European Union (Withdrawal Agreement) Bill

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

2nd reading: House of Commons & Programme motion: House of Commons
Tuesday 22nd October 2019 Commons Chamber

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

[Mr Speaker]

I gently say to the right hon. Gentleman, who has already had an opportunity to question the Prime Minister, that I hope it is a point of order rather than a point of frustration.

[Sammy Wilson]

The Prime Minister has claimed to the House today that the agreement does not rule out the interpretation that he has given to the House, but paragraph 8 of article 13 states quite clearly that any

“subsequent agreement between the Union and the United Kingdom shall indicate the parts of this Protocol which it supersedes”

and that the EU will have a say in that. How then can he claim to the House that we have total freedom of decision making?

[Mr Speaker]

The right hon. Gentleman is an experienced denizen of the House. His point of order is a matter of consuming interest within the Chamber and beyond, but he is a cheeky chappie, because it is not a matter for adjudication by the Chair. He has made a point, in his own way and with considerable alacrity, to which the Prime Minister can respond if he wishes and not if he does not.

--- Later in debate ---

[Sammy Wilson]

I will not give way, because I have very little time.

That is the issue of sovereignty. Northern Ireland will be left as a semi-detached part of the United Kingdom. In the long run, of course, the whole focus of attention will move from Westminster to Dublin. Who will speak for us in Europe when these regulations come through? Who will speak for us in Europe when the customs rules are affecting us? It will not be the UK Government. Increasingly, the focus will be on the Dublin Government.

The second argument is that we can vote our way out of the arrangements. The mechanism for voting our way out of them is now a simple majority vote. I never thought that I would hear a Prime Minister who has insisted that we adhere to the rules of the Belfast agreement suddenly bring up its central premise in this way. The first issue that was addressed in the Belfast agreement was what kind of checks and balances should be in place to protect both communities when it come to the operation of the Assembly. The Belfast agreement said that, to give those protections and ensure that all sections of the community could participate and work together, arrangements would be put in place

“to ensure that key decisions are taken on a cross-community basis.”

There is no greater and no more divisive a decision than this issue of our relationship with the EU, yet the safety valve in the Belfast agreement has been taken away. The Prime Minister said, “Oh, it has been taken away because it is a reserved matter anyway.” These are not reserved matters. Indeed, the very reason why we have a whole section in the Bill about what the Northern Ireland Assembly can and cannot do is that they are devolved matters, yet on these devolved matters, and on this one issue in particular, the Government have agreed to take away the central principle of consent. That will do damage when it comes to the operation of the Assembly in future. We cannot be selective like that, and certainly not on an issue such as this.

I come now to the last issue. I nearly choked when the Prime Minister said, “Don’t worry about it, because all of these changes that will affect Northern Ireland will be light-touch. It is not really a boundary down the Irish sea; they are just light-touch regulations.” These light-touch regulations require firms to make declarations when they sell goods to another part of their own country and to pay duties for goods that come from a part of their own country, which incur costs. I would at least have had some respect had the Prime Minister said, “I have a deadline of 31 October. I have to get this round. I am therefore having to make concessions and, unfortunately, Northern Ireland is a concession, and you will understand that.” What I cannot take is a Prime Minister who thinks that I cannot read the agreement that has been published, and who thinks that I cannot see in that agreement what the impact on Northern Ireland will be—

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I am immensely grateful to the right hon. Gentleman.

In a bid to accommodate the maximum number of remaining colleagues, there will now be a four-minute limit on Back-Bench speeches with immediate effect. Interventions are part of debate, but I simply counsel colleagues to be sparing in them, because it will stop other people speaking.

Preparations for Leaving the EU

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Tuesday 8th October 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

A sentence, Mr Wilson?

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

The intransigence of the Irish Government and the EU has resulted in the comprehensive proposals put forward by the Prime Minister and the compromises that were required being rejected. In the light of that, will the Minister think again about his policy of not imposing duties on goods coming from the Irish Republic, in order to protect producers in Northern Ireland and put some pressure on the Irish Government to be realistic?

[Mr Speaker]

I think there were some semi-colons in there.

Situation in the Gulf

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Monday 22nd July 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

Oh, very good! The Foreign Secretary is not that bothered about straying out of lane; he is going from one region to the other. This is all very encouraging.

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

I thank the Foreign Secretary for his statement. I note that he said that while HMS Duncan has been despatched to the Gulf, it is there to take over from HMS Montrose—so we are still going to finish up with one destroyer covering 19,000 nautical miles and having to escort on average three vessels a day. Are we so bereft of naval power that we cannot send an additional ship to the area and have to rely on other European nations who have not divvied up so far, or has this decision been made so that we do not annoy the Iranians?

