Sammy Wilson
Main Page: Sammy Wilson (Democratic Unionist Party - East Antrim)
Amber Rudd
I urge the hon. Lady to participate in the consultation we will be having shortly about the timing of the ending of coal. That would be an ideal opportunity for her to make her point on behalf of her constituents.
The historic agreement in Paris in December is a significant step forward towards reducing, on a global scale, the emissions that cause climate change. For the first time, nearly 200 countries have made a commitment to act together and to be held accountable. This agreement will help protect not just our environment, but our national and economic security.
Our national progress has been good to date, with greenhouse gas emissions down around 30% since 1990. Between 2010 and 2014 the UK’s greenhouse gas emissions fell by 15%, one of the biggest reductions in a single Parliament. Indeed, in 2014 we saw a reduction of 8%, the largest reduction measured in a single year. That is a fantastic achievement against the backdrop of an economy that grew at 2.9%. In June we will be setting the fifth carbon budget covering 2028 to 2032 and by the end of the year we will publish our new emissions reduction plan, on which we are already working with colleagues across Whitehall.
The emissions reduction plan will provide full details of our policy approach, but we already know where we will need to take more action: energy efficiency; a long-term framework for heat; emissions reduction in the industrial sector; and, of course, in transport, where progress has been slow. In all these areas we will need new thinking and we will work with academia and business to develop proper long-term plans.
Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)
Not being one who is too concerned about CO2, may I ask whether the Secretary of State can tell us how much of the reduction in our CO2 emissions is due to the fact that we are exporting jobs to other parts of the world, as we have just heard in the statement on steel?
Amber Rudd
I hope that the hon. Gentleman will take some comfort from the Paris agreement. Although the UK has possibly the most ambitious climate change targets in the world, the Paris agreement will go some way towards addressing the competitive issue that he has raised because other countries are also taking on obligations to reduce their carbon emissions. I specifically highlight China in that regard, which is now part of a global agreement for the first time.
As part of our action, the Government are focused on seeing through a long-term plan for secure, clean and affordable energy supplies for generations to come. The Bill delivers key manifesto commitments to achieve that objective. Over the next Parliament, that means ensuring that we continue to support investment in UK energy sources, including in the North sea. It also means continuing to support the deployment of new renewables so that we meet our objective of producing 30% of our electricity from renewable sources by 2020.
Amber Rudd
I make two points to the hon. Gentleman. First, the reasons for the fall in the oil price are multiple and complex. I will not analyse them here now, but there is not, as he suggests, just one cause. Secondly, the US has considerably reduced its emissions because of fracking, which of course we welcome.
Any oil and gas demand that we do not meet ourselves through domestic production has to be met by imports, at significant extra cost to the economy. Industry and government share the same ambitions and are working closely together to manage the remaining resources effectively and efficiently. As we progressively decarbonise our economy, we will continue to need oil and gas for many decades to come. It is far better that the jobs and revenue are in the UK, offsetting imports where we can. Maximising economic recovery from the UK continental shelf must be part of a balanced plan for a diverse and progressively lower-carbon mix.
This Bill will complete the work started in the previous Parliament to implement fully the Wood review. Key to Sir lan’s recommendations is the establishment of the Oil and Gas Authority as an independent regulator with a clear and focused mandate to maximise economic recovery of UK petroleum. Clauses 1 to 76 formally establish the OGA as an independent regulator and steward, which would take the form of a Government-owned company, transferring regulatory powers and functions to the OGA, and giving it new powers to support maximising economic recovery.
The OGA will take forward the principle of maximising economic recovery, set out in Part 1A of the Petroleum Act 1998, with powers taken in the Infrastructure Act 2015. In November, I launched a consultation on the strategy for maximising economic recovery of offshore UK petroleum, which is central to the OGA’s future effectiveness. An amendment made in the other place, which we will try to overturn, seeks to broaden the principal objective, greatly expanding the scope of the OGA’s role and going far beyond the vision set out in the Wood review. In our view, and indeed in the view of the industry and the unions, diluting the focus of the OGA at this critical time is not the right way to proceed. The OGA should be focusing on maximising economic recovery, as that is what it has been set up to achieve. In the current difficult and challenging circumstances, nothing should distract from that vital task.
The OGA requires clarity on its objectives, and we intend to provide that. This Government are committed to the Climate Change Act 2008, and to our target to reduce emissions by 80% by 2050. We will see the Climate Change Act framework in practice this year when we set in law the fifth carbon budget. Amendments made in the other place seek to change how we count carbon for carbon budget purposes from the fifth budget onwards. Given that the work to set the fifth carbon budget is well under way, and has been for nearly a year, and although it is right to keep our accounting practices under review, now is not the right time to change. To do so now, this far into the process, would threaten serious delay. Therefore, we will seek to overturn those amendments.
Let me turn now to the delivery of the Government’s manifesto commitments to end new subsidies for onshore wind and to ensure that local people have the final say on where onshore wind is built. On 18 June, I set out to the House our intention to close the renewables obligation for new onshore wind in Great Britain from 1 April 2016, with a grace period available to those projects which, as of 18 June 2015, already have planning consent, an offer of grid connection and access to land rights. The provisions we made in the Energy Bill to achieve that were removed in the other place, and will be reintroduced.
