Hurricane Dorian

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Naseby

Monday 9th September 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

The noble Lord is absolutely right to raise that, and I refer to my response to the noble Baroness, Lady Northover. We have been working with regional partners and, most importantly, with CDEMA, the aid agency that responds to these issues in the Caribbean. We have been bolstering its responsibility and investing with our key partners. I assure the noble Lord that my conversation yesterday with the Foreign Affairs Minister of the Bahamas focused specifically on ensuring that the technical support and the reports that we are getting reflect the type and focus of the assistance that can be provided. For example, we are working with American colleagues on ensuring that the airport is functional so that more aid and support can be provided.

[Lord Naseby (Con)]

As my noble friend will recall, lessons were learned from Hurricane Irma, one of which concerned the speed of the response. Can he assure the House that we are using the facilities at Brize Norton? If planes cannot land at Nassau, they should at least land at the Cayman Islands and be trans-shipped. Can my noble friend bring us up to date? Are we using the facilities and heavy-lift equipment at Brize Norton on the ground in the Bahamas now?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My noble friend raises an important point about lessons learned. I believe that I have already indicated the importance of staying focused after Hurricane Irma and Hurricane Maria. On the specific issues raised, RFA “Mounts Bay” was the only vessel that had the ability to access the Bahamas. As many noble Lords know, the hurricane stayed over the Bahamas and at one point moved at about 1 mph, so for two consecutive days the Abaco Islands, in particular, were battered quite considerably. We provided support at the first point of access. The runway needed to be cleared to allow access and the US has been leading in providing support in that respect. In terms of the wider response, my noble friend talked about the Caymans and so on. I have been pleased that, because of co-ordination, we have seen support from the British Overseas Territories—namely, the Turks and Caicos and the Cayman Islands—in alleviating the suffering of the people of the Bahamas, and that co-ordination continues.

British Overseas Territories: Same-Sex Marriage

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Naseby

Monday 23rd July 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

First, on the latter point, I assure the noble Lord that we work very constructively with our British Overseas Territories to ensure that they comply with international obligations. Indeed, the progress we have seen in Bermuda is reflective of the fact that equality for all citizens, including members of the LGBT community, is safeguarded and that they will continue to be able to play a full and active role in the future. On the specific issue of equal marriage, as I said, we are engaging constructively and it remains the British Government’s position. The noble Lord mentioned the 2012 paper. The basis of that was to encourage and continue to support the overseas territories to make progress on this important issue directly themselves.

[Lord Naseby (Con)]

Will my noble friend confirm—and I declare an interest as vice-chairman of the all-party Cayman group—that, particularly in the Caribbean, a number of the overseas territories have their own constitution to deal with domestic matters? As I understand it, in their view the subject raised by this Question is a domestic issue. They have elected Members of Parliament. Those Parliaments debate these issues, and surely it is for those Parliaments, which after all represent the people living in those islands, to decide what is appropriate or not.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, as I have already said, of course we respect the rights of our British Overseas Territories to decide their own domestic issues, but it is also important that on issues of fairness the Government of the United Kingdom continue to hold constructive discussions, as we do in broader terms as well. I am minded to quote my right honourable friend the Prime Minister when she addressed this important issue in the context of the Commonwealth conference:

“As a family of nations we must respect one another’s cultures and traditions. But we must do so in a manner consistent with our common value of equality, a value that is clearly stated in the Commonwealth Charter ... Nobody should face persecution or discrimination because of who they are or who they love. And the UK stands ready to support any Commonwealth member wanting to reform outdated legislation that makes such discrimination possible”.


It is a constructive, progressive approach, and is the same approach that we adopt with our British Overseas Territories.

Sanctions and Anti-Money Laundering Bill [HL]

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Naseby

Ping Pong (Hansard): House of Lords
Monday 21st May 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, I am grateful to all noble Lords for an extensive, well-reasoned, well-argued and expert debate in your Lordships’ House. I am grateful in particular to my noble friend Lord Naseby, who presented a case for the overseas territories which I empathise with. Noble Lords who were in the Chamber when I opened this debate would have heard the points that I made. I will respond to a few specific points and questions raised, but I want first to set the record straight. First and foremost, the Government’s position is what it was when the Bill left your Lordships’ House. As the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, said, the Government defeated the amendment tabled by the noble Baroness, Lady Stern. That was done because of reasoned debate and expert insight, which has been reflected in your Lordships’ House again today.

