Rehabilitation of Offenders (Amendment) Bill [HL]

Lord McNally Excerpts

2nd reading (Hansard): House of Lords
Friday 27th January 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord McNally (LD)]

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, has explained the Bill in his usual thorough and clear way. It is my great pleasure to support the Bill and the noble Lord’s suggestion that the Government could envelop it in their wider programme of reform.

On 17 March I will stand down at the end of my term as chairman of the Youth Justice Board. That will bring to an end seven years of association with the Ministry of Justice, half of it with the MoJ as Minister here in the Lords and half as chairman of the Youth Justice Board. I say that because the two points I want to make are relevant to each of the jobs I have done.

Looking at the speakers list today, I see I am flanked by four speakers who have been extremely influential as mentors during my time at the MoJ: the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, himself; the noble Lord, Lord Carlile of Berriew; the noble Earl, Lord Listowel; and the noble Lord, Lord Dholakia. I suppose I should add a fifth, the noble Baroness, Lady Chakrabarti, who is now on the Labour Front Bench, although I am not sure she was a mentor during that period; she was more of a menace—in the most constructive way.

One of the things I am most proud of is Section 139 of the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Act 2012. Unlock described it as positive but not perfect, and of course that is perfectly true. The fact is, though, that the reforms were as much as we could get our coalition partners to agree to. I was deeply influenced in my attempts by the noble Lord, Lord Dholakia, who had been pressing for more radical reforms. The truth is that my reforms were an exercise in the art of the possible. As the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, explained in his introduction, the truth is that over the period both major parties lost enthusiasm for any more radical reform.

However, today gives us an opportunity to test the water to see if there is an appetite in government for further reform. We know the matter is in front of a number of bodies. At present, for instance, the Justice Committee is completing an inquiry into youth criminal records, and it is that particular area that I want to address in my remarks. Its activities follow the recommendation of the Carlile committee on court reform. I hope that my noble friend—I think I can still refer to him as that, although we now seem to be separated by quite a gulf; but not, I hope, in attitudes—will refer to that in his speech, because the Carlile report was an important help to government in charting their way for reform.

It was also a key recommendation in the review conducted by Charlie Taylor into the youth justice system. The Secretary of State is at present considering next steps for youth justice reform. I urge her to keep in mind that the youth justice system is not simply the junior branch of the adult criminal justice system. The Taylor review is clear that we should develop a distinct approach to treating childhood offending. “Children first, offenders second”, is the mantra that Charlie Taylor advocated. It has been the guiding light of the Youth Justice Board both in the community and in the secure estate over the board’s 17 years of existence.

There is a strong case for following the logic of the Taylor report and the Government accepting the Carlile recommendation for the expungement of criminal records at attaining the age of 18, excluding homicide, serial sexual offences and other violent crime. As the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, explained, this is not woolly liberalism, but sound common sense, as is the continuation of anonymity for young offenders who come before the courts. All the evidence shows that resettlement into a job is the best way to avoid reoffending. I pay tribute to companies such as Timpson, National Grid and many others in the private sector who are willing to take on ex-offenders. The existence of a criminal conviction can undo years of successful rehabilitation work.

The Government are bound to say today that they are awaiting the outcome of a number of cases before the court regarding disclosure, and the findings of the Justice Committee inquiry, but I hope that the noble and learned Lord will acknowledge that the impact of the 1974 Act has been beneficial, but that it now suffers the problems of age and that we need the kind of widespread reform of criminal records advocated by Nacro, Unlock and the Standing Committee for Youth Justice.

About two years ago, I went to Bucharest for a conference on treatment of youth justice, and I was genuinely surprised and shocked—perhaps I should not have been—by the number of colleagues from other parts of Europe who said to me, not in a hostile but in an understanding way, “Of course, we know that yours is a punitive and penal policy towards young offenders, whereas ours is welfare based”.

I hope that we are moving in the direction of a welfare-based approach to young offending. Charlie Taylor is right: they are children first, offenders second. Of course victims have to be protected, but I remind colleagues of the key findings of the report to which the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, referred. It stated:

“This report examines how childhood criminal records”—


those acquired under the age of 18—

“are treated in 16 jurisdictions. Of all the areas we looked at, the system in England and Wales is one of the most punitive. A criminal record acquired by a child in England and Wales can affect that person for longer, and more profoundly, than in any other jurisdiction under consideration … The overall environment is such that a childhood criminal record, even for a relatively minor offence or misdemeanour, can have severe implications during childhood and beyond into adulthood; this can affect an individual’s education, employment and other prospects for years to come”.

That is the wrong that I hope that the Bill moved by the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, begins to right, and I look forward to a positive response from the Minister.