There is no ambiguity on this matter, as it is a manifesto commitment. We signalled our thinking on ending new public subsidies for onshore wind long before the last election and put it before the British people in black and white. There are long-established and well understood conventions with regard to manifesto commitments and we will stand firm on them.
Onshore wind has deployed successfully to date and is projected to meet the planned range of 11 to 13GW by 2020. Without action, there is a risk of deploying beyond this range, potentially adding more costs to consumer bills and squeezing out opportunities for other renewables, such as offshore wind, to mature and bring down their costs. We have engaged widely on the June proposals, including with devolved Administrations, supply chain, investors and developers. It is important that Northern Ireland closes the renewables obligation to onshore wind on terms equivalent to those of Great Britain.
Sammy Wilson
I thank the Minister for giving way again. Will she spell out the consequences for Northern Ireland should the Northern Ireland Executive decide to maintain the subsidies for longer than the period after 2016?
Amber Rudd
The hon. Gentleman raises an important point. It is my position that, if Northern Ireland chooses to provide additional support for onshore wind, the consumers in Northern Ireland, and not Great Britain, should bear the cost.
We must make strategic choices on where public money is directed, because we cannot afford to support every project and every technology regardless of its contribution to energy security, and regardless of the cost. We need to concentrate our support on where technology has the potential to deliver at the significant scale that we need for energy security and decarbonisation, and where, to be viable, we still need to see significant falls in costs for technology.
Lisa Nandy
One of the most important things we can do to help boost jobs and skills in the North sea is to have a long-term plan. I will say more about that as I make progress.
Sammy Wilson
Does the shadow Minister agree that to a certain extent she is speaking with forked tongue? On the one hand she is saying that we have to decarbonise the economy, but on the other she is saying we have to increase the output of a carbon fuel—oil. Which is it? Does she want to decarbonise the economy or does she want people to buy oil?
Lisa Nandy
Perhaps I can help the hon. Gentleman with that, as it is one of the things that he obviously struggles to understand. As we move towards a clean economy—there is widespread agreement in all parts of the House that that is a journey we must take—we need to think, too, about where we get our energy from in the short to medium term. There is no question about this—it is a fact that we will need to rely on oil and gas in the short to medium term. Because of that, the question that we face on all sides of the House is whether we import that oil and gas or generate our own.
Our view is that this transition must be made with due care and attention to the jobs, skills and investment we need in this country. It must also be made with due care for our environment, our health and our safety. That is a difficult thing to achieve. I very much welcome the fact that we are having this debate, but it seems to me that pitting the interests of the industry we currently have in the North sea against our interests in transitioning to a clean economy will not get us very far at all.
Nigel Adams
I totally agree. That is another great advertisement for sustainable biomass. We have paid for these assets—the Central Electricity Generating Board built these power stations—so let us sweat them for more decades. Biomass is the answer in the short term. Who knows? There might be other technologies that we could be using at them, such as hydrogen power. I am sure that there are the brains out there to find a way to use that resource.
Nigel Adams
I will give way one more time if I am allowed, Madam Deputy Speaker.
Sammy Wilson
Does the hon. Gentleman accept that another reason for keeping coal generation is that it is the cheapest form of electricity generation at present? Our competitors, for example Germany, are building new coal stations. When it comes to retaining jobs in the United Kingdom, we have to be cognisant of that.
Nigel Adams
I agree with the hon. Gentleman. It is tragic that we have sped up the demise of coal in this country. He will be aware that the last remaining deep coalmine was in my constituency. Unfortunately, it closed at the back end of last year.
Callum McCaig
I agree very much with the hon. Gentleman. It strikes me that there are certain parallels with the coal conversation moments ago. That situation could come to pass if we do not support the North sea. We need to transition away from oil and gas, but that will take some time given the economics at play. If we are using oil and gas—we will be doing so for the foreseeable future—it might as well be ours. We might as well get the economic benefit of it, and we should certainly use that economic benefit to try to diversify and invest in other areas. The hon. Gentleman made the point on subsidies. The oil and gas sector is taxed very highly, and more highly than any other sector of which I am aware. It is taxed less than it was, but we probably require it to be taxed less if we are to see the benefit of the industry in future.
The OGA is vital to that future and it is hugely important that it is put on a firm footing. It must be given the regulatory powers it requires and the ability to engage fully with industry on access to infrastructure, plans for investment and so on. I very much support the Government in ensuring that the OGA continues to have a laser-like focus on maximising economic recovery, which is fundamental to that purpose. Over the years, there have been umpteen changes to oil and gas. It is in the nature of the industry, with its huge capacity to generate income, that the goalposts have changed substantially during that time, but I plead with all hon. Members not to change the goalposts again. The industry has been working for two years towards proposals on maximising economic recovery, which have universal buy-in and require that the OGA’s focus is not complicated.
Sammy Wilson
Does the hon. Gentleman accept that the focus must be on economic regeneration, rather than further regulation? The industry, especially at this time, cannot afford more costly regulation.
