Media Oversight: Transfer of Responsibilities
Debate between Lord Fowler and Baroness Garden of Frognal
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My Lords, the noble Lord makes some valid points and I acknowledge his expertise in consumer matters, which will of course inform his views. However, he will appreciate that there are many aspects of government in which more than one department has an interest. The Department for Culture, Media and Sport is an economic-focused department, so it makes a great deal of sense to bring together for the first time the full value chain of the technology industries—the infrastructure, content regulation and the creative industries—in one place. It is, after all, the department for media.
Lord Fowler
My Lords, perhaps I may remind the noble Lord that it was the last Government who deliberately changed the law in 2003 to allow foreign takeovers of British television companies and thus enabled BSkyB to make its bid. I put it to my noble friend that in future it would be better if, irrespective of whichever party is in power, politicians were removed altogether from taking the final decision in media takeovers.
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My noble friend makes a powerful point, which I know he has made before. This is being treated extremely seriously by the Government. We are currently looking at various reviews, not the least of which is the Leveson inquiry, which will focus on this. I am sure that decisions will be taken in due course.
Media Ownership
Debate between Lord Fowler and Baroness Garden of Frognal
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My Lords, the Government have commissioned a report from Ofcom on media ownership to be completed in June 2012. As your Lordships will be aware, the Leveson inquiry will also report on matters related to media ownership and any recommendations will be considered as part of the communications review.
Lord Fowler
Surely the Leveson inquiry has already confirmed that over the past 30 years politicians of all parties have, in the words of the Prime Minister, “cosied up” to the media proprietors to get support. Is there then not a clear conflict of interest when those same politicians become Ministers and judge on media mergers and takeovers? If that is the case, why cannot we act now and take politicians out of the whole decision-making process?
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My noble friend makes some valid points, although I should add that not all politicians have cosied up to the Murdoch empire over the years. However, in the light of recent events, it has become increasingly important that politicians are not seen to influence decisions on the media. The Secretary of State has himself agreed that this is a very important item for discussion, and it will undoubtedly be taken up when the decisions on these matters are made.
Leveson Inquiry
Debate between Lord Fowler and Baroness Garden of Frognal(12 years, 7 months ago)
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Lord Fowler
My Lords, although I am very touched by the Government’s faith in the independent review—my noble friend might remember that that was not always the view of her department when refusing to set up an independent review—I wonder whether she agrees that not everything should wait for Leveson, particularly in one respect. Is it not a fact that the current way of deciding media bids is, frankly, now bust? Do not politicians need to be taken out of the decision-making process and a demonstrably independent system, with either Ofcom or the Competition Commission deciding, set up, and set up now? If that change requires new legislation and there is no room in the programme, we can all think of a Bill that can be dropped to make way.
Baroness Garden of Frognal
There is one aspect of my noble friend’s question to which I shall resist replying at this stage. He is absolutely right. Under the Enterprise Act 2002, the Secretary of State has the power to intervene in the public interest and in a quasi-judicial capacity. My right honourable friend is on record as stating publicly that there are very strong arguments for politicians to be taken out of discussions on these sorts of matters and for them to be undertaken by the regulators. We will certainly look to be taking that forward.
Media: Plurality
Debate between Lord Fowler and Baroness Garden of Frognal
Lord Fowler
To ask Her Majesty’s Government what proposals they have for ensuring media plurality in the United Kingdom.
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My Lords, the Government will outline high-level thinking on media ownership and plurality in the forthcoming communications Green Paper and have commissioned a report from Ofcom on these matters to be delivered in June 2012. As noble Lords will be aware, the Leveson inquiry will also report on matters related to media plurality and any recommendations will be considered as part of the communications review.
Lord Fowler
My Lords, should we not remember that last July we were only days away from News Corp’s bid for BSkyB being waved through? Against that background, would my noble friend not agree that our aim should be to have safeguards that prevent any one organisation owning a disproportionate share of the British media and that final decisions on media mergers and takeovers should be taken independently, not by Ministers?
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My noble friend makes very valid points on this. On his second point, the Secretary of State has indeed questioned whether it is appropriate for politicians to have the final say on plurality issues. In competition cases, Ministers are removed from the decision-making process, and that would also be applied to media plurality. We will be seeking views on that in the Green Paper. On his other point, these topics will be discussed in great depth by the communications Green Paper and by Leveson.
Creative Industries
Debate between Lord Fowler and Baroness Garden of Frognal
Lord Fowler
My Lords, first I congratulate my noble friend on her speech and on securing this debate. In the glory days of the Communications Select Committee—that was when I was chairman and she was a member of it—we worked very closely together. Of course, we did carry out an inquiry into the creative industries as one of our last works. I also look forward very much to the maiden speech of the noble Viscount, Lord Colville. We all remember his father with enormous affection. His own career has been with the BBC, and he will find in this House that most of us regard that as being a very high recommendation indeed. In particular, in these years of phone hacking, the BBC has managed generally to preserve standards that are the envy of the world. Not all my later remarks will necessarily be as obliging to the BBC, but we very much look forward to his speech.
