Town and Country Planning (Fees for Applications, Deemed Applications, Requests and Site Visits) (England) Regulations 2012

Lord True Excerpts

Tuesday 6th November 2012 Grand Committee

[Lord McKenzie of Luton]

My Lords, I start by thanking the noble Baroness, Lady Hanham, for the introduction of the regulations. The Minister will be aware that these were not hotly contested in the other place and that they will not be by us on these Benches. They have our support and we are not seeking to give the Minister any trouble—not very much trouble, anyway. The approximate 15% increase is said to reflect inflation since the last uprating in 2008. Can the Minister let us know what measure of inflation has been used for this purpose?

My colleague in another place asked a question relating to the removal of permitted development rights under Article 4 directions relating to HMOs and whether fees would be applied to planning applications relating to HMOs. Has the department yet had the chance to produce an answer on that? We note the reluctance of Government to go down the path of decentralisation of fee setting, although I think the door is not completely closed on that matter.

The question of resources is a matter of importance and it seemed to be tacitly accepted that the increase in fees would not bridge the current deficit. There are always difficult questions in this area. I remember talking to planning officers in Luton about what goes into the cost base when one is looking at costs and fees. There was some shenanigans around central administration charges and all that. The Minister in the other place was rather broad-brush in suggesting that the new homes bonus could deliver lots of money to help support a range of things, including planning. Clearly, for some it may, but for others it will not, particularly if it is constructed on net rather than gross additions to stock. There will not be a bonanza for already tightly developed areas where new build comes, in large measure, from demolition of old. Surely it must be important for central government that local authorities have access to quality planning capacity, if local authorities are to be leading the charge for growth.

Will the Minister say more about what assessment the department has made of the capacity of planning departments up and down the country in the current environment? Will he say when it is proposed to look at fees again and whether there is merit in having more regular changes, rather than larger step increases? It seems to me to be fairer to those who are developing along the way, but I reiterate that we have no problem with these regulations and are happy to support them.

[Lord True]

My Lords, I, too, thank my noble friend for what she said and for the change that has been made. I declare an interest as leader of a planning authority. I agree with what the noble Lord, Lord McKenzie, has just said—that it would be desirable, in principle, if changes could be made more regularly, rather than in a stepped arrangement. I think I heard my noble friend say, and I find in the papers, that she recognises the need to go back and examine, at some point, the case for decentralisation. I very much welcome that. In the nature of things the balance of planning applications, the nature of business between one authority and another, will be different. Some will have very large numbers of large construction projects, others will rely mainly on householder projects; but given that the principle that the Government sets down, that it should be possible to recover costs, is accepted, I hope that, over time, we can also move towards decentralisation. I am sure that local authorities would welcome that and work with it.

I note that it is said that there is a need for restraint; that councils should not respond to current reductions in central government grant funding simply by increasing fees to raise lost grant revenue. That is a nice obeisance to Treasury doctrine, but of course the principle is that within the planning framework, planning costs should be met by planning fees, plus whatever grant is available. I hope that that principle is accepted. We are obviously not allowed to charge a commercial rate for part of a function, whereas everybody else who is involved in a planning process is. That is by their nature, whether it is the lawyers indulging in some judicial review or the builders charging a commercial rate, so councils in time should be allowed to do so. With that rider, I welcome the commitment to look again at decentralisation. I thank very much my noble friend for her announcement and give it my warm support.

[Baroness Hanham]

My Lords, that makes a change from the previous debate, for which I may be extremely thankful. I thank the noble Lord, Lord McKenzie, for his support for these measures, although I appreciate that there was some qualification from both the noble Lord and my noble friend Lord True because of the fact that the 15% does not totally meet the inflation rise. The noble Lord asked what measure of inflation it is. It is CPI. The noble Lord and my noble friend Lord True also asked about passing the planning fee question to local authorities. There has not been a decision on that at the moment. It was part of the consultation, as I said, and it has not been thrown out. In answer to the question from my noble friend, work is continuing with the Local Government Association to look at that and at reviewing fees more regularly.

Another question which the noble Lord, Lord McKenzie, asked was on Article 4 directions and HMOs. I have three pages here—the noble Lord may not want all of that but I am happy to send them to him. The changes made in October 2010 mean that a change in use of a family dwelling to a small HMO is permitted development. Where there are local concerns about concentrations of HMOs, on the other side, authorities can make Article 4 directions to restrict the national permissions after consultation with the local community. We do not believe that councils with substantial HMO problems have been slow in applying for Article 4 directions as a consequence of not being able to charge a planning application fee to determine them. I think that covers the question that the noble Lord asked. He is looking as if the answer is sort of yes. If there is anything further on that, I will of course let him know.

The question of capacity is something that varies from local authority to local authority. I think what was meant by capacity is the number of planning officers available to deal with applications. To some extent, that will be governed by the amount of work that local authorities have. In somewhere like London, there may need to be more than there are. The gap in a local authority’s budget, if there still is one, will have to be borne by that local authority, certainly for the time being, but we do not expect those gaps to be very large. I think that that answers some of the noble Lord’s questions. There were only five on these regulations instead of the 40 on the previous matter. I am very nervous about the noble Lord, Lord McKenzie, because he normally produces whole strings of questions which are usually quite difficult to get a grip on, but I think I have answered him today. I am grateful for the responses from the noble Lord and from my noble friend Lord True.