Callum McCaig
I disagree. The absence of a strong regulator is where there have been significant problems in the oil and gas industry, in particular with access to infrastructure. The inability to get two parties with competing commercial interests to agree a deal on access to oil and gas infrastructure—a pipeline, for example—has meant that investment decisions have not been implemented. The industry needs a regulator that is hard-touch where required. I very much hope that the threat of sanctions from the OGA will in itself be enough, and that they will not be required. The OGA probably recognises that itself. Issuing sanctions left, right and centre would suggest that its soft skills, its influence and the buy-in the Wood review has brought forward, are not working effectively enough. Where there is no compliance or buy-in to the idea of maximising economic recovery, and where disagreements about access to infrastructure are inhibiting investment, the regulator should go in—and go in hard—to ensure that what everyone is supposed to be working towards is delivered.
Callum McCaig
I am sorry to disappoint the right hon. Gentleman. I will be brief, to a degree. I do not need to rehash the arguments about the closure of the renewables obligation, which is disproportionately affecting Scotland, because 70% of the wind farms that are in the pipeline would be there. I know that the Government have said that they want to try to reintroduce the closure in order to meet a manifesto commitment, but I urge them not to do so. If they do, we shall oppose the move.
Sammy Wilson
Given that fuel poverty in Scotland has increased by two and a half times since 2002—from 13% of the population to 34%—how can the hon. Gentleman justify further subsidies for wind turbines, which are paid by consumers and most of the proceeds of which go to well-heeled large landowners?
Callum McCaig
I do not think that that is the solution to fuel poverty. I think that the solution to fuel poverty is to insulate homes, in which there is huge and disproportionate investment in Scotland, and to end poverty. We have made various suggestions about how to do that, but the fact is that fuel poverty does not exist in a vacuum; it exists in the environment of actual poverty.
Onshore wind is a cheap renewable, and the closure of the renewables obligation is set to save bill payers the princely sum of 30p. Moreover, it will produce up to 63 million tonnes more carbon dioxide.
Mr Peter Lilley (Hitchin and Harpenden) (Con)
It is a great pleasure to follow the two previous speakers, my hon. Friend the Member for Selby and Ainsty (Nigel Adams), who made an extremely realistic speech, and the hon. Member for Aberdeen South (Callum McCaig), who I thought was amazingly complacent about the primary industry in his constituency, which is going to suffer very considerably for a considerable time from the run-down in the oil industry. It is amazing to me that the SNP can abort two potentially valuable industries in Scotland—underground coal gasification and fracking—which might have provided alternative jobs for the people in his constituency, and I hope he will look closely at that.
Wherever we are on the spectrum on global warming, from sceptical to alarmist, we can surely all agree on one thing: that we should try to achieve the targets to which we are committed for reducing CO2 at the least cost to our constituents, because it is ultimately they who bear it either through their budgets or their jobs. So when my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State found that subsidies were proving unnecessarily generous to achieve our targets and we were achieving them ahead of time, so that without changing those targets she could reduce those subsidies, she assumed the whole House would be in universal agreement with what she was proposing; even I, for once, was on her side. But it was not so: there were calls from the green lobby and the Opposition to keep subsidies higher than necessary for longer than necessary to achieve the targets to which we are committed, and key amendments in this Bill seem designed, likewise, to increase the costs of achieving our targets.
Clause 80 will not allow the use of the emissions trading scheme to achieve our targets, yet the whole purpose of the ETS is to ensure that those who can abate emissions at the lowest costs, do so. So by excluding the use of that, we are ensuring that higher costs are incurred to achieve a given abatement in emissions. Another amendment prolongs the subsidies for onshore wind for longer than needed, even though that is unnecessary. So I shall, unusually, be supporting the Front Bench in seeking to have both those amendments from the Upper House removed.
Above all, we have created a framework that commits us to load higher costs on UK consumers and businesses via the Climate Change Act 2008 and all its ramifications than any other country in Europe. Despite all that, we will ensure, because of the way the system works, that we do not reduce the amount of carbon dioxide emitted into the atmosphere by one molecule more than would be the case if we were doing the same as the rest of Europe.
Let me explain why that is so. At Paris all the countries of the world agreed to make commitments on what they were going to do in future to curb the growth of their CO2 emissions. The only exceptions were the countries of Europe, who put in a total figure for the whole of Europe and are now to allocate that figure among the member states. Because we are committed to doing so much more than the average in Europe—indeed, than anybody else in Europe—all that does is to reduce the amount by which the other countries in Europe will have to reduce their emissions. So we have increased the burden of costs on British households and business, reduced the burden of costs incurred by our partners in Europe, and not reduced the emissions of CO2 by a single molecule.
That is an extraordinary thing to achieve. It has puzzled me a for a long time how it is that we have a political class, particularly the green lobby that straddles both sides of the Gangway—
Mr Lilley
Indeed, not universally on the Opposition Benches. It puzzles me that the political class is committed to such perverse policies. Then I found a possible hint of an explanation, when someone mentioned to me, Madam Deputy Speaker, a book that I am sure that, like me, you have not read but have heard about called “Forty Shades of Grey”. It is apparently a mildly pornographic—