As my noble friend Lord Hunt said, my noble friend Lord Naseby has allowed us all an opportunity again to demonstrate the wisdom, insight and expertise your Lordships have, but the point of principle highlighted by the noble and learned Lord, Lord Brown, remains: notwithstanding the valuable discourse that we have had, the House of Commons has sought to vote otherwise. In that regard, I want to clarify a few points.

My noble friend Lord Northbrook mentioned that it was a government amendment. Of course, it was not; it was tabled from the government Benches—it was a joint amendment. In light of the support that the amendment had gathered, the Government decided not to oppose it. My noble friend Lord Naseby referred to the Government’s amendment being tabled late in the day. Let me assure my noble friends and your Lordships’ House that we had been in extensive negotiations with many Members of Parliament, including those of other parties and most notably the Scottish National Party, on the important issues of the constitution and about this Parliament voting on something that would apply to parliaments that did not have a say in the debate taking place—a point well made by the noble Earl, Lord Kinnoull. We were trying to find a way forward that respected both the drive for transparency, which many noble Lords have raised today, and the constitutional settlement with the overseas territories and Crown dependencies. It was also important that we continued to do this to reach the cross-party consensus that was being sought. We brought further amendments forward on 30 April and brought that to the attention of the House to find that consensus. That is why conversations were still ongoing throughout that morning. The amendment we tabled was taken as in order but, as I said in my opening remarks, it was not then debated or taken for debate by the Speaker of the House of Commons.

That said, we have had an extensive debate. The noble Lord, Lord Anderson, who I see is not in his place as such, asked for comment on the Foreign Affairs Committee’s report. We are looking at that report, which was issued this morning, carefully but the Prime Minister has made the general principle clear. I say to all noble Lords that there is not a difference between ourselves and the Governments of the overseas territories. Everyone wants to see us tackle illicit finance effectively. Let me assure the noble Lord, Lord Collins, that it remains a priority for this Government and that we will continue to take a leading role in this respect.

The noble Lord, Lord Beith, my noble friend Lord Naseby and my noble and learned friend Lord Mackay all touched on the important issues of the constitutional arguments. Our position in the light of the circumstances set out in the 2012 White Paper has not changed. We believe that the fundamental structure of our constitutional relationships is the right one. Of course, we retain the power to legislate directly and have done so, as I said in my opening remarks, but in this case we would prefer not to have done so without consent. However, as we have all heard, we are all in this situation since the decision taken by the House of Commons.

My noble and learned friend Lord Mackay raised how this provision will come into force. As I always do, I listened carefully to his insight on this matter and I can confirm that it will not come into force through Royal Assent; it will come into force and commence by regulations. We need to establish the detail, as he said, but I listened carefully to the points he raised in this respect.

My noble friend Lord Faulks asked about the next Bill and I again pay tribute to his efforts in this regard. Let me assure him once again that we have committed to bring forward legislation early in the next Session on the important issue, which he has raised during debate on this Bill, of the register of overseas companies that own UK property. We anticipate that that register will be ready for use in 2021.

The noble and learned Baroness, Lady Butler-Sloss, pointed to other jurisdictions such as Gibraltar. At this point, I acknowledge the contributions of my noble friend Lord Naseby and other noble friends, and noble Lords across the Chamber, who acknowledged the efforts that our overseas territories have made. While I totally accept the principle highlighted by the noble Lord, Lord Collins, and the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, of the importance of transparency—of seeing that flow of illicit finance coming to an end—let us not forget that, in the UK, we have a public register. This is not a panacea to end this issue. It needs concerted action, which is why I have been vocal in my defence of the overseas territories and not just, as the noble Lord, Lord Beith, pointed out, because I am the Minister responsible. Genuinely, when we look at the track record from the overseas territories—the exchange of notes that are operational and which we are reporting back on, or the accessibility for tax and law enforcement agencies—those jurisdictions have been co-operating fully and effectively. That is why I, as the Minister responsible, made that robust defence of the overseas territories. Not only has progress been made; the overseas territories are ahead of the curve. There is just not a case for not doing something until the others catch up, as they are already fully co-operating.

