Saudi Arabia: Human Rights

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Lamont of Lerwick

Wednesday 4th September 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I shall write to the noble Lord on his second question, but he is quite right to raise the judgment. There were three rulings: two were in favour of the Government and one, as he rightly articulated, has gone to appeal. We disagree with the judgment. However, due process is being followed and I stress again that we have adhered to the undertaking to grant no new licences. On how much has been exported under existing licences, I shall write to the noble Lord.

[Lord Lamont of Lerwick (Con)]

My Lords, have the Government monitored the trial of those who have been arrested and prosecuted for the murder of Mr Khashoggi in Turkey? Is that trial being held in public? Are the accused being given lawyers and are we satisfied that they are the real culprits and not carrying the responsibility for someone else?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, as my noble friend knows, the Government have condemned Jamal Khashoggi’s killing in the strongest possible terms and we have continued to raise our deepest concerns. As referred to by my noble friend Lady Anelay, at the most recent Human Rights Council, as Human Rights Minister, I asked for the issue to be put into the UPR—universal periodic review—of Saudi Arabia. It was clearly understood that the detention and, as in this case, the murder of journalists is taken very seriously by the United Kingdom Government. As I said earlier, we continue to make representations to attend trials as part of an international observer group. Trial observation demonstrates to host Governments not just our continued interest in but adherence to legal procedures. I assure my noble friend that the United Kingdom has been clear that we need accountability for the horrific murder of the journalist Jamal Khashoggi, and we expect Saudi Arabia to take action to ensure that such violations are never repeated.

Bahrain

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Lamont of Lerwick

Wednesday 24th July 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

The noble Lord is right to raise the issue of executions and the death penalty. My understanding is that, between 2010 and now, there have been three executions, which are three too many and we continue, of course, to express concern. The noble Lord and I generally find ourselves in agreement on human rights issues, but I differ from him in that I believe the support we give Bahrain is helping to safeguard women’s rights. Women’s organisations are active in Bahrain and freely run campaigns calling for equality, especially on sexual health rights, but this does not take away from the facts. Do issues and serious concerns remain? Of course they do, but I believe that our engagement helps address those issues. Engagement and support, particularly in training—ensuring that the training and standards of people responsible for these institutions is at a high level—are a way forward; not doing that training, I believe, would be a step backward.

[Lord Lamont of Lerwick (Con)]

Could my right honourable friend say what progress has been made on improving the rights of the Shia population, who, after all, are the majority? In the past it has always been alleged that the top jobs in the military and the public sector have not been available to the Shia population and that there is in fact discrimination against the group that constitutes the majority of the population.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I thank my noble friend, who seems to have promoted me to the Privy Council by addressing me as his right honourable friend. He is right to raise the issue of the Shia majority. I assure him that reforms have taken place, including the reinstatement of citizenship for members of the Shia community. However, I share with him the deep concern that the Shia majority remains unequal in its representation and its ability to gain the kind of access that the Sunni minority has. That is an issue that we continue to raise. We will continue to work with Bahrain. Bahrain is a partner and we have many strategic interests. I believe that lends itself to being able to raise these issues of deep concern with the authorities.

Wilton Park

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Lamont of Lerwick

Wednesday 15th May 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Lamont of Lerwick (Con)]

My Lords, does the Minister agree that by merit of having been an MP for 20 years, having been born in Germany, being a privy counsellor and having demonstrated great courage in politics, Gisela Stuart is an ideal person to fill this post? Is this not a rather mean-minded Question? Can he explain the criteria for membership of the Low Pay Commission, the Equal Opportunities Commission and the Women’s National Commission, on all of which the noble Baroness, Lady Prosser, has served?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, first, I am sure that many in this House and beyond regard Ms Stuart as a very able chair. I have dealt with her in her capacity as chair of Wilton Park and have certainly found her attitude and thinking conducive to what Wilton Park seeks to achieve. As I said, her appointment followed the correct code of conduct: an appropriate panel was appointed, it made recommendations and a decision was taken accordingly. I believe that she is a very capable chair. As my noble friend articulated, she has the right experience. For all public appointments, a clear process is set out, and that was followed in this case as well.

Iran Nuclear Deal

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Lamont of Lerwick

Wednesday 8th May 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

On the noble Lord’s final point, transatlantic solidarity is an important attribute but there are times when we differ. We have not waited for the arrival of the President of the United States to make clear our differing perspectives on the JCPOA and our other differences. The noble Lord will be aware that Secretary of State Pompeo is currently visiting London and has had various meetings with the Foreign Office, including with my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary, at which this issue was discussed with him. Our view remains clear: we need to work to ensure that the JCPOA remains on the table; we need to ensure that the SPV alleviates the suffering of the Iranian people; we remain committed to the SPV, along with our European partners; and we differ from the United States in our approach in this respect.

[Lord Lamont of Lerwick (Con)]

My Lords, I draw attention to my entry in the register of interests: I am the trade envoy to Iran and chairman of the British Iranian Chamber of Commerce. Although this is a very gloomy development, is it not important to remember that President Rouhani said in the statement referred to that Iran does not intend and does not want to withdraw from the JCPOA, but wants it to persist? Is it not the case that the International Atomic Energy Agency has certified that Iran is fully compliant with the agreement on no fewer than 11 or 12 occasions? One must draw the conclusion that Iran has been pushed to react by the extra sanctions and the aggressive action of the United States in trying to reduce Iran’s exports to zero, which would have a devastating impact on living standards in the country. The Minister said that the Government remain committed to the JCPOA, but does he acknowledge that the SPV that has been set up—I acknowledge the great efforts of civil servants to make it work—is extremely limited? It is restricted to food and medicines; that is all. It does not obviate the need for a bank when doing business with Iran. In fact, not a single transaction has been made under the mechanism so far; something much more ambitious must happen if there is to be any trade between Europe and Iran.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

On my noble friend’s final point, no trade has happened yet because the SPV is not yet operational. We continue to work on its technical detail. My noble friend is right to mention President Rouhani’s declaration that he is keen to ensure that the JCPOA, a working agreement, remains on the table. The United Kingdom shares that aspiration. Therefore, a 60-day window still exists; we hope that no other steps to change the situation we currently face will be taken during that time. As I said in the Statement, we regret the announcement from Tehran but it is important that we continue to look at how we can work through the challenges we face. Equally, we must look at the SPV’s creation and initiation of the process; for example, my noble friend talked about medicines and humanitarian aid, which are important, but this is also about looking at agricultural products and consumer goods. It is important that we continue to work to ensure that the SPV becomes operational.

Jamal Khashoggi

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Lamont of Lerwick

Tuesday 23rd October 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

As the noble Lord will know, the stated position from Germany is not a new one: it is a restatement by Chancellor Merkel of the statement she made earlier. Angela Merkel has been clear in reiterating that she will keep to that approach. As I said earlier in response to the question from the noble Lord, Lord Collins, we await the full outcome of the Turkish investigation and once we have all the facts in front of us, we will act accordingly.

[Lord Lamont of Lerwick (Con)]

My Lords, the Minister said that it is important that a situation like this does not arise again. Does he recall that in quite a long BBC documentary, it was alleged that there were several other cases—not quite as dreadful as this—of people who were critical of the Saudi Arabian Government being kidnapped, taken back to Saudi Arabia and disappearing? Secondly, is the point the noble Lord, Lord Wallace, made not a good one? We talk about our close relationship, but as he said, who is dependent on whom depends on which way you look at it. Is there not a strong case that we ought to diversify our arms sales so that they are not so dependent—40%—on one country?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

To take my noble friend’s second point first, I believe that the bilateral trade between our Governments stands at £9 billion. However, as he says, on the overall position of the UK and our trading relationships, notwithstanding the nature of the case we are discussing, it is important that we have a diversified view.

On his point about this never happening again, he is right to raise the tragic consequences of this. We repeatedly return to the issue of journalists and press freedom in your Lordships’ House, in the context not just of Saudi Arabia but of other countries as well. The important point in this case is what further steps we can take in this respect. The international condemnation which has followed this crime is clear for all to see. On the other steps we are taking that I can share with my noble friend, I mentioned earlier my capacity as Human Rights Minister, and we are reviewing the exact statements we will make and the questions we will raise in the universal periodic review of Saudi Arabia, which is due on 5 November in Geneva. I assure my noble friend that as a priority, we will raise with the Saudis in international fora the issue of press freedom and the freedom of journalists to criticise a country and an Administration. As to whether we can ensure that this will never happen again, that would be a tall claim for anyone to make. The tragic nature of these issues means that we must be strong in our condemnation, and when the full facts are presented, we must act accordingly.

Visit to Oman, UAE and Iran

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Lamont of Lerwick

Monday 11th December 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord Lamont of Lerwick (Con)]

My Lords, I refer to my entry in the Register of Lords’ Interests, being both the chairman of the British-Iranian Chamber of Commerce and the Government’s trade envoy to Iran. I wholeheartedly agree with what is being said about Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe and Mr Foroughi. I have been in touch with Mr Foroughi’s son about this tragic case.

First, will my noble friend confirm that, on 14 and 15 January, President Trump has to decide whether to waive the sanctions against Iran under the nuclear deal? If he fails to do this, secondary sanctions, which have been lifted in the United States, will spring back into action, and that will legally be a breach of the JCPOA, and will certainly be regarded by Iran as such. That will make it even more difficult for Europe to trade further with Iran.

Secondly, on the question of the Iranian embassy bank account, have the Government considered using the Bank of England there? Does it have sovereign immunity? It is difficult to imagine the Bank of England being prosecuted by the American authorities.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, my noble friend speaks from a deep knowledge of the bilateral relationship between the United Kingdom and Iran, and I commend his efforts. He raises the important issue of the nuclear deal. We have certainly been clear. I alluded earlier to the fact that the Prime Minister has been very clear to President Trump on the implications of the decision of the United States. On the specific dates my noble friend mentioned, I shall check the implications and what is pending. I believe that he is correct. The United States, not being part of the nuclear agreement, puts strain on the continuing sustainability of that deal. In saying that, I refer to a point I made earlier: it makes it even more vital to consolidate our efforts and collaborate with other partners, including our efforts through the E3 to ensure that the deal is sustained.

On my noble friend’s point on the Bank of England’s status vis-à-vis the bank account, perhaps I can write to him. Having spent 20 years in financial services, I know that various rules and regulations govern both the central bank and other private banks that may be operating.