Bombardier

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Tuesday 7th May 2019 Commons Chamber

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

rose—

[Mr Speaker]

What a difficult choice—Strangford against East Antrim. I call Jim Shannon.

--- Later in debate ---

[Sammy Wilson]

I bet you wish you had chosen me the first time, Mr Speaker.

The people of Northern Ireland appreciate the political and financial commitments that Governments of all shades in this House have given over the years to keeping aircraft manufacturing alive in Northern Ireland. Bombardier’s lease was due to be renewed this year. When it was privatised, a peppercorn rent was made available for the site—it is a very land-intensive industry—which is a fraction of a per cent. of what the commercial rent would be. That could be a deal breaker when it comes to the sale of the site. What discussions has the Minister had, or will he have, with the Belfast Harbour Commissioners about setting a level of rent that ensures that operations can continue on the site?

[Mr Speaker]

The right hon. Gentleman was not to be outdone by his hon. Friend.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Wednesday 24th April 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

At the last count, I was aware of no fewer than 16 hon. and right hon. Members of the House intending to take part in the London marathon, including the Secretary of State for Wales and the hon. Member for Brentford and Isleworth (Ruth Cadbury), from whom we heard earlier, but who was too modest or self-effacing to mention her prospective involvement.

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

Q7. I do not think I could run the London marathon, Mr Speaker, so you need not include me in that. While the McKee family today bury their daughter, who was murdered by IRA terrorists, hundreds of people in Sri Lanka are burying their loved ones who were brutally murdered because of their faith. Christians across the world are now the most persecuted religious group, with nearly 300 million living in fear of discrimination and persecution, and 4,000 being killed every year because of their faith. The Government have said that Britain is on their side. How are the Government using the UK’s soft power, economic power, contacts with other Governments and aid budget to help those who are persecuted daily simply because they believe in Jesus Christ?

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Wednesday 5th September 2018 Commons Chamber

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

Collecting duties on trade across the border between Northern Ireland and the Irish Republic currently happens and does not present any problems. The real damage to Northern Ireland and to the integrity of the United Kingdom would be to have regulatory alignment between Northern Ireland and the Republic, giving the EU, rather than London, control over our laws in Northern Ireland. Will the Secretary of State give an assurance that in no circumstances will she agree to the backstop arrangement demanded by the EU, which would split the United Kingdom by having laws—

[Mr Speaker]

Order. We are immensely grateful, but that was far too long.

Taxation (Cross-border Trade) Bill

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

3rd reading: House of Commons & Report stage: House of Commons
Monday 16th July 2018 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

He has. We are grateful to him.

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

When we had the referendum result, and given the bitterness that existed during the referendum, I had absolutely no doubt that, despite the overwhelming vote, we were going to see guerrilla warfare conducted against the will of the people of the United Kingdom. We have seen it over the past year and a half—fall-outs in this place and fall-outs in TV studios, newspapers and so on. The amendments to this Bill fall into one of those two categories. People will give a whole variety of reasons, but, basically, they want to move amendments to this Bill to keep us in the institutions of the EU, which has bound us for so many years and from which people voted to be free. On the other side, there are those who wish to remain true to the vote of the people and make sure that everything is done to deliver on the promises that were made during the referendum.

Unfortunately, Northern Ireland, which has featured in nearly every speech here tonight, has been caught in the crossfire of that guerrilla warfare between those who wish to keep us in the EU and those who wish to honour the result of the referendum. The Northern Ireland border, the Good Friday agreement and the peace in Northern Ireland have been thrown around willy-nilly. To be quite frank, the people of Northern Ireland feel abused in this whole process. I have heard people in this place talk about the Belfast agreement as if it were their bedtime reading. They probably do not even know what the document looks like.

It has been suggested that if we do not abide by those who wish to keep us in the customs union and the single market, we will have a hard border in Northern Ireland, which will affect the peace. I do not know what this hard border will look like, but I can tell Members one thing: if they think that a couple of border posts along the main road at Newry, the main road into Londonderry and the main road into Enniskillen will represent a hard border that will somehow protect the EU from the incursion of goods that they do not want, then they do not even understand what it means. It could be that they think that a hard border means a minefield around the border with watchtowers so that no lorries can sneak across the 300 or so roads, or that people cannot build sheds in the middle of field where they put goods in one side in Northern Ireland and they come out the other side in the Irish Republic. It is a ridiculous suggestion, yet it is thrown at us all the time.

