Energy Bill [Lords]

Debate between Chris Skidmore and Andrew Bowie

Consideration of Lords message
Wednesday 18th October 2023 Commons Chamber

[Andrew Bowie]

I thank my right hon. and learned Friend for his intervention. Of course, I agree with him that pace is of the utmost importance in supporting community energy groups around the country, which is why the contact group has already met earlier this month and is engaging already on identifying the barriers that the consultation will seek to address and, thus, informing the Government as to what we need to do. That work is ongoing, which is why we do not feel that this amendment is required; we have begun that process already.

There are other issues with the amendment that mean we cannot support its inclusion in the Bill. The amendment would place an additional obligation on the Government to bring forward proposals to remove these barriers within a specific timeframe. As I just said, we cannot be sure what barriers will be raised in the consultation, or what the proper response to those barriers should be, until we have carried it out. We therefore cannot create a legislative obligation to remove barriers within a six-month timeframe when we are not aware of the nature of the barriers and have not yet properly analysed them.

[Chris Skidmore (Kingswood) (Con)]

I appreciate the Minister’s argument, but that is technically not what the amendment says; there is no requirement for legislative reform, only one to bring forward proposals. It is unfair to mislead the House—

[Chris Skidmore]

My apologies to the Minister. I did not mean to make accusations so strongly. The challenge here is that subsection (4) of the new clause set out in the amendment contains no reference to legislation such as the Minister suggested. That is my point.

[Andrew Bowie]

I thank my right hon. Friend for his intervention. It is the Department’s view and mine that the amendment would result in legislation being required. As I said, we absolutely understand the importance of this, which is why I launched the consultation process as I did. It is why we are engaging so closely with the sector and all interested parties so that we can get this consultation up and running and out as soon as possible, and identify those barriers preventing community energy groups from accessing the market. I know that he has a passion in this area and holds strong convictions on it. I would be happy to continue to work with him, alongside the community energy contact group, as we develop our proposals for the consultation.

I also wish to reassure the House that we will continue to work closely with the sector to support its important work, both through our existing support, including, for example, the £10 million community energy fund, and in carrying out the consultation, to which we have already committed.

Energy Charter Treaty

Debate between Chris Skidmore and Andrew Bowie

Tuesday 21st March 2023 Westminster Hall

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero (Andrew Bowie)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Gray, and to respond to my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingswood (Chris Skidmore) on such an important and pertinent topic. Thanks to his work in passing net zero legislation into law, and through his work on the review, the UK is committed to tackling climate change at home and internationally through our ambitious net zero targets and our international climate agreements, including the Paris agreement. I want to assure him of my personal commitment to achieving those goals, which I hope he knows already.

In an earlier intervention, the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) raised energy security in Northern Ireland. I urge him to hotfoot it back to this Chamber at 2.30 this afternoon when the hon. Member for Upper Bann (Carla Lockhart) has a debate very much focused on Northern Ireland and energy security for farmers. I look forward to seeing him there and we can continue our discussion.

The energy charter treaty was signed in 1994. It was originally designed to provide stability and certainty for those participating in cross-border trade and investment in the energy sector, particularly for investors operating in states with a less stable rule of law. It currently applies to more than 50 contracting parties. As my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingswood rightly says, the world and the energy sector have changed significantly since 1994, and there is wide recognition that the energy charter treaty has not kept pace.

Britain has long accepted that to remain relevant the energy charter treaty needs to be updated to reflect the current energy landscape. In its unmodernised form, it is focused on trade and investment in fossil fuels. Although renewables are in scope, it does not cover modern energy technologies such as hydrogen or carbon capture and storage. That is exactly why His Majesty’s Government have been such keen supporters of modernising the treaty; I dispute the characterisation from the hon. Member for Brighton, Pavilion (Caroline Lucas) that we are in any way complacent.

We have spent two years negotiating to align the treaty with today’s changing energy priorities and investment treaty practices, as well as international climate commitments, such as the Paris agreement. We took a leading role in pushing for additional safeguards for the sovereign right to introduce measures such as net zero and a flexible mechanism to allow parties to phase out investment protection for fossil fuels. To be clear, there were challenges to overcome in the renegotiation. It is a multilateral treaty across more than 50 states, each with different priorities on energy and climate. The UK was able to secure coverage for modern technologies, and provisions to ensure a stronger environmental, labour and climate focus.

[Chris Skidmore]

This is a factual question: who is the Minister going to negotiate with in a modernisation programme, when none of the European countries, including Germany, France, Spain, the Netherlands and Italy, will be in the room? Logically, there is no opportunity to discuss modernisation, because no one wants to discuss it. The Minister’s speech may have been written before the decisions taken by the EU last week or the week before were made public, but it is simply not logically possible to follow the pathway that the Minister is suggesting. It might have been possible last year, but it is certainly not anymore.

[Andrew Bowie]

I was not suggesting a pathway forward; I was giving a brief history of how we have got to the stage we are at. If my right hon. Friend hangs fire for two seconds, I will explain where we are going next.

Despite efforts to update the treaty, which the EU had supported us on, when it came to the final moment the European Union and its member states were unable to endorse adoption of the modernisation at the energy charter conference in November. That was unexpected and a great disappointment to those, including member states and the UK, that were championing modernisation. As such, several EU member states have now announced their intention to withdraw. We expect a decision on modernisation to be rescheduled when enough contracting parties are in a position for a vote to take place.

