are helping our trade balance, and that is a fantastic story, as is the story of Ford Bridgend in the neighbouring constituency represented by my hon. Friend the Member for Bridgend (Mrs Moon). Ford consistently employs and invests in that plant, and takes on many apprentices.

[Stephen Crabb]

I am pleased that the hon. Gentleman has mentioned the case study of Raspberry Pi. Does he agree that this is a great example of what we now call reshoring? It has brought back the manufacturing of this product from China to the UK, helping the trade balance. It is a great example of what we mean by rebalancing the economy.

[Huw Irranca-Davies]

I agree. It is an astonishing story, showing how sometimes the coincidence of business and political networks meeting happens, so that an offhand conversation can lead to a company thinking, “Well, why do we have to be out in the far corners of the world? Why don’t we come back here? We have a skilled work force.” Sony Bridgend, which has had difficult times over the past couple of decades, has re-engineered itself as a national award-winning centre of design in manufacturing and production, and that is what attracted the company back. It has been a huge, rip-roaring success, and there are another 20-odd companies on that site that we hope will build up as well.

That is all good, and I welcome every instance of the claimant count dropping, but we also have to look at the other side of the story. As parliamentarians, no matter what seat we represent, we have to look at the kind of jobs that those individuals are going into. As my hon. Friend the Member for Ynys Môn said, we need to ask whether they can get credit or a mortgage. Can they think seriously about setting up a home for a family and a future? Can they rent somewhere?

I am sure that Members on the Government Benches know in their heart of hearts that behind the claimant count drop there are a lot of people who want to be paid a bit more, who want to work a few more hours and who want the certainty of a permanent contract with the protection that any decent employer would surely want to give to a decent worker. That does not involve loading burdens on an employer. Government Members often tell us that we know nothing about this, but I can tell them that I have managed businesses in the public and private sectors. I understand the challenges of balancing a business plan and bringing in the bottom line, but that has to involve treating the workers decently as well.

We cannot achieve this overnight. This is not just a case of extolling the virtues of business and job creation; let us also talk about the quality of those jobs. Let us take businesses, large and small, by the hand and ask what more we can do to lift people up by giving them skills, education and training, a decent wage and decent terms and conditions. That involves making an investment in the worker as well as in the plant. There are many good companies out there. I am trying to avoid using a soundbite, but this is a reflection of the reality in my constituency: it has an M4 catchment. We can travel down into what is still a very good manufacturing centre along the M4. Thanks to Labour’s investment over the years, people can also get on a train in Maesteg—now at a lower price than a couple of years ago, thank goodness—and travel to work in Cardiff or Newport.

Let us take as an example a youngster who has to get a minimum wage job. Getting to work could mean spending £5 a day on a ticket or driving in a clapped-out car that will cost them 50 or 60 quid a week. When they ask me whether it is worth going out to work, I will say, “Of course it’s worth it. It is always worth going out to work, because of all the good things that come from being a valued member of a work force.” I want those people to be valued. I want them to be paid decently. This debate has sometimes seemed polarised, but this is not a question of me, as the MP for Ogmore, standing here and saying that all businesses are horrible. They are not; they create the jobs. We can put some of the framework in place and make it easier for them to create the jobs, but it is the businesses themselves that create and drive those jobs, and the people in those jobs need to be treated decently.

It is not all doom and gloom in my constituency, but when I first became an MP, there was one food bank there. Now, there is not a single village without a food bank. Last week, I went to the setting up of a Christians Against Poverty debt advice centre. We already have a citizens advice bureau, as well as debt advice being given by Valleys to Coast. We have had a tenfold increase in the number of people in work who are taking out payday loans.

Yes, let us welcome job creation, but let us also be honest about what we want out of those jobs. I do not want anyone to be forced into taking two or even three low-paid jobs. They should be able to find an employer who will pay them decently to do a job with good terms and conditions and who will value their contribution. I do not want youngsters or people close to retirement to be told that their only option is a job in retail with no guaranteed hours. I do not want them to be told, “We may or may not call you but, my God, if we do, you’d better come in because if you don’t, there are half a dozen other people who will do the job instead.” I do not want that. It is not a good way to drive an economy.

Let us have some frankness in the debate. If we can say that we want job creation but we also want them to be good jobs, we will have done a good job for our constituents. That, by the way, means tackling one of the biggest scandals that I have come across recently. There has been a massive change since March or April this year, with HMRC’s new rules and its approach to umbrella companies in construction. Constituents are coming into my office, skilled, long experienced construction workers, who are £100 a week worse off. It is there in their pay slips and it is legal. It is due to subcontracting out beyond the original contractor to umbrella companies, which deduct payments from those workers. If one thing comes out of today’s debate, I hope it is that the Minister will condemn that practice and undertake to destroy it.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Stephen Crabb and Huw Irranca-Davies

Wednesday 22nd October 2014 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Crabb]

Being part of Europe is important for Wales-based manufacturers—there is no question about that—but when I talk to businesses all across Wales, they also tell me that our current membership of the European Union imposes burdens and costs. That is why they support the Prime Minister’s strategy to renegotiate our membership with the European Union and get a better deal for Welsh and UK business.

[Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab)]

6. What recent discussions he has had with Ministers in the Welsh Government on improvements to the rail network in south Wales.