We heard the right hon. Member for Broxtowe (Anna Soubry) talk about the impact on the border and that the World Trade Organisation would insist on the provisions because it would have to protect trade. The Irish Republic currently brings in goods from the rest of the world. Does it stop every container that comes in? No, it does not. Does it stop 10% of the containers? No, it does not. It does not even stop 1%. In fact, Gambia stops more trade coming through its borders than the Irish Republic stops. The idea that, somehow or other, every good that comes into the EU via Northern Ireland and then the Republic will have to be stopped does not even match with common-day practice.

When it comes to collecting taxes, 13,000 lorries a year cross the border carrying drink to other parts of the United Kingdom. There is duty to be collected on that, but not one of them is stopped because the duty is collected electronically through pre-notification and trusted trader status. We can protect the border and meet WTO rules without having all the kinds of paraphernalia suggested here tonight.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Wednesday 20th June 2018 Commons Chamber

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

rose—

[Mr Speaker]

I am glad that the right hon. Member for East Antrim (Sammy Wilson) has overcome his natural shyness and self-effacement. It is not beyond the wit of the Chair to call two DUP Members on the same question, and I hope he is heartened by that declaration.

[Sammy Wilson]

The Chief Constable in Northern Ireland has expressed some concerns about cross-border security in today’s Belfast Telegraph. Will the Secretary of State give us some assurances about what discussions she has had with the Irish Government to allay the concerns that the Chief Constable has raised?

Offences Against the Person Act 1861

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Tuesday 5th June 2018 Commons Chamber

[Sammy Wilson]

Our solution is that since this is a devolved issue it will be decided by, and reflect the views of, the people of Northern Ireland. The shadow Scottish National party spokesman for Northern Ireland, the hon. Member for Edinburgh North and Leith (Deidre Brock), outlined it very well: there are reasons for devolving issues across the United Kingdom. Devolved Administrations are meant to reflect the views of the people in the areas that they represent, and I believe that the laws in Northern Ireland reflect the views of the people of Northern Ireland. That is why the Northern Ireland Assembly voted to maintain those laws.

Let me make a further point. This is why I am not embarrassed about the laws that we have, and why I do not believe that we have turned the clock back: as a result of not introducing the legislation that exists in the rest of the United Kingdom, thereby reflecting the views of the people of Northern Ireland, and of making both lives matter—that of the child and that of the parent—100,000 people are alive in Northern Ireland today who would otherwise have been killed before they were even born.

I know that that message is not liked—so much so, that the pro-abortion lobby tried to get the Advertising Standards Authority to challenge it, but it found that statistically that was a correct figure. We have people today in Northern Ireland who are rearing families, contributing to society, building their businesses, working in our factories, and sitting in our schools who otherwise, if we had had the legislation that exists in the rest of the United Kingdom, would have been discarded and put in a bin before they were ever born—[Interruption.] I have to say, that is one of the reasons why—[Interruption.] That is one of the reasons—[Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Order. This debate has so far been conducted with passion, but also with respect. The right hon. Gentleman must be heard, and whether he takes interventions is up to him. Please, I appeal to colleagues to respect each other.

Salisbury Incident

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Monday 12th March 2018 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Naturally, there is the most intense interest in this extraordinarily grave matter, and I am keen to accommodate colleagues. May I ask colleagues to help me to help each of them by confining themselves to pithy questions?

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

Does the Prime Minister agree that, in the face of yet further aggression from the Russian mafia state, the policy of the Leader of the Opposition of engaging in robust dialogue will only encourage Putin to engage in further acts of state-sponsored terror? Does she agree that in the national interest, and regardless of the cost to this country, the only effective answer is to take robust action against those who are using the UK as a battleground in which to carry out their own acts of assassination?

Points of Order

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Monday 8th January 2018 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman for his point of order. I think I am right in saying that it is open to him to require the attendance of the said witness. It would be prudent of him to be sure in his own mind that he has the support of his Committee in making any such direction or requirement. Moreover—I am sorry that these are muddy waters—giving effect to such a requirement if it is not adhered to would very likely require the approval of the House. This is therefore a matter that can take a little time, and it is not completely straightforward or immediate in terms of effect, but it is open to the right hon. Gentleman to persist. I note what he said about previous examples of the national security adviser appearing in front of the Defence Committee rather than in front of, or in addition to, other Committees, and that is certainly a powerful argument in his arsenal.

