Criminal Finances Bill

Lord Rosser Excerpts

Committee: 1st sitting (Hansard - continued): House of Lords
Tuesday 28th March 2017 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Lord Rosser]

109: After Clause 20, insert the following new Clause—
“Report to Parliament on impact on enforcement authorities
(1) The Secretary of State must, within 18 months of the day on which this Act is passed, lay before both Houses of Parliament a report on the implementation of this Act and the impact on enforcement authorities.(2) The report must include an assessment of—(a) what, if any, additional resources are required by enforcement authorities in order to carry out their functions and powers under this Act;(b) what, if any, additional resources have been provided to enforcement authorities to support them in carrying out their functions and powers under this Act;(c) what additional training has been provided by enforcement authorities to staff members in order to allow them to effectively carry out their functions and powers under this Act;(d) to what extent enforcement authorities have used the powers provided under this Act.(3) In this section “enforcement authorities’’ means—(a) the National Crime Agency;(b) Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs;(c) the Financial Conduct Authority;(d) the Serious Fraud Office; and(e) the Director of Public Prosecutions (in relation to England and Wales) or the Director of Public Prosecutions for Northern Ireland (in relation to Northern Ireland).”

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Rosser (Lab)]

This amendment requires the Secretary of State, within 18 months of the day on which this Bill is passed, to lay before both Houses of Parliament a report on the implementation of the Act and its impact on enforcement authorities.

At Second Reading, it was pointed out that, if the measures provided for in the Bill are to be made to bite, the necessary resources will need to be provided. New offences and powers are created in the Bill, together with extensions of existing powers, which will require further resources, both financial and staff.

In response at Second Reading, the Government referred to the sums of money that have been invested in law enforcement agencies since 2006 and under the asset recovery incentivisation scheme over the past three years. I am not sure that that response really addressed the potential concern that had been expressed about the future and the implications for resources if the changes in the Bill in respect of new offences, powers and enhanced powers were to be effectively introduced and applied.

One’s concerns were not helped by the response from the Government to the question asked at Second Reading about the few unexplained wealth orders that were predicted—20 per year. The response was to the effect that it was a conservative estimate—presumably in more senses than one—as opposed to being a definitive indication of how often the unexplained wealth orders would be used. Has that been the basis on which other new and enhanced powers in the Bill have been assessed by the Government, and has it been done in this way to try to dampen down calls for additional resources in the quest to save money?

The Government said at Second Reading that they were already engaging with law enforcement authorities and prosecutors to encourage the use of all the new powers being introduced by the Bill. However, they went on to say that ultimately it would be for the enforcement authorities, which are operationally independent, to decide when and how often to use the new powers in the Bill. That may be true but the extent to, and thoroughness with which, enforcement authorities use the new and enhanced powers in the Bill must ultimately be determined by the level of resources they are given to carry out their new and enhanced role and responsibilities. The issue of the resources that are going to be made available to implement the provisions in the Bill, and about which we have heard very little, is a matter for government.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, and my noble friend Lord Hodgson of Astley Abbotts for speaking to the amendment. As with all powers introduced in legislation, it is crucial that the necessary resources are available to law enforcement and prosecution agencies so that they are used effectively. As he mentioned, ARIS is essential to this work. Under this scheme, half of all assets recovered go back to the law enforcement and prosecution agencies involved. Put simply, the more they recover, the more they get back. I am pleased to say that £764 million has been raised since 2006, and over £257 million in the last three years has been invested in law enforcement agencies under this scheme. The new powers will ensure that there are even more efficient ways of recovering assets and that they will be cheaper. Indeed, senior law enforcement officers gave evidence to the Commons Public Bill Committee that the powers will help agencies achieve more with the resources that they have. We have not downplayed the estimates in the impact assessment. These are provided subject to all the standard guidance based on input from law enforcement, the banks and others.

In addition, the Home Office share of ARIS is invested in front-line capabilities, including the regional organised crime units, which have received over £100 million in direct funding from the Home Office since 2013-14. Further to this, £5 million has been set aside from ARIS every year until the end of this Parliament to fund key national asset recovery capabilities, and we are fulfilling a manifesto commitment to return a greater percentage of recovered assets back to policing by investing all the Home Office share of the scheme’s money—above a certain baseline—in the multiagency regional asset recovery teams.

All the agencies listed in this amendment already report on their resources and results through departmental annual accounts and reports. As my noble friend said, this is about what they have achieved. They are subject to examination by the National Audit Office and Public Accounts Committee. The Criminal Finances Board, which is co-chaired by the Security Minister and the Economic Secretary to the Treasury, closely monitors resourcing, performance and support mechanisms such as training, to ensure that agencies are achieving results with the powers that Parliament imparts to them.

Finally, the Government have protected the NCA’s budget. In addition, new capital investment of over £200 million will be available over the period 2016 to 2020, to transform the NCA into a world-leading law enforcement agency, with new digital and investigative capabilities to tackle cybercrime, child exploitation and the distribution of criminal finances. The noble Lord, Lord Rosser, asked how many UWOs would be used and why so few were predicted. I said before—and the noble Lord said—that it was a conservative estimate, but we will encourage their use from day one. We are already actively engaging with law enforcement and prosecutors to encourage the use of all the new powers being introduced by the Bill. I hope with those words that the noble Lord is satisfied with my response. I know that we will keep an eye on this in the future but, for now, I hope that he will feel happy to withdraw his amendment.

[Lord Rosser]

I thank the Minister for her response and the noble Lord, Lord Hodgson of Astley Abbotts, for his contribution. The noble Lord’s main criticism of the amendment—not the only one—was that it did not provide for the authorities mentioned to say what they had achieved. I would have thought it was for the Government to say what they expected the authorities concerned to achieve in the light of the provisions of the Bill and the new offences and enhanced powers that they were giving the agencies. As yet, however, I have not heard anything from the Government about what they expect the agencies to achieve as a result of the Bill. There is some difficulty in requiring the agencies to report when the Government have not set them any targets that they are meant to attain. I do not know whether it is the Government’s intention to tell noble Lords at some stage what they think the agencies should be able to achieve in respect, for example, of a reduction in money laundering or the number of people who are arrested as a result of carrying it out. What do they expect the agencies to achieve in relation to the additional powers in the Bill? I do not know if this is something on which the Minister is prepared to write and tell me. What are the goals that the Government think these additional powers, and the resources that they say they are going to put in, will be achieved by the agencies? That is what is missing.

We have been having debates about the new powers and the noble Baroness has reminded us of the amount of money that has been provided so far, but what we are not getting is what the Government think the Bill will achieve to improve the situation. Is the Minister, either now or at some stage in the future, able to give me any idea of what the Government are expecting as a result of the new and enhanced powers in the Bill?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, as the noble Lord will know, the Government have not been fixated on targets, but we most certainly will have expectations of what can be achieved and they will be laid out in due course.

[Lord Rosser]

How will they be laid out? Are they to be set out in regulations or will the Government be making a Statement?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I would guess that they will be laid out in regulations and they will be revealed in due course.

[Lord Rosser]

We await the regulations with interest.

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

Perhaps I may intervene once more. I will confirm in writing to the noble Lord that they will be laid out in regulations. I do not want to make misleading statements at the Dispatch Box, but I can let him know in due course.

[Lord Rosser]

I would be happy for the noble Baroness to write to me, but whether the letter will set out what she has just said remains to be seen. However, I am happy for her to write to me on this issue; it would be very helpful. With that, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment 109 withdrawn.