[The Secretary of State for Wales (Stephen Crabb)]

Electrification of the great western main line to Swansea and the valley lines is a transformational project that would deliver a much needed boost to the Wales economy. I am determined to find a way forward for this important scheme, and I am leading discussions with Cabinet colleagues and Welsh Government Ministers to secure this vital investment for Wales.

[Huw Irranca-Davies]

I thank the Minister for that answer. He might not be aware that the two lines with the greatest passenger growth into Cardiff in the past couple of years have been the Chepstow to Cardiff and the Maesteg to Cardiff lines, which have far outstripped other valley lines. Is he surprised to know that there is no Sunday service on the Maesteg line for people who want to get to work or to get into our capital city? Will he discuss this with Arriva Trains Wales?

[Stephen Crabb]

I was aware of that point, and I want to raise that issue with Arriva Trains Wales. The growth in usage of the valley lines is one of the reasons why we need to press ahead and create new capacity and make improvements to all the valley lines.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Stephen Crabb and Huw Irranca-Davies

Wednesday 9th July 2014 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Crabb]

Jobs Growth Wales makes a contribution, and I am not going to knock anything that helps young people in our constituencies to get on the employment ladder. I am concerned, however, that the Welsh Government are still refusing to allow people on the Work programme to access the additional help of Jobs Growth Wales. We need to see the Welsh Government make more progress on tackling that.

[Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab)]

14. Agriculture is a significant employment sector in Wales, and many people, including the Farmers Union of Wales, wanted the Agricultural Wages Board to be protected. Will the Minister say why he has twice challenged it in the High Court and in the Supreme Court, and how much that has cost the public and the taxpayer?

[Stephen Crabb]

The hon. Gentleman knows full well that the devolution settlement is a complicated one, and that it was entirely right for the UK Government to seek clarity from the Supreme Court on this issue. We welcome the fact that the Supreme Court has given its ruling and provided the clarification we needed.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Stephen Crabb and Huw Irranca-Davies

Wednesday 8th January 2014 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Crabb]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his question. I am very aware of the important work being done at Glyndwr university, and we are in close touch with the university about its work. On what we can do to mitigate the job impact in Wrexham, I encourage both him and his hon. Friend the Member for Wrexham (Ian Lucas) to give full-throated support to the £250 million that the Government are putting into Wrexham to create a new prison—something for which we have yet to hear full support from Opposition Members.

[Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab)]

Labour has called consistently for the devolution of energy consents for projects of up to 100 MW. I pay tribute to my hon. Friend the Member for Ynys Môn (Albert Owen) for the amendment, which was not supported by the Government, that he tabled to the Energy Bill. Why are the Government opposed to the devolution of energy, which would allow the Welsh Government and the National Assembly for Wales to make their own decisions on energy and renewable energy in particular?

[Stephen Crabb]

I am surprised by the hon. Gentleman’s question, because there has been nothing consistent about Labour’s approach to energy policy either in government or in opposition.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Stephen Crabb and Huw Irranca-Davies

Wednesday 20th November 2013 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Crabb]

I thank my hon. Friend for that question. We are very aware of the issue. A discussion is taking place with officials and colleagues at DECC. They are in contact with the trade body for the developers of such projects, and I hope a solution will be found soon.

[Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab)]

2. What assessment he has made of the effect of recent increases in the cost of energy bills on living standards in Wales.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Wales (Stephen Crabb)]

The recent price increases announced by the big six are unwelcome, especially at this time, which is why we are legislating to force energy companies to put people on the lowest tariff that meets their preference. We are also helping to keep bills lower by increasing competition in the market and opening up the marketplace for new independent suppliers to challenge the dominance of the big six.

[Huw Irranca-Davies]

Last week a friend of mine who works with elderly residents in Ogmore visited four elderly residents in one day. All four would not put on their heating because they were frightened of the effect on them of rising fuel prices. They sat in the cold. Yesterday, it snowed in Ogmore. Is not this the time to call for a freeze on prices so that elderly people are not afraid that they will freeze in their homes?

[Stephen Crabb]

As I said, the increases in bills are unwelcome at this time and we all know from our communities the pressures that puts on vulnerable households, but I would say to the hon. Gentleman that, on the slogan of a price freeze for energy, the Leader of the Opposition knows full well that that is not deliverable. We know from Labour’s track record in government that it was intensely relaxed about gas prices doubling, electricity prices going up by more than 50% and increasing fuel tax 12 times. It was too relaxed and complacent.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Stephen Crabb and Huw Irranca-Davies

Wednesday 15th May 2013 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Crabb]

My hon. Friend is also right. Dr Andrew Wakefield’s research has been discredited not just in this country, but by medical and scientific opinion throughout the world. There is no reason for parents to feel alarmed about the MMR vaccine, and there is plenty of dispassionate advice for them if they have concerns or questions. They should crack on now and get their children vaccinated.

[Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab)]

Will the Minister commend the work of local authorities such as Bridgend working hand in hand with the Abertawe Bro Morgannwg university health board and running drop-in clinics in every school in the constituency? Does he agree with me, a father of three teenage boys, that the very best protection against this disease is for everyone not to be afraid and to turn up to these clinics and get all their children vaccinated against this terrible disease?

[Stephen Crabb]

The hon. Gentleman is exactly right as well. The response from public officials in Wales at all levels—Welsh Government, local authorities and within Public Health Wales—has been exemplary. They have done everything right so far, but we need to get the message out to the communities affected that parents with children not yet vaccinated urgently need to get them vaccinated.