Several noble Lords alluded to the EU list. Anguilla, Bermuda, the BVI, the Cayman Islands and all three Crown dependencies are not included on any list because they are deemed to have been holding back by the EU Code of Conduct Group. They have been put on lists and acknowledged for being co-operative jurisdictions. All our Crown dependencies and overseas territories with financial centres are already committed to global tax transparency standards, which we all agree on, and the commitments that they have made go beyond those. I say again for the record that there is no grey list. All the overseas territories, as the noble Earl, Lord Kinnoull, highlighted, have made great strides, ahead of many other jurisdictions, in ensuring that they adhere not to any international standard but to the principles of ensuring that they can address the fact that law authorities and tax authorities can access such registers.

That said, we are in a position where the other place has decided—on a cross-party basis in certain respects, as the noble Lord, Lord Collins, said—that it is its will to go forward with public registers for the overseas territories, and it is the Government’s position that we have accepted that point of the elected Chamber. In doing so, though, I assure my noble friend Lord Naseby and others who have spoken about the overseas territories that from a government perspective we will seek to ensure that we collaborate and co-operate fully and work with the overseas territories to ensure that we get the results we want. We do not want to disable the overseas territories and we do not want them to lose out, but there is a reality of decisions that this Parliament has taken, and they have implications. We need to ensure that we work effectively and collaboratively with those overseas territories to ensure that we can still sustain and strengthen their economies for years to come.

I put on record for my noble friend Lord Naseby that I am very grateful to him for once again allowing me to articulate the Government’s position and my position as the Minister responsible for the overseas territories. I am also grateful for, as I am sure my noble friend has acknowledged, the great and wise expertise that we have heard from around your Lordships’ House, demonstrating again the wise insight on this subject and many. However, mindful of the fact that the other place has decided to pursue the issue of public registers with the overseas territories, an amendment that the Government have now accepted, I hope that after listening to the debate my noble friend is minded to withdraw his amendment.

[Lord Naseby]

My Lords, those were fine words from the Minister, and we have heard fine words from my colleagues who have supported me this evening. I hope those fine words have some strength behind them. Many noble Lords will know that I have been in the two Houses for 44 years. I deeply respect the rights of the House of Commons, so it is not with an easy heart that I resist the temptation to test the views of this House.

I have reflected deeply on this. I am trusting my noble friend on the Front Bench to move this forward. As my noble and learned friend Lord Mackay of Clashfern said: justice for all—which means, in particular, justice for all the overseas territories. I shall watch, be vigilant and challenge, but on this occasion I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Sanctions and Anti-Money Laundering Bill [HL]

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Naseby

3rd reading (Hansard): House of Lords
Wednesday 24th January 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, I am grateful to noble Lords. I reiterate my thanks to my noble friends Lord Faulks and Lord Hodgson for pressing the Government and holding us to account in this respect and ensuring that we move forward. I am also grateful to my noble friend Lord Naseby, who sought clarification. I have looked carefully at his amendment and I think what the Government have tabled and his amendment have the same intent. However, in the interests of ensuring thoroughness and completeness, I have asked officials to look again to make sure that the intent behind his amendment is achieved.

The Government have committed to the new Bill establishing the register. It will be primary legislation and will pass through your Lordships’ House, so I am sure there will be further discussions and plenty of opportunity to ensure that all issues, particularly those raised by my noble friend, are addressed. I assure him that we feel the intent behind his amendment has been achieved. I will, however, look at this again, and if there is a need to do anything further, we will seek to do that in the other place.