As my noble friend said, there is an enormous opportunity here. We already have a position where, in terms of jobs, the television, film and games industries are of vast importance. Of course, added to that is the revenue that is being earned, the taxes paid and the national reputation which has increased in areas such as theatre and music. We have truly important industries by any measure. The aim should now be to see where government policy can aid in future development. My noble friend highlighted education and training—and rightly so. She is absolutely right to stress the point that there are good careers for men and women with skills in these industries.
I should like to add one or two other essentials. On financial support from the Government, the great issue is consistency. The film production tax credit introduced in 2006 has been a great success and is absolutely essential. For those who argue that no government support is necessary, I would say that we need to recognise one central point about the film industry. There is intense competition in seeking to bring film-makers to individual countries from around the world: an array of financial incentives is offered. Germany offers them; Canada offers them; and even some individual states in the United States offer them. We all recognise the dominating importance of American studios and distributors and therefore compete for their investment. If Britain was not to do that, we would be removing ourselves from the market altogether.
There are a range of areas that the Government should examine to see what further practical help can be given: encouragement for independent British film-makers and animation companies, where we already do very well and could potentially do even better; an examination of the video games industry, which competes internationally with countries that give tax incentives; and in television I strongly support those who argue for exploring ways to help British children’s programmes.
There is a temptation in these debates simply to set out a shopping list for government aid, which is not currently a hopeful area in any event. Not everything needs to be government money, and television is an example of how progress can be made by taking off restrictions, promoting change and creating more jobs and revenue. We are fortunate in this country in having a range of excellent television companies: BBC, ITV, Channel 4 and, to be fair, BSkyB, which now makes some excellent programmes. The choice was illustrated a couple of weeks ago when, on Sunday night, you had to choose between “Spooks” and “Downton Abbey”. Programmes like these are sold around the world—that is the point.
BBC Worldwide is far and away the largest British distributor. It has built up sales of more than £1 billion a year, and a profit of more than £150 million a year. It has been an enormous success—there is no doubt about that—and the question is whether that success can be further improved. It is a company that is capable of being a truly global brand. It can expand further, increase revenue and create more jobs but it is held back because, basically, it is in the public sector. It has to fund its expansion from its own internal resources; it cannot borrow on the market. The BBC Trust is in the background, saying that it should not expand too much in any event. It is a typically British position. A company capable of being a world leader held back by a lack of ambition, not from within the organisation, but by the corporation that owns it. There is an overwhelming case for a public/private partnership. For those who think this is the view of some way out, right-wing think tank, the final report from Digital Britain, signed by two Secretaries of State from the last Government, said:
“BBC Worldwide has the potential to be a very significant global rights business for Britain and the Government believes it would be a missed opportunity to limit BBC Worldwide to a narrow supporting role to the BBC”.
That is entirely my case.
However, what has happened is, like in the worst of nationalised industries, that the corporation has replied that BBC Worldwide is not for sale and has made other remarks of that kind. We should remember that the BBC is not a corporation owned by a set of directors or executives; it is owned by the licence fee payers, who have provided the finance whereby it has developed. The question is not whether it is just in the interest of the BBC; it is what is in the national interest, the British interest and the interest of the creative industries. The decision here is an acid test of our intention and policy and whether we are truly serious about improving our creative industries.
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My Lords, I remind your Lordships that this is a timed debate and when the clock reaches six you have completed your six minutes.
Media: Ownership
Debate between Lord Fowler and Baroness Garden of Frognal
Baroness Garden of Frognal
I thank the noble Lord for that. The criteria for the independent directors are listed in great detail in the articles here, which set out the connections that they must not have and the sort of people they must be. They must not, for instance, have close family ties to the Murdochs, News Corp or their advisers. The details of the criteria that those people must meet are set out extensively in the memorandum.
Lord Fowler
My Lords, does this case not show that there is an urgent need to reform the process to which the Minister referred? The decision rests with the Secretary of State but in the past few months one Secretary of State has accepted the assurances of Mr Murdoch, while his predecessor said:
“I have declared war on Mr Murdoch and I think we are going to win”.
Would it not be better for everyone concerned for decisions in these media cases to be taken by politically independent bodies, which are able to judge what is the public interest?
Baroness Garden of Frognal
My Lords, a great degree of independence is built in to the decisions that are taken. My noble friend is absolutely right: it is the Secretary of State who will ultimately take the decision, but it will be based on wide-ranging consultation, and will have the agreement of Ofcom and the other bodies that regulate the media.