Cervical Cancer Smear Tests

Debate between Helen Jones and Steve Brine

Monday 28th January 2019 Westminster Hall

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Health and Social Care (Steve Brine)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Sir Roger—I shall refer to you again in a moment. I feel somewhat outnumbered, along with the hon. Member for City of Chester (Christian Matheson) and my hon. Friend the Member for Henley (John Howell), but I am rather used to that, having chaired the all-party parliamentary group on breast cancer for five years with the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Washington and Sunderland West (Mrs Hodgson). We were often referred to as “Steve and the girls”.

I completely endorse the point by the hon. Member for Lanark and Hamilton East (Angela Crawley) that this is not a women’s issue. Natasha, whom I will come to in a moment, had four children—two of each. It is very much a boys’ issue for them, as it is across the board. [Interruption.] We may have heard the B-word only once during the debate, but I could have sworn I just heard something from outside. I must be imagining things.

It has been a privilege to be part of this debate. It is only right that I start by expressing my sincerest condolences to the family and friends of Natasha Sale, who tragically passed away in December. I know I speak on behalf of all Members present when I say that our thoughts are with her family and friends. Anybody who has lost a loved one to cancer knows the pain and anguish that the family are experiencing due to Natasha’s loss. As somebody who has fought and lost more than I have won, I am one of those people. In some of the coverage of Natasha’s death, I saw a quote from Amanda Scott, her best friend, who said:

“God only takes the best”.

I thought that was a lovely quote. We have heard that many times before, but I was interested in how that was reported.

As the Minister responsible for public health and cancer, cancer prevention and early diagnosis are vital priorities for me. I am delighted to see Natasha’s army here today. I saw the pictures on the bus on social media this morning, with some interesting hand signals—I must ask them about that. It is very good to see them all here. I hope they know, as Members know, that I will continue wholeheartedly to support the efforts of the NHS and Public Health England, which I hold to account, and of all our excellent cancer charities, which work as part of team cancer to prevent cancer and reduce the number of families who have to go through what Natasha’s family is going through.

There have been so many interesting speeches. Luckily, for once I have time to touch on a number of them, if not all of them. I was very interested in the point made by the hon. Member for Darlington (Jenny Chapman) about the data showing that take-up is better in the north-east than almost anywhere else. I was interested in what she had to say about the reasons behind that. The NHS as a system too infrequently talks to Members of Parliament, who know their areas better than most. I will ask Sir Mike Richards to contact her, perhaps along with the hon. Member for City of Chester, who is obviously still waiting for an introduction. I am very happy to facilitate that. Her other point was about access, which many Members mentioned. I will ensure that her very good point about disabled women is fed into Sir Mike Richards’s review, and I encourage her to raise that with him when she sees him.

[Ian Austin in the Chair]

I will come to the hon. Member for Warrington North (Helen Jones), who introduced the debate on behalf of the Petitions Committee, because many of the points she raised will come up in my speech. I was pleased that my hon. Friend the Member for Henley talked about the “Be Clear on Cancer” campaign and the new Public Health England campaign that will be rolled out next month. He mentioned the role of GPs in those campaigns. “Be Clear on Cancer” is a public-facing campaign, but elements of it relate to GP education, which I will come to. He often makes very good points in our debates, and I thank him for raising that topic. The hon. Member for Rotherham (Sarah Champion) also mentioned GP understanding, which I will touch on.

The hon. Member for Livingston (Hannah Bardell) made a very personal speech. She said she is awaiting results, and I think I speak for everyone when I say we wish her well. We will be thinking of her, and our fingers are crossed for her. She made a point about the trans community, which I had not heard mentioned in this context. NHS England has published clear guidance for trans men—people who have changed from female to male. Trans men who still have a cervix and have not had a hysterectomy remain entitled to screening. If a trans man is still registered with their GP as a female, they will continue to receive invitations for screening. If they are registered as a male, they remain eligible for screening but will not automatically be invited. The guidance makes clear that trans men need to request screening from their GP. I thank her for raising that point, which is another that I want to feed into Sir Mike’s screening review.

The hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull West and Hessle (Emma Hardy) made a brilliant speech, as always. She should be on the stage. The rather unconventional advice surgery she talked about may not catch on, but I enjoyed hearing about it. We constituency MPs all dread somebody saying, “I’m sure I know you from somewhere.” She talked about education, particularly in schools. Public Health England has a range of materials aimed at providing teenagers and their parents with information about things such as the HPV vaccination programme. She will know that the Department for Education is also working on new relationships and sex education guidance. Its consultation closed in November. That guidance, which will include input from Health Education England, will be published in the first half of this year.

I took the Teenage Cancer Trust and CoppaFeel!—a breast cancer charity with possibly the best name of any cancer charity—to see my right hon. Friend the Minister for School Standards at the end of last year. We were very keen to make the point to them that we must improve awareness in schools of health, bodies and particularly cancers, but in a balanced way that educates children about warning signs without frightening the life out of them. I think we have struck that balance, and I think Members will be pleased when they see that guidance rolled out in the first half of 2019.

[Helen Jones]

Will the Minister tell us whether that guidance includes educating young girls about the need to go for smear tests? Some of Natasha’s friends have forcefully made the point to me that if we do that, it may encourage girls to go for smear tests when they reach the age for screening.

[Steve Brine]

I cannot tell the hon. Lady that, but I will find out and write to her and other Members who in the debate. It is not my policy area—obviously I am not the Minister of State for School Standards—but it is a good point and it would seem logical that that is done in consultation with the Department of Health and Social Care and with Health Education England.

To go to the heart of where I want to start, the hon. Member for City of Chester talked about a constituent being refused a smear test. He said that it would be simple for a Minister to change the regulations and said that this was an example of the system not doing what we direct it to do. As the shadow Minster said, the system should already do that. It would not be appropriate to go into individual instances, but it is important to understand that cervical screening is a screening test and not a diagnostic test. It aims to detect abnormalities of the cervix that if left undetected may develop into cancer, so it is preventative. Cervical screening is not appropriate for women with symptoms, but if women of any age, including under-25s, have unusual symptoms or abnormal bleeding, they should consult their GP immediately and they should be treated under the NHS and initially offered a speculum examination in accordance with the National Institute for Health and Care Excellence guidance for primary care. If that is not happening and if that were one of my constituents, I would be taking that up through the procedures that the hon. Gentleman will know about as an experienced constituency MP. I think that is clear.

The hon. Gentleman also touched on the petition. To be clear, the petition is entitled:

“Lower the age for smear tests from 25 to 18 to prevent cervical cancer.”

He is right to raise the point about women requesting that. We do not often hear about “Liberating the NHS: No decision about me, without me” in the House these days, but it is still very much alive. I would encourage him to take that case up, as I would encourage any other Member who runs into that issue to do.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Helen Jones and Steve Brine

Tuesday 27th November 2018 Commons Chamber

[Helen Jones (Warrington North) (Lab)]

Access to services is very important for those in the poorest areas of my constituency. Warrington Hospital has been losing services over time, but it has now sought to become a cancer hub for north Cheshire. Will the Minister ensure that, in the case of such applications, access to services for the poorest people is considered along with other factors?

[Steve Brine]

Yes, we are interested in access to services for all people, wherever they are on the income scheme. The hon. Lady is right to raise that issue. We need to do better on cancer diagnosis, so I would be interested to hear more about the cancer hub that she mentions.