My noble friend Lord Hodgson asked me when Royal Assent might be granted. It is not within my gift as the Minister at the Dispatch Box to confirm that, but we are expecting Royal Assent at the end of this Session. On accountability, I reassure my noble friend that through the additional ministerial Statement laid today, I have sought to provide as much detail as I can at this juncture in the parliamentary timetable. However, as I said to him in our bilateral meetings—I believe this was communicated to him subsequently in other meetings we had—we have worked back, and as the Written Ministerial Statement again confirms, we are looking to have the register operational by 2021. I am sure there will be other opportunities. As for the Government laying a report, I confirm that the 12- month clock—the countdown—will commence as soon as Her Majesty has signed off on the Bill. However, it would be beyond the scope of my responsibilities to give an absolute, cast-iron guarantee as to when Royal Assent will be. I am sure my noble friend appreciates and respects that we have to follow due process. However, the Government are committed to the register being operational in 2021. From the points made by other noble Lords, I appreciate that wherever one is sitting in your Lordships’ House, there is no disagreement on the need to move forward on this and to do so as rapidly as we can.

My noble friend raised another issue, about procurement. Again, to reassure him on that, I draw his attention to the Written Ministerial Statement laid today by my noble friend Lord Henley, which says:

“I am today confirming to Parliament the Government’s timetable for implementation of its policy to achieve greater transparency around foreign entities that own or buy property in the UK or participate in UK Government procurement”.


As the Bill is drafted and pre-legislative scrutiny takes place on it—if that is the process which is agreed—that will allow further discussion to address the very points my noble friend raises in that primary piece of legislation.

The point about local government is well made. As someone who served 10 years in local government, I am acutely aware of how procurement works. It will reflect the very policies adopted by the UK Government. With those reassurances, I hope my noble friend will be minded to withdraw his amendment.

[Lord Naseby]

My Lords, having listened to my noble friend, I am most grateful to him for the patience he has shown and the care he has taken over the Bill and this amendment. In light of the commitment he has made—as he says, if necessary, some amendment could be made in another place—it is my pleasure to withdraw the amendment.

Syria

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Naseby

Thursday 19th October 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I totally concur with the noble Lord’s sentiments. I assure him that he is right: this is not just about Daesh, although I am pleased that at the UN recently we passed a resolution in the Security Council that was all about holding to account those who committed these heinous crimes against humanity and wore the name of Daesh in committing their actions, which bear no resemblance to any humanitarian act. Regarding the Syrian regime, as the noble Lord knows, we are supportive of all resolutions. That is why we also take the strong stance that while the Assad regime is in place there can be no long-term political settlement of the situation. Let us not forget who created the crisis in the first place.

[Lord Naseby (Con)]

My Lords, why do Her Majesty’s Government not recognise that Assad is not going anywhere and that the Syria that he holds is growing back almost to the boundaries it had before? Against that background, does my noble friend really think that British taxpayers want £14 million to be spent on supporting the so-called opposition? Surely it would have been better spent on fuel poverty.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My noble friend perhaps mixes two issues. I think that all these issues are of equal importance. We have just heard from him about the importance of addressing fuel poverty. Equally, I think I speak for many in this House when I say it is right that we stand up for the oppressed of Syria and support the opposition forces because it is they, not Bashar al-Assad, who hold the key to the future development of all communities in Syria, including all minority communities.

Hurricane Irma: Disaster Relief

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Naseby

Tuesday 10th October 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord Naseby (Con)]

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper. In doing so, I declare an interest in that I have family living in the Caymans.

[The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, we are conducting an internal review to identify the lessons learned from the Government’s response to Hurricane Irma, as indeed we do in response to all crisis situations. These findings will of course be incorporated into future crisis responses. The timing of this review will be considered alongside the ongoing recovery efforts in the Caribbean, including the overseas territories. Meanwhile, the Foreign and Commonwealth Office will continue to co-ordinate a cross-government response to any new crisis which may arise.

[Lord Naseby]

The Minister’s Answer is very welcome, but in this review will he go back to the review after the tsunami in 2005, when it was clearly stated that the most vital part was for help to arrive in the first 24 hours, or, if that is not absolutely possible, in the first 36 hours? Against that background, will he make sure that the review looks at the date at which the FCO crisis committee met, on 5 September, and say why it did not meet in the previous week? Will that review look at the situation regarding the movement of aircraft from Brize Norton and say why they did not get into the air immediately after the hurricane had left the British Virgin Islands, instead going two days later? Finally, will the review look at why HMS “Ocean” was not moved at least a week earlier to somewhere nearer this side of the Atlantic rather than the middle of the Mediterranean, even though, sadly, it broke down en route in any case?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My noble friend raises a series of questions; in the interest of allowing more questions to be asked, I will write to him specifically to answer them. However, I will pick up on one or two of his points. The UK Government responded within 24 hours. My noble friend may well be aware that RFA “Mounts Bay” arrived within 24 hours of the storm’s impact and restored power supplies at Anguilla’s hospital, rebuilt the emergency operations centres and, importantly, cleared the runway to allow planes that were waiting to arrive at the airports to come in. It then followed on and delivered a similar response to BVI. However, I will respond to the issues my noble friend raised in his other questions.

Hurricane Irma

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Naseby

Tuesday 12th September 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

The noble Lord speaks from great experience but the RFA “Mounts Bay” was dispatched two months ago. I acknowledge his point that this has been an ongoing deployment through different ships and different vessels but, equally, I am sure he will acknowledge that this is done exactly for the reason that the hurricane season in the Caribbean is not a new phenomenon. What was different was the force of Hurricane Irma, a category 5. The deployment ensured that we had immediate assistance on board the RFA “Mounts Bay”, which was already in the region. It acted on that and she was able to visit both Anguilla and the British Virgin Islands. Today she has returned to Anguilla to help in providing basic reconstruction material.

The noble Lord made a point about the consular support we have made available for the population and for evacuation. Consular support is, in a general sense, exactly that. It establishes who needs what. I said earlier that, for anyone who needs to leave any of the affected territories, we are working with the appropriate authorities to make that happen. He mentioned St Martin specifically. The US, Germans and the Dutch are sending in flights today and we are liaising directly with them to ensure that those Brits who want to leave that territory are able to do so. They are prioritising according to need.

We are currently also working on this across other capitals in Europe, including Paris and The Hague. As I indicated earlier, we have had great assistance from the Cayman Islands and Barbados.

I emphasise again that this is about co-ordination with those in the region. The noble Lord mentioned the US and, yes, we are working directly with it. I indicated in the Statement how we are working collectively with the US. We have had no pushback from the other countries, nor in our support have we resisted others. When crises hit we come together collaboratively in our humanitarian efforts, and that has been reflected in this crisis.

[Lord Naseby (Con)]

I declare an interest as having family on the Cayman Islands.

Is my noble friend clear that forward planning was missing? The Government have available remote sensing and satellite technology, which give a wonderful forward look into today’s world. That technology indicated that this was not an ordinary hurricane but the largest and most damaging that nature has seen. It therefore does not take a genius to work out that there will be devastation.

I can say as a former RAF pilot that I am surprised that RAF Brize Norton was not immediately on standby, with its aircraft loaded, so that the minute the hurricane struck the islands that have been mentioned they would take off. It takes the best part of 10 hours to get out there so, by the time they got there, there would have definitely been places to land. Why were they not ready? That is the key question.

Sixteen minutes ago, I believe, the Premier of the Cayman Islands, along with a number of medical teams, back-up facilities and medical facilities, arrived on their own Boeing-345 or 347. As far as I can see, they are providing considerably more medical back-up than we in the UK have provided so far.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

On my noble friend’s final point, I was aware of that and, of course, that has been co-ordinated with the visit of the Foreign Secretary to the islands. I have already acknowledged that the support from the Cayman Islands has been greatly appreciated. Returning to a point made earlier by the noble Lord, Lord West, who is not in his place at the moment, I say that we are co-ordinating with our partners and all countries across the region to ensure that aid is provided in the quickest way along the quickest route possible.

On the issue of the state of preparedness, the noble Lord, Lord Naseby, is right about satellite technology but, equally, as he will know from his own experience—and as we have seen with the path of Hurricane Irma—tracking a hurricane is not scientific in itself because it can change direction. That said, of course there are always things that can be learned from any experience and a full assessment will be made in the medium term. However, as I am sure my noble friend appreciates, the immediate need is about ensuring that the priorities required in the overseas territories and the wider Caribbean are met. I can assure him that we are responding accordingly across the board.