Social Economy

Debate between David Simpson and Hazel Blears

Tuesday 2nd September 2014 Westminster Hall

[Hazel Blears]

Everyone has to have a bit of fun now and again. I am sure they kept a close eye on me when I helped to service the Volvo. I did not realise until afterwards that the young man who helped me had very serious mental health problems. He had been detained at Broadmoor for a significant period of time, yet that organisation, because it was prepared to take risks and believe in people, was able to do something that virtually no other organisation could. Ronnie Wilson, who runs that organisation, does a fabulous job.

Having said all that—those organisations are brilliant—there is much more that the Government can do to bring social enterprises to the mainstream. On each of my three issues, I will go through a couple of specific points, for the Minister and for my Front Bench team, with whom I have had the opportunity to discuss some of this. At the next election, the manifestos of all political parties need to have some specific and concrete offers to social enterprise, social value and social investment, if we are to build the social economy we want to see.

On social enterprises, I want to see the social sector established with a clear corporate identity. I want it to have respect and to be seen as the place to go to for creative, innovative solutions. That is the first point. The Government say, “There are lots of problems that we cannot solve. We need you to come into this space and begin to help us do that.” That is starting to happen, and it needs to happen more clearly.

[David Simpson (Upper Bann) (DUP)]

On a point of clarification on social enterprises in the right hon. Lady’s constituency, are there any links between further education colleges or educational institutions and young people who have difficulties?

[Hazel Blears]

The hon. Gentleman raises an extremely good point. We have some links. We certainly have some enterprise models in some of our schools, academies and FE colleges. In the past, that would have simply been a small business option, but a social enterprise option is increasingly coming through. I find—I am sure we all see this—that more and more young people want values. They want to go home at the end of the day and be proud of what they have done and who they work for. That is why one in three start-ups across Europe is a social business. Young people with the best talent want to work in those organisations. That brings me back to my first point, which is that there is a business case for social enterprise. If a business wants the best talent, it has to have a social mission at its heart, so that young people are proud of what they have done at work.

First, we need a real recognition that social enterprise is a corporate form that can solve problems. Secondly, we need to look at financial incentives that can help to grow social enterprises—such as tax reliefs or looking at business rates again—so that we can incubate and grow the kind of organisations that can help us. Thirdly, we need to work with the European Union and look at state aid issues. An exemption for social enterprises and charities would make a huge difference and lift the burden of reporting requirements from this sector, which often cannot cope with some of the bureaucracy that bigger businesses can cope with. I will come to Europe in a minute, because Europe is doing great things in this arena, but the exemption is one more thing that we could do.

Moving on to social value—I am conscious of time—I pay tribute to the hon. Member for Warwick and Leamington. He has done an absolutely superb job in taking through the social value legislation in the House. The legislation will be game-changing. It will last and be hugely influential. We will look back in 10 years’ time and say, “Why did we not do it 30 years’ ago?” It is a market leader for many other countries across Europe and the world, which are now talking about doing similar things. I went to the Isle of Man to talk to some people about social value. Their Parliament does not half work quickly. I went to a Saturday conference and a Saturday night dinner, where I made a speech. On Monday morning, one of the Members of the Tynwald came up to me with a draft four-clause Bill. He said, “Would you like to come with me to Parliament, and we will present it?” It was amazing. I hope the Isle of Man will get a social value Act as well.

I was pleased to be associated with the legislation, which is incredibly important, but there is more we can do. I held a round table this year with people from the private sector, local authorities, social enterprises and the voluntary sector. We presented the then Minister for Civil Society, the hon. Member for Ruislip, Northwood and Pinner, with a lengthy report on the issues that had been highlighted. I am more than happy to talk to the new Minister for Civil Society, the hon. Member for Braintree (Mr Newmark) about that round table and some of the practical things we can do. I am delighted that more and more local authorities are putting social value clauses in their contracts and their procurement. That always used to be completely forbidden under European Union law. The EU has done a 360° turn and is now saying that not only can these social clauses be put in, but that they should be put in. That is amazing. I went to a procurement conference in Brussels with 1,000 procurement officials from across the European Union—it shows my dedication to duty that I went to a Brussels procurement conference—and to see those officials enthused by the possibility of being able to do good in how they use procurement was heart-warming and amazing.

In the European Union, Commissioner Andor has been hugely instrumental, as has President Barroso, and the whole agenda has been embraced. Commissioner Andor is coming to Salford on 22 September, where we are organising a round table for him to look at what more can be done in Europe to take forward the social value provisions on procurement and the social investment agenda. We are running with the grain, but there is more that we can do on social value.

One of the big issues is measurement and data, because everyone is doing the social economy now, but there are 57 varieties in how it might be measured. While there is inconsistency and uncertainty, it is difficult for people to get on a level playing field. I am not in favour of rigidity or one-size-fits-all. Part of the beauty of the agenda is that things develop and grow, but we need some core agreement on consistent principles for measuring social impact and social value, so that those who are tendering know exactly what they have to put in and so that those who reply to those tenders and provide services know how they can shape those services to have the best chance of winning a tender. This is a plea to the Minister: we have to have consistent principles and grounds for the measurement of value.

Guy Battle, who used to work for Deloitte and now has the Sustainable Business Partnership, has done some great work in setting up a social value portal, looking at measurement, metrics and developing the whole agenda. I think that he is someone who the Minister would want to meet and consult. The manifesto asks for social value including trying to ensure that we have some consistent principles and standardised measurement. Secondly, can we look at ensuring that social value clauses are included and given equal consideration to other criteria, or at least some clear weighting? People are saying to me, “We do not know whether the weighting is five points, 10 points or 15 points. We are very unsure about how to design our contracts.” The third ask—this is perhaps slightly more radical, but I believe it is essential—is to extend the Public Services (Social Value) Act 2012 from services to goods and infrastructure. The big spend in the next 15 to 20 years will not be on revenue, because we all know that money is tight; the big spend will be on big infrastructure projects, such as High Speed 2 and a new airport, wherever that might be, whether it is in the estuary or not. It is about the big rail developments and all those big infrastructure projects. If we can include social value clauses about local labour, using local supply chains and having a social impact in all those big infrastructure projects, imagine the prize that awaits. Now that Europe says that we can do it, we should extend social value legislation to include infrastructure and goods.

My final points are on social investment and I draw attention to my unpaid interest that is in the Register of Members’ Financial Interests with regard to Big Society Capital. Social investment is an exciting area of development. We had a G8 forum this year on social investment and Britain is clearly a global leader. We have more social investment than anywhere else with 15 in operation and 50 in development. The US and Australia have five each only. It is fantastic to be a global leader and to be better than America for once, much of which is down to the former Minister.

Social investment is exciting because it is new, but I recognise that money will be tight for whoever is in government after the next election. There will not be much public money around, so if we are to continue to reform, transform and improve public services, as well as the private sector, we will have to find new sources of finance to facilitate some of that transformation. I want to give one quick example. I do a lot of work on dementia and I have an idea that we could get social investment into dementia care to support community-based interventions to keep more people at home, so that they do not end up in the acute sector, which is the worst possible place for them. Dementia sufferers stay twice as long in the acute sector as people without dementia, they get readmitted twice as often and they die more often, all of which costs the NHS a fortune. If we can get social investment in and keep people well in the community, their lives will be better, their families’ and carers’ lives will be better and the acute sector will save money. The reason why that does not happen is because the money of clinical commissioning groups is all tied up in the acute sector. If we can get social investment, which would allow some headroom for double-running, community interventions, such as gardening, singing, befriending and buddying, can be scaled up. There is an emerging evidence base that such activities are effective and can lead to a virtuous circle.

I am meeting the Minister of State, Department of Health, the right hon. Member for North Norfolk (Norman Lamb) next Tuesday with Big Society Capital and the Social Investment Business and I hope that we can do something here. It will require courage and determination from the whole system, but the prize is worth having. We had a G8 forum on social investment and we had a G8 forum on dementia, which is the biggest global health challenge. It would be amazing if we could use this new global finance to tackle that challenge. We must cross our fingers and watch this space and see how far we get with that. It is exciting and is an illustration of what we could do.

I have some more manifesto asks. I have discussed them with my Front-Bench team and I am more than happy to send the Minister some detailed analysis. On social investment, we could look at charitable trustees’ investment decisions and give them the confidence that they can perfectly properly take social considerations into account when investing money. It is ludicrous that charities are not allowed to consider social impacts. We could make it clear that pension funds can also consider social reasons for investment rather than always having to get the best price and the most money. If we start to motivate charitable foundations and pension funds, the amounts of money could be massive, but we are not utilising them to their fullest extent. We could have a social investor exemption from the Financial Services and Markets Act 2000 (Financial Promotion) Order 2005, so that retail people can learn about social investment. When we get a social investment ISA, we will have broken through all the bureaucracy and it will be an everyday thing. I want such an ISA because I want my investment to do good as well. That is where we need to be. On tax incentives, we have the social investment tax relief, which is a great step from the Government, but let us ensure that it is broad enough to enable collaborative funding and new structures, such as social investment bonds and funds. We could also simplify the community investment tax relief to ensure that intermediaries can quickly get money and get it out to those who need it.

The previous Labour Government started a plan, which has been carried on by the coalition, to use money in dormant bank accounts. There are other funds to which we could extend that idea, such as insurance, long-term investments and unclaimed gambling winnings. There is a lot more money out there that we could bring in. Instead of lying dormant and being wasted, it could be used to tackle some of our biggest social problems, so I ask the Minister and my Front-Bench team to consider that.

Finally on social investment, I want to discuss local impact funds. The Social Investment Business has been developing local funds to enable relatively small amounts of money to go to local organisations. The money that comes from social investment can sometimes involve big numbers, but there are many small organisations that need small grants. The first local impact fund was launched in Liverpool some two months ago, and of the 39 local enterprise partnerships, 11 have already said that they want local impact funds. This is a fabulous opportunity. The next round of European Union structural funds is coming with the proviso that 20% must be spent on social impact. Wow! What an opportunity to use EU funds to do good. That would rehabilitate the European Union in many people’s minds and even some of our not-very-pro-EU colleagues may think it a fabulous thing to do.

I am conscious that I have spoken for a long time, but I say to the Minister that I am delighted that he is in his role. He has a fabulous job. I have no doubt that he is raring to go and I am willing to give whatever help I can and the whole sector is willing to do the same. There are excellent companies out there in the marketplace. This is no fluffy public sector agenda; Fujitsu is examining its whole supply chain in terms of social impact and Interserve has recently invested in a social investment bond to fund a social innovation centre, which is amazing. Chief executives and chairmen really get this. The synergy of public, private, voluntary and mutual social enterprise is a powerful and irresistible idea. I ask the Minister to go with the grain and make his name—his mark—on this agenda.