European Union (Withdrawal) (No. 2) Act 2019 (Rule of Law)

John Bercow Excerpts

Monday 9th September 2019 Commons Chamber

Emergency debate (Standing Order No. 24)

[Mr Speaker]

We now come to the motion in the name of the Leader of the Opposition, to be moved under Standing Order No. 24. I remind the House, although I am sure that colleagues are keenly conscious of every word of it, that the motion is

“That this House has considered the welcome completion of all parliamentary stages of the European Union (Withdrawal) (No. 6) Bill and has considered the matter of the importance of the rule of law and Ministers’ obligation to comply with the law.”

I call the Leader of the Opposition to move the motion.

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[Jeremy Corbyn]

No, I will not give way. I have made that clear already.

In her resignation letter, the right hon. Member for Hastings and Rye said the Prime Minister had committed an

“assault on democracy and decency”.

I would go further: the Prime Minister is also threatening an assault on the rule of law. He was asked on Friday whether he would abide by the provisions of the European Union (Withdrawal) (No.6) Bill, as it then was, and said he would rather die in a ditch. I do not wish him any ill. I do, however, wish that he would come to the Dispatch Box, set out his detailed plan for Brexit and confirm that he will abide by the law. More than that, the people of this country deserve, and democracy demands, up-front answers from the Prime Minister. So far, no answers have been forthcoming.

I hope the Prime Minister will live up to the office he holds, accept the decisions made by this Parliament, and carry out the wishes of the Act to ensure an application is made to prevent this country crashing out on 31 October, with all the damage that will do to food supplies, medicine supplies, and industrial supplies, and prevent his longer-term ambitions of heading this country in a totally different direction which many, many people are truly frightened of. The Prime Minister could sort this out very quickly if he just had the courtesy to come to the House and confirm he will accept all the provisions of the Act the House has just passed.

[Mr Speaker]

I seek a right hon. or hon. Member on the Government Benches, but it is not immediately obvious that any wishes to contribute. [Laughter.] I do not see why that is a source of such hilarity; I am just making a rather prosaic, factual observation. [Interruption.] Order. Who was that chuntering from a sedentary position?

[Anna Soubry (Broxtowe) (IGC)]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. Is this in order? I think we all want to know who is going to reply for the Government. If it is the Foreign Secretary, many of us will find that surprising. Given the content of the motion, which is all about the rule of law, why is one of Her Majesty’s Law Officers, either the Secretary of State for Justice or the Attorney General, not replying on behalf of Her Majesty’s Government? Mr Speaker, I appreciate that you cannot answer on behalf of the Government, as much as I suppose you would like to, but this is a very serious matter, and a Law Officer should be answering the arguments being put forward in this debate.

[Mr Speaker]

The right hon. Lady may be flummoxed or irked to discover that the Government do not notify me of their intentions in relation to who might or might not speak. Unless there is a note that lists that, I do not have any intelligence on the matter. I am advised that the Foreign Secretary intends to wind up the debate for the Government. It is open to him, fleet of foot and intellectually dextrous as he is, to leap to his feet and deliver his oration now in substitution for the opportunity later, but he is not under any obligation to do so. [Interruption.] It appears that he does not wish to do so. However, Mr Peter Bone apparently does wish to speak. I call Mr Peter Bone.

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[Several hon. Members rose—]

[Mr Speaker]

I called Mr Austin earlier and then he was disappointed, so I feel some compassion towards the hon. Gentleman. I call Mr Ian Austin.

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[Mrs Main]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. We are having great difficulty hearing the hon. Gentleman, who is making a powerful speech, because he is being barracked.

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I do not wish to be unkind to the hon. Lady, but she is not entirely averse to making loud noises from a sedentary position, so although I appreciate her important contribution on this, I think I will make the judgment myself, if she doesn’t mind. I am deeply obliged to her.

[Ian Austin]

The more Labour Members interrupt, the longer it will take: I am going to make these points. The reason I have not moved is that I did not leave the Labour party to join another party; I left the Labour party to shine a spotlight on the disgrace it has become under the Leader of the Opposition’s leadership and because I regard myself as proper, decent, traditional Labour, not like the extremists who have taken over this party and are dragging it into the mud. That is the point I am going to make in this debate.

These are people—the Leader of the Opposition, the shadow Chancellor—who have spent their entire time in politics working with and defending all sorts of extremists, and in some cases terrorists and antisemites. We should remember what these people said about the IRA. It might be ancient history to the Labour party’s new young recruits, but many people will never forget how they supported terrorists responsible for horrific carnage in a brutal civil war that saw people blown up in pubs and hotels and shopping centres.

A few weeks after the IRA blew up a hotel in Brighton—murdered five people at the Tory party conference—the Leader of the Opposition invited two suspected IRA terrorists to Parliament, and when the man responsible for planting that bomb was put on trial he protested outside the court. The shadow Chancellor said that

“those people involved in the armed struggle”

—people he said had used “bombs and bullets”—

should be honoured. And they have the brass neck to lecture anybody about the rule of law; what a disgrace.

[Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. I understand that this debate is about whether the Prime Minister obeys the rule of law, not whether Members talked to people who allegedly have broken the law; it is about whether we deliver the rule of law.

[Mr Speaker]

I am extremely grateful to the hon. Gentleman, and his antennae are keenly attuned to the debate. There is a fine dividing line, and the hon. Member for Dudley North (Ian Austin) is dilating on the broad theme of disregard, bordering on contempt, for the law. If I think he has elided into a wholly different subject then I will always profit by the counsels of the hon. Member for Swansea West (Geraint Davies), but for now the hon. Member for Dudley North is all right—just. But I do warn him that I hope his speech tonight is, given that many others wish to contribute, not going to be as long as the speeches he used to deliver at the students union at the University of Essex 36 years ago, when we jousted together; it needs to be shorter.

[Ian Austin]

Well, Mr Speaker, my speeches then were a lot shorter than yours.

[Mr Speaker]

That may be, but what I would say to the hon. Gentleman is that, by common consent, mine were considerably better.

[Ian Austin]

I am not going to argue that point, Mr Speaker.

This is a debate about whether politicians can be trusted to obey the rule of law, and there is not a single Labour figure in the past—not a single one—who would have backed violent street protest, as the shadow Chancellor did when he called for “insurrection” to “bring down” the Government or praised rioters who he said had “kicked the s-h-i-t” out of the Conservative party’s offices. [Interruption.] The hon. Member for Heywood and Middleton (Liz McInnes) might not want to hear it, but I will tell her this—

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[Dominic Raab]

I am going to make a bit of progress, because we are coming to the close.

In her contribution, the leader of the Liberal Democrats made the case for a second referendum, but she has also said that if people voted to leave for a second time, she would just ignore the result again. I want a deal, and this Prime Minister and this Government want a deal. I believe it would be much better than no deal. But much, much worse than no deal would be to destroy confidence in the most basic democratic principle we have: that politicians respect what the people vote for. That argument was powerfully made by my hon. Friend the Member for Mid Dorset and North Poole (Michael Tomlinson).

The country wants this mess sorted out by 31 October, but the House wants to delay again. In those circumstances, the proper way to proceed is for this House to allow the voters to decide in an election who goes over to negotiate at the European Council on 17 October—the Prime Minister or the Leader of the Opposition. That is constitutionally the correct course of action. Given the position we have arrived at, it is plain common sense. What is the right hon. Gentleman afraid of? Just last Monday, the leader of the Labour party said:

“A general election is the democratic way forward.”

This is on Labour leaflets that have been delivered just this weekend, up and down the country. Just so that we are clear on this, I will read out the direct quote, so that we get it right. The leaflets said:

“We need a General Election now”.

What happened to all that bluff and bluster between the printing of the leaflets and their delivery just two days ago? The public will draw their own conclusions if the right hon. Gentleman’s actions conflict so starkly with his words. They will draw the inescapable conclusion that he does not trust the voters and he does not believe that they would trust him.

In those circumstances, if the House will not take the necessary decision, and if the right hon. Gentleman will not do the right thing, it risks further undermining respect not only for the Labour party but for Parliament. If that is the case, the Prime Minister will go to Brussels on 17 October, but let us be clear that he will not go to negotiate a delay; he will go to negotiate our departure from the EU on 31 October with or without a deal.

I urge the House to vote today not for more deadlock and delay, but for the only course of action that will break this deadlock, restore public confidence in our democracy and allow this country to move forward.

[Mr Speaker]

To wind up the debate, as it is in his name, I call the right hon. Gentleman, Mr Jeremy Corbyn.

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[Mr Nicholas Brown (Newcastle upon Tyne East) (Lab)]

claimed to move the closure (Standing Order No. 36).

Question put forthwith, That the Question be now put.

Question agreed to.

Main Question put accordingly.

Resolved,

That this House has considered the welcome completion of all parliamentary stages of the European Union (Withdrawal) (No. 6) Bill and has considered the matter of the importance of the rule of law and Ministers’ obligation to comply with the law.

[Mr Speaker]

Order. There is quite a lot of noisy chuntering from a sedentary position. The hon. Member for Mid Bedfordshire (Ms Dorries) is quite beside herself in an extraordinarily irate condition, which I feel sure will not endure for very long.

I was trying to explain to our French counterparts at the weekend the significance of the term “chuntering from a sedentary position”. They were beginning to understand it, but I would have to reinterpret it tonight as yelling from a sedentary position to which, apparently, there is no equal in the Assemblée Nationale.

I was going to call on the Minister to move the Northern Ireland (Executive Formation etc) Act 2019 Section 3(2) motion, but I am underestimating the exalted status of the right hon. Gentleman who graces the Dispatch Box. The motion is indeed to be moved by no less a figure in our affairs than the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland.