Solar Power (Feed-in Tariff)

John Robertson Excerpts

Wednesday 23rd November 2011 Commons Chamber

[Chris Huhne]

By all means, the hon. Gentleman should give us the details of exactly that sort of issue, which we will consider as part of the consultation. However, his constituent might have been better served if there was a proper energy efficiency audit of her home so that she could make substantial energy savings beforehand.

[John Robertson (Glasgow North West) (Lab)]

You don’t know what his constituent did.

[Chris Huhne]

We do not, but we do know that under the scheme promoting solar PVs or the scheme that was launched by the Labour Government in April 2010, there was a link to energy efficiency.

[John Robertson]

You’re making it up.

[Chris Huhne]

Opposition Members are getting terribly shirty about this, but there was a link to energy efficiency and that link was abolished with the introduction of the scheme by the right hon. Member for Doncaster North, the Leader of the Opposition, when he was the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change in April 2010. We need to deal with that.

There are more efficient ways to clean our energy supplies and grow our green industries than using consumers’ energy bills to support one industry at well over the market rate. If we did nothing, by 2014-15 feed-in tariffs for solar PV would cost consumers about £1 billion a year. If we are to succeed in building a low-carbon economy, we must make sure that we show people that we are committed to value for money.

It is precisely because this Government are committed to a sustainable, long-term future for clean energy that we propose revising tariffs now. Encouraging a minority of companies to feast on bumper profits for six months, swallowing up the entire feed-in tariff budget for a four-year period, would be the acme of short-termism. It is worth keeping things in perspective.

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[Chris Huhne]

We would like to do that, but the legal basis for doing so is simply not there in the scheme that was introduced by the last Labour Government.

[John Robertson]

Change it.

[Chris Huhne]

Well, we could do that, but it would have to be part of the longer-term consultation on the comprehensive review, which we will carry out.

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[John Robertson (Glasgow North West) (Lab)]

This has been an interesting debate. I wonder whether some Government Members live in the real world. The hon. Member for North Cornwall (Dan Rogerson) thinks the Germans will watch the debate, but I wonder how many will. He seemed to get excited because people will be worse off than they are now. The Secretary of State seems quite happy that jobs in the industry will go, and tells us that the industry will grow when everything else is not growing.

We should get back to what this is all about, which is looking after the people who need looking after. Thirteen and a half thousand of my constituents border on fuel poverty. I care about them more than I care about whether solar power is put into houses or whether the money for that is right or wrong. For those people to get their energy, and to ensure they can afford it, we must have solar power, wind farms and everything else that can send power into their homes to help to keep the lights on and give them cheaper energy.

[Katy Clark]

Will my hon. Friend give way?

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[John Robertson]

I am not going to give way. Government Members give way to waste time. Let them do it. We will make sure that we say what needs to be said. They can play games.

I should like to move on to fuel poverty, which is what I believe we are here to talk about, and people who will die. I asked the Secretary of State earlier whether the tax taken from the big six and the reduction in the money for solar power are worth the 2,700 lives that will be lost this year owing to the Government’s energy policies, but he never answered me. I am willing to allow him to intervene if he wants to tell me that his policies are worth more than 2,700 lives. We all hear that deafening silence. The money that the Government get from the tax and from reducing solar energy will amount to 2,700 lives. That is what the Hills report says, and the Secretary of State agreed with me when he was questioned about it.

[Chris Huhne]

The hon. Gentleman is completely misguided to quote the Hills report, which I commissioned because I want a real effort made to combat fuel poverty, which was not happening in the past few years; we saw fuel poverty increase under the Labour Government. He is quite wrong to say that I am not concerned about the big six. We want a competitive market. That is why we are introducing extra consumer safeguards, and why we are making the retail and wholesale markets more competitive.

