Powers of Attorney Bill

Debate between Simon Baynes and Stephen Metcalfe

3rd reading
Friday 17th March 2023 Commons Chamber

[Simon Baynes]

I think it is for the Minister to comment on that point, and I would not wish to tread upon his territory. However, from what I saw when I held the position, I am sure that the OPG is chasing the backlog with the greatest efficiency it can muster. One problem, which goes to the heart of the Bill, is that when people work from home, as they did at the OPG during covid, a paper-based system creates huge delay and problems. People can work on a digital system on their laptop at home, whereas with a paper-based system they really need to be in the office. The delay is perfectly fair and understandable in the light of the covid pandemic, which had a particularly acute effect in this case.

[Stephen Metcalfe]

I should apologise for not mentioning my hon. Friend in my speech, because I am very grateful for his help and support with my early work on the Bill last summer. I was very impressed by the knowledge and experience that he had gained in such a short time.

When my hon. Friend was the Minister, was he as surprised as I was while researching the Bill by the sheer volume of paper with which the Office of the Public Guardian has to deal? The forms are cumbersome, with many pages, and the number of applications runs into thousands daily. With 11 tonnes of paper floating around, it is not surprising that there is a backlog. I hope that the Bill will not only help to alleviate that backlog, but prevent it from happening ever again.

[Simon Baynes]

I thank my hon. Friend for his intervention. Yes, I was surprised, but, as he said, it is a cumbersome paper document to fill in. Clearly, the necessity for lasting powers of attorney was increased by the covid pandemic. The fact that people were not able to see somebody in person exacerbated the situation. The forms are also not easy to fill in. The problem that the Office of the Public Guardian has, which is not its fault at all, is that if a form is not filled in correctly, it has to send it back again for changes to be made. Although we can say that that is just bureaucracy run wild, it is not at the end of the day, because this is a vital legal document. The care and support for vulnerable people that it provides means that this has to be done properly, so I fully agree with my hon. Friend.

The modernisation provides the opportunity to update the protections provided by the LPA to align with the new world and the ever-increasing move towards the use of digital technology. There are new opportunities to improve safeguards against fraud, abuse and undue pressure. At the same time, there is the opportunity to make the OPG more sustainable through increased efficiency, and make lasting powers of attorney more widely accessible through multiple channels of creation. Accessibility and safeguards are very important parts of that.

I have two other points to make, then I will call it a day. The consultation received 313 responses and the overall response to the proposals was positive. I am pleased that, as a result of the feedback, the Government feel confident that they can build a modernised LPA service. I take on board the point that some hon. Members have made that creating a new digital service can be quite complicated technologically. There are cases in which there is not a great precedent for that, but this is something that we need to do. Other systems have been created in local councils and central Government, so I am sure that it cannot be that difficult to do it. None the less, the retention of both a digital and paper channel is vital.

I wish to finish by referring to comments made by Stephanie Boyce, the president of the Law Society. My hon. Friend the Member for North West Norfolk (James Wild) also referred to her in his excellent speech earlier. She said:

“LPAs are arguably one of the most important legal documents that a person will make because they delegate such wide-reaching powers over their life.

The consequence of an attorney making a poor decision could be the loss of all their assets, being put into a care home against their current or past wishes, or even their premature death.

We welcome the MoJ’s commitment to improve the speed and accuracy of making an LPA, as well as to continue to provide a paper service. Many people—such as those in care homes or people with learning difficulties—will continue to need to make an LPA via a paper process.

We are pleased the Government is looking at proposals to improve support for those who will struggle with using digital channels, as more needs to be done to ensure the reforms do not negatively impact vulnerable, disabled or older people.”

That is clearly an authoritative voice in support of the Bill tabled by my hon. Friend the Member for South Basildon and East Thurrock and sums up very well how I and, I suspect, many other people here today feel about it.

In conclusion, I wish to thank my hon. Friend again and pay my respect to him for introducing the Bill and for improving the performance of LPAs to the benefit of many vulnerable people, across the whole of the United Kingdom, at a very difficult time in their lives.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Simon Baynes and Stephen Metcalfe

Tuesday 1st December 2020 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Metcalfe (South Basildon and East Thurrock) (Con)]

What steps his Department is taking to support self-employed people affected by the covid-19 outbreak.

[Simon Baynes (Clwyd South) (Con)]

What steps his Department is taking to support self-employed people affected by the covid-19 outbreak.