European Union (Withdrawal) Bill

Debate between Oliver Letwin and Stephen Timms

Committee: 5th sitting: House of Commons
Wednesday 6th December 2017 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Timms]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. We come directly to that point in amendment 153, in which we propose to add to schedule 4 the words set out on the amendment paper, which I shall read out. We propose to constrain Ministers’ powers by saying, first, that regulations

“may not be made for the purposes of…creating a fee or charge that does not replicate a fee or charge levied by an EU entity on exit day”.

That is exactly the point my hon. Friend has just raised. We of course recognise that a lot of charges are imposed at the moment by EU bodies of one sort or another—she mentioned a very important one—and that, in future, comparable fees or charges may well need to be levied by UK entities, but the aim of the first paragraph of amendment 153 is to make it clear that Ministers cannot impose new fees or charges for which there is not already a counterpart from the EU entity.

[Sir Oliver Letwin]

The right hon. Gentleman is doing exactly what needs to be done in Committee, and I have considerable sympathy with his ambitions. Has he considered whether the reference to remedying deficiencies as the basis for secondary legislation powers under the Bill would in any case have the effect he is describing?

[Stephen Timms]

I had not considered that, and the right hon. Gentleman may well have a point. I would be interested to know whether that is indeed the case. That interesting point is certainly worth pursuing, and I would welcome it if he expanded on that later.

Secondly, amendment 153 states that Ministers cannot bring forward regulations for the purpose of

“increasing a fee or charge to an amount larger than an amount charged by an EU entity for the performance of the relevant function on exit day.”

Let me take the example my hon. Friend the Member for Bishop Auckland (Helen Goodman) mentioned. The European Medicines Agency does very important work, and it charges the industry for that work. I am suggesting that the secondary legislation powers in schedule 4 should not be used to introduce a charge for the same function that is higher than the one currently charged by the European Medicines Agency. There may well be a loss of economies of scale in leaving the European Medicines Agency, and it may well be that undertaking that function purely for the UK will be a less efficient process than doing it EU-wide, as the European Medicines Agency does, but I do not think the secondary legislation powers in the schedule should be used to impose on industry or any charge payer a fee that is higher than the one currently charged by the EU entity.

I accept that there may well in due course need to be some higher fees or charges than those currently levied by EU entities, because the process may well be less efficient when carried out at a UK-only level, but I do not think the secondary legislation powers should be used for that purpose. If Ministers want to bring forward a proposal to impose a higher fee or charge, they should do so through the proper parliamentary process, with scrutiny by this House, not through secondary legislation powers.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Oliver Letwin and Stephen Timms

Wednesday 10th September 2014 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Timms (East Ham) (Lab)]

8. What progress he has made on the commitment in the “Open Public Services” White Paper of July 2011 to publish public service user satisfaction data on all providers from all sectors.

[The Minister for Government Policy and Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster (Mr Oliver Letwin)]

I am delighted to be able to tell the right hon. Gentleman that the progress in that incredibly important area has been considerable. The friends and family test, which is our main user feedback mechanism, is used in all hospitals and maternity wards. By March 2015, it will be extended to the rest of the NHS. It is already used in further education, it has been used in the National Citizen Service since August and it will be used in Jobcentre Plus from March next year. The intention is to roll it out right across the public services.

[Stephen Timms]

I am heartened. The Government’s Work programme is a good example of a public service where user satisfaction data would be extremely valuable, but the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions has steadfastly resisted their introduction. Will the Minister have another go at persuading the Secretary of State to introduce the use of such data in that service?

[Mr Letwin]

I am grateful for that suggestion. I will certainly talk to my right hon. Friend about it. He recently agreed to introduce the data in Jobcentre Plus and we have had to work through the details of that. I will certainly open discussions with him about the Work programme and will have discussions about other programmes across the rest of Government.