I know that sometimes Governments are inclined to invoke the Osmotherly rules as justification for saying that one official can and another official cannot appear in front of a Committee. My response to that, on behalf of Parliament, is to say that the Osmotherly rules are very much a Government creation. This House has never endorsed or recognised the Osmotherly rules. They are, perhaps, a matter of great importance in the minds of Ministers, and in particular, I fancy, in the minds of officials; they are not important in my mind at all.

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. The House has previously discussed the remarks of Toby Young. This weekend, the MP for West Tyrone celebrated the murder of 10 Protestants at Kingsmill by dancing around a shop with a loaf on his head with the name “Kingsmill” written on it. In doing so, he has caused outrage among all decent people in Northern Ireland. Can you give me some guidance as to what action can be taken by the authorities in this House to condemn and to draw this House’s attention to the obnoxious behaviour of the MP for West Tyrone, and what action can be taken to deal with him?

[Mr Speaker]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his point of order. I am advised that there has been a significant number of letters about this matter to the Parliamentary Commissioner for Standards. If that be so, matters will take their course in accordance with the judgment reached by the parliamentary commissioner. More widely, though I take extremely seriously what the hon. Gentleman has said, and I share his distaste—his utter distaste—for any celebration of deaths, it is only right to point out that the Chair and the parliamentary authorities to whom he referred have locus in relation to conduct in this place. Where the alleged miscreant is someone who has not taken his or her seat in this House, I think that inevitably somewhat different considerations must apply. That said, in so far as part of the objective of the hon. Gentleman in raising his point of order was to highlight what he regarded as atrocious and unacceptable behaviour, he might be thought, and might think so himself, to have succeeded in his mission.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Tuesday 12th December 2017 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

I am sure that Frome will roll out some sort of carpet for the hon. Gentleman.

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

Major banks have lent £630 billion to build new coal-powered stations across the world, many of them in our competitor countries. What assessment has the Minister made of the cost of electricity for the competitiveness of businesses in the UK and does he not recognise that our attempts to save the world while the rest of the world is gaily building power stations fuelled by coal only damage our economy?

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Monday 11th December 2017 Commons Chamber

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

rose—

[Mr Speaker]

It is always good if we can see a smiling Sammy at the end of questions.

[Sammy Wilson]

T-levels are being developed in England, but it is not clear whether they will be available in Northern Ireland. Even if they are, the regulatory body will be England-only and based here in England. That has the potential to disrupt higher education, routes to employment and the transferability of skills. Will the Secretary of State commit to working with Northern Ireland’s Department of Education and examination board to ensure that T-levels are made available in Northern Ireland?

[Mr Speaker]

I think that is the hon. Gentleman’s version of a one-sentence question.

Points of Order

Debate between Sammy Wilson and John Bercow

Wednesday 25th October 2017 Commons Chamber

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

rose—

[Mr Speaker]

Is the hon. Gentleman’s point of order on some other matter?

[Sammy Wilson]

On this matter—

[Mr Speaker]

Very well. We must hear the voice of Mr Sammy Wilson.

[Sammy Wilson]

Further to that point of order, Mr Speaker. It seems that different members of the Committee heard different things from the Secretary of State this morning, so would it not be better to wait until the record of the meeting has been published, as then it will be clear what the Secretary of State did say? I did not hear what these Members have alleged they have heard.

[Mr Speaker]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman. I know he always likes to be helpful to the Chair and to the House. He anticipates me, but he is right in doing so. There will be a transcript of the proceedings, and I rather imagine that, in conformity with the usual practice of the House and of our distinguished Committees, it will be published sooner rather than later. I know it will then be subject to the beady eyes of colleagues on both sides of the Chamber and on both sides, if I may put it that way, of the Brexit argument. They will read into it what they wish and pursue their cause as they choose.

What I would say to the hon. Member for Feltham and Heston (Seema Malhotra) is that if there is a material change in Government policy or intended practice on a very significant matter, it is customary that there should be a statement to the House. It would not always be an oral statement, but it might very well be an oral statement. The House knows very well that there are means by which to secure the attendance in the Chamber of a Minister if such a statement is not proffered. The position of the Chair is that the Chair does not seek to take sides on this matter. The Chair simply seeks to facilitate the expression of opinion. I would add that in addition to all the other debates we might have on these matters, there will in due course be legislation returning to the House, and it is a matter of public record that very large numbers of amendments have been tabled to the European Union (Withdrawal) Bill. At the Committee stage, the Chairman of Ways and Means will make a proper and judicious selection, based upon advice but deploying his own judgment, and at Report stage that responsibility will fall to me. I think Members know that I always will the fullest possible debate on the widest range of issues pertinent to a Bill, and so both sides of the argument can always feel that they have a friend in the Chair.