[John Robertson]

I can only use the right hon. Gentleman’s own words. He told me that the Hills report said that 27,000 extra people would die this winter, and that 10% of those deaths would be down to the Government’s energy policies. That will be in Hansard for hon. Members to read for themselves. I asked him whether lives were worth more than the tax money, and he never answered me.

At the end of the day, people will make the difference. The Government cannot be trusted. If people cannot trust the Government or what they are saying, how can they move forward? There lies the biggest problem. The 13,500 pensioners who are approaching fuel poverty in my constituency, and the disabled people who need extra help, will not be able to work out whether they can trust the Government to see them through this winter. Everything that has been mentioned is for next year, not this winter, but we need to solve the problems this winter.

The money spent on solar power would have helped in the long term to keep people in jobs, to stimulate growth in industry and to get money circulating in the country, but the Government are cutting it. They want to halve the amount of money that would circulate. They want to halve everything. My hon. Friends the Members for Ayr, Carrick and Cumnock (Sandra Osborne) and for Dumfries and Galloway (Mr Brown) told us about their constituents who, through no fault of their own, will be caught up in this system and will find that they cannot afford what they thought they were going to get, although they did do their risk management.

When the Secretary of State was having a go at my hon. Friend the Member for Dumfries and Galloway, I asked him how he knew that the person in question had not done a risk assessment or worked out the financial situation, and he replied, “Well, I don’t.” So there we have it: we have a Secretary of State who makes policy on the hoof and statements that contradict my hon. Friend, who knows his constituent and knows the situation, and says that my hon. Friend is wrong—and then, when asked from a sedentary position, “How do you know the constituent didn’t do that?” turns round and says, “Well, I don’t.” He is basically saying, “I just don’t care.”

We see it more and more. We have a Government who always use the excuse, “It’s somebody else’s fault. A big boy did it and ran away.” That is their modus operandi. That is what they do. It is always somebody else’s fault and never their fault, but unfortunately it is the people who Labour Members, in particular, represent who will suffer at the end of the day. I want to ensure that the 2,700 extra people who might die this winter do not, but the sad truth is that this Government do not care, and never will care. That is why the people on this side of the House are better than them.

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[Nicky Morgan (Loughborough) (Con)]

I will try to be brief as I know that many Members want to take part in this important debate.

I do not agree with much that the hon. Member for Glasgow North West (John Robertson) said—

[John Robertson]

That’s a surprise!

[Nicky Morgan]

Exactly. However, I do agree with the hon. Gentleman that this debate is about people. We are talking about our constituents: those who generate energy, those who consume energy, and those who are innovators in the industry.

We have all been diligent constituency MPs this afternoon and have mentioned a number of constituents who have contacted us to say they are affected by this issue. I could talk about Mr and Mrs Willett, who have agreed to install a photovoltaic system with an installation date of 9 January 2012. I could talk about the company PG Plumbing and Heating Ltd in my constituency; it wants me to put a question to the Minister, and I will come back to that. I could talk about Loughborough Solar Technologies, which has contacted me, or the company C Gascoigne, which I mentioned when I asked the Minister a question earlier. I could also mention SmartGen. I thought I should mention all of them so that they can say, “Yes, she’s done what she should do as our constituency MP.” They are all affected by this decision, and they all have questions for the Minister. However, the key point is that this is ultimately about people—about people when they come to pay their energy bills, as my hon. Friend the Member for Dudley South (Chris Kelly) said.

All the political parties have agreed that there was a need for change. The feed-in tariff scheme as left to us by the previous Government did not add up. The shadow Secretary of State said there would have been a review, but as the Secretary of State pointed out, the last Government had not planned to undertake that review until 2013, which would have been too late.

What do we disagree on? Who is at fault. Is the need for change the fault of consumers who are prepared to generate energy and who wanted to install solar panels? Is it the fault of the companies that have taken advantage of the generous scheme that was on offer? No, the fact that we are having to change the scheme and affect the constituents who have contacted me as well as many others is the fault of the previous Government, who left us with a wholly unsustainable system.