Trade, Exports, Innovation and Productivity

Debate between Lucy Frazer and Roger Mullin

Wednesday 13th January 2016 Commons Chamber

[Roger Mullin (Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath) (SNP)]

It is a great pleasure to speak with you in the Chair, Madam Deputy Speaker. I am also delighted to follow the thoughtful speeches of so many Members from all parts of the House. Indeed, it has been a very fine debate, and I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Dundee East (Stewart Hosie) for securing it. Some matters have been quite enjoyable as well as enlightening. I am sorry that the hon. Member for Spelthorne (Kwasi Kwarteng) is not in his place, because I particularly enjoyed the part of his speech when he was berating our Members for harking back as far as the 1960s, and then immediately moved forward to quote Adam Smith from the 18th century. It was a remarkably fine performance.

The hon. Lady for South Cambridgeshire—

[Lucy Frazer]

South East Cambridgeshire.

[Roger Mullin]

Is it close? [Laughter.]

The hon. Lady opened her speech by mentioning the hon. Member for East Antrim (Sammy Wilson) who is also not in his place. I was going to compliment him, because what he brought to this debate was a recognition that criticism is not always a negative thing; indeed, it can be helpful. When he said that, I immediately thought of an old teacher of mine, Professor Tom Burns, who, in the 1960s, along with his colleague Graham Stalker, wrote the famous book, “The Management of Innovation”. In it, he pointed to several factors that are essential for the development of innovation, some of which are extraordinarily pertinent to this debate. For example, one was that there are two types of ideas that we need to mobilise—creative ideas and critical analytical ideas. It is the forging together of those two types of ideas that becomes very important. He also said that one of the fundamentals in driving the rise of the industrial revolution was the creation not only of those types of ideas, but of the means of disseminating the ideas. That was fundamental. We saw it in Scotland with the sharing of ideas, flowing as they did from Edinburgh to Glasgow and Glasgow to Edinburgh. It seems a small thing to say in the modern era, but at that time it was fundamental to getting the sharing of ideas going.

To move on from my teachers, a few years ago I attended a fascinating lecture by Professor Tom Stonier. He pointed out that more people worked in pure research in the last 25 years of the 20th century than did so in the entire pre-history of the world. Let us think about that for a moment—there has been huge growth in the number of people undertaking research. If we combine that with the growth in new technology, such as IT and computing power—whereby an Einstein no longer needs to take years to work out his equations by longhand, and ideas can be processed so quickly—we will see that they are fuelling huge growth in innovation throughout the world.

I shall not dwell, as the hon. Member for Gloucester (Richard Graham) likes to do, on doom and gloom, but I shall point out some of the challenges we face. On the growth in the rate of research and the ideas coming into our world, the countries that will remain in front will be those that can capture and develop those ideas, put them into play and own them for themselves. That is the key challenge, which is why I am worried about recent trends in the UK.

Some days ago, the Chancellor of the Exchequer rightly pointed to a “cocktail of dangers” in the global economy. One of the dangers is that we are not investing enough in the type of research and development and innovation needed to keep us at the forefront. My hon. Friend the Member for East Lothian (George Kerevan) pointed out in his fine contribution that this country has a problem of a lack of long-term investment in business. That is true of many sectors, and part of the problem is that, compared with some of our major competitors, we are generating less investment from the business sector than we did in the past.

I am delighted that the Minister for Universities and Science, whom I met in a previous Westminster Hall debate about science, will sum up for the Government this evening. In 2010, the previous Government froze the science budget for five years, which meant a 10% cut in real terms, at a time when it was already at a modest level compared with those of our major G8 comparators. In 2012, UK public investment in science fell to less than 0.5% of GDP. As my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow North West (Carol Monaghan) pointed out in the debate at which the Minister was present, that is a lower rate than any G8 country has invested in the preceding 20 years. The G8 average is now about 0.8%, compared with the UK’s 0.44%.

If we look at broader measures of research and development, we see that a generation ago the UK was one of the most research-intensive economies in the world—and didn’t we benefit from that? Now, however, as with science, we are one of the least research-intensive economies. My late brother was at one time chair of the OECD committee on science and technology policy, and in recent years, before his sad passing, we would regularly discuss the failure of the UK—and his homeland of Scotland—to keep up. In terms of broad research and development measures, we have slipped from leading the OECD countries in 1979 to trailing behind all our major competitors. The US invests 2.8% of its GDP in all forms of research and development. On average, the OECD and EU countries invest 2.4% of their GDP, but the UK now spends only about 1.7% of its GDP on research and development. That is not going to keep us at the forefront or allow us to face some of the challenges and competition of the future. The hon. Member for East Gloucestershire—

Humanitarian Crisis in the Mediterranean and Europe

Debate between Lucy Frazer and Roger Mullin

Wednesday 9th September 2015 Commons Chamber

[Lucy Frazer (South East Cambridgeshire) (Con)]

Our country has a proud history of accepting the vulnerable into our society. That has not only saved lives, but enriched our culture. My family certainly owes a debt of gratitude to this country, for giving it refuge when it faced persecution. In times like these, we must live up to our international and moral obligations, but we must remember three important things when considering the crisis that faces us. First, our responsibility is not only to provide a safe haven. The task that faces us is not simply to offer a land in which the refugees can live; it is to give these people the chance of a future, and that means so much more than simply giving them the right to live here.

[Roger Mullin (Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath) (SNP)]

Will the hon. Lady give way on that point?

[Lucy Frazer]

Let me finish the point, because I am responding to the point made by the hon. Member for Moray (Angus Robertson) when he said that each life lost is important. Equally, each person’s quality of life is important. As the motion recognises, refugees have a moral and legal right to be treated properly, and that means integrating them into our communities as soon as they arrive, giving them homes, providing access to learning the language and access to study, to work and to medical facilities. Many voluntary organisations already do a fantastic job in holding the hands of the vulnerable in times of need. But when we take 20,000 refugees, including many children and women who have suffered violence and abuse, we must bring together local communities, charities, and local and central Government so that we provide advice, homes, interpretation facilities and the kind of care that we give to our own vulnerable families.

[Roger Mullin]

The hon. Lady is making a very fine speech. I particularly enjoyed her earlier comments about the need to think about the future and about the importance of education and the need to build up capacity so that people can return to help build that future. In the light of that, does she agree that the one thing the Government can do in addition to what they are promising to do is encourage our universities and colleges to open their doors to the young people so that they can learn the skills to enable them to go back? That commitment could easily be made in addition to the 20,000 target.

[Lucy Frazer]

First, it is important that we work with our local communities, which we are doing, and to use our foreign aid budget to do that. This is a very separate issue. I think what the hon. Gentleman is saying is that we should open our doors to people who are not refugees, because if we are giving people asylum or refuge, they will have access to our education facilities anyway; that is part of the process. Secondly, international co-operation is not only important, but essential. Yesterday, the shadow Home Secretary started her speech with a reference to the Kindertransport. But the challenges posed by Nazi Germany in the early 1940s were taken up not by one country, or even by Europe, but by the UN. Forty four countries signed a declaration in November 1943. An international effort on a significant scale is needed here. Britain leads the world in committing 0.7% of its budget to foreign aid.