We must carefully assess the impact of the evolving situation to understand how best to take forward our priorities in relation to the treaty. Since the conference in November, the Government have monitored the public positions of other contracting parties, engaged with official-level negotiators from those parties, conducted further assessment and considered the views from stakeholders across business, civil society and Parliament. We are building all that information, engagement and analysis into an assessment, underway right now, of how the UK should respond to the current situation in the energy charter treaty. We will keep the House informed of any relevant developments as soon as we are able.

Whatever the final decision on our membership or the future of the treaty, the UK remains committed to addressing the urgent need for climate action at home and abroad. As such, I sincerely thank my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingswood for raising the issue.

Independent Review of Net Zero

Debate between Chris Skidmore and Andrew Bowie

Thursday 9th February 2023 Commons Chamber

[Chris Skidmore (Kingswood) (Con)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered the Independent Review of Net Zero.

I draw the House’s attention to my entry in the Register of Members’ Financial Interests, and should declare that I am the chair of the independent review of net zero that we are discussing. I thank the Backbench Committee and its Chair for agreeing to this debate. We had an excellent debate in the other place, led by Baroness Hayman, on the recommendations in the “Mission Zero” report, which was published on 13 January. Members may recall that the review was commissioned by the previous Administration, and the previous Prime Minister, my right hon. Friend the Member for South West Norfolk (Elizabeth Truss), in September 2022. The review’s remit was to allow us to understand how we can transition to net zero in a more affordable, efficient manner that is pro-business and pro-growth.

Having been appointed chair of the review, I undertook what I understand is perhaps the largest ever engagement exercise specifically on net zero conducted in Government. We received 1,800 written responses to our consultation. I held 52 roundtables, virtually and in person. I toured every region of England and every devolved nation of the UK, and spoke in person to around 1,000 people to understand directly the challenges and opportunities of energy transition for the UK. In that consultation, the message that I heard from the overwhelming majority of respondents was that when it comes to the opportunities that net zero and energy transition can bring to the UK, Westminster, Whitehall and Government are falling behind the curve. Thousands of infrastructure projects are ready to take place, and thousands of businesses see the opportunity in net zero.

The opportunities are not just national; 2022 marked a tipping point in international opportunities for green technology. First, Russia’s illegal war in Ukraine woke countries up to their dependency on foreign-owned gas and oil. We have to be able to provide domestic sources of energy in future. That is why interest in renewable and clean technologies has escalated. Not least, as the report was being prepared, the US passed its Inflation Reduction Act, which provides for $369 billion of investment in green and climate technologies for the future, and sets out a clear direction of travel, and a programmatic approach to investing in carbon capture, utilisation and storage technology, hydrogen, renewable power and new nuclear power. At the same time, the European Union has taken forward its “Fit for 55” programme, and has provided further detail of how it will invest up to €1 trillion in the European green deal.

The review comes at a time when we are at a crossroads. On the one hand, we could continue on our trajectory as leaders on climate policy. We were the first G7 country to sign net zero into law. We could carry on showing leadership, as the only major industrial nation that has been able to reduce its emissions by 40%. Or we could take the other turning—a turning that is not zero and would see us resile from our climate commitments, and from the investments that we have made. Ultimately, the choice of not zero will cost more than continuing in the direction of working towards net zero. That is the choice. I was the Minister at the Dispatch Box 43 months ago, taking forward legislation to ensure we could be the first G7 country to sign net zero into law. I thank the Under-Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero, my hon. Friend the Member for West Aberdeenshire and Kincardine (Andrew Bowie) for his commitment and congratulate him on his new role. I understand that this is probably his first debate as a Minister in the new Department for Energy Security and Net Zero. It may even be the first debate that the new Department responds to. I am delighted that we have a new Department with “Net Zero” in its title. I hope he enjoys reading the “Mission Zero” report. I am sorry it is 340 pages. I am not holding him to having read every page for this debate, but hopefully it will form part of his weekend box.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero (Andrew Bowie)]

Recess reading.

[Chris Skidmore]

It needs to be sooner than that. Basically, we have an opportunity now for the Government to look at the recommendations in the report.

The report is divided into two sections. The first part is a new narrative on net zero. As the chair of the net zero review team, I put on record my thanks to my fantastic team of 22 dedicated civil servants who were drawn from across all Departments. I can see one in the Box now, who is working with the Minister. If it was not for the team, we would not have produced a report of such quality. We set out a new narrative on net zero. It is not some kind of eco-project or religion, and I do not stand here thinking that I want the imposition from the centre of top-down policies. I recognise that the challenge we face is to ensure that everyone in society is able to see the opportunities of the energy transition for the future. There will be challenges, and the report is open about those challenges and costs. At the same time, there is an international opportunity: we are now in a global net zero race. We can either continue to lead or we will follow, and the cost of following will always be greater than the opportunity of showing first mover advantage. There are no free rider opportunities here.

[Chris Skidmore]

I had a fascinating opportunity to visit Belfast to hold two separate evidence roundtables. The first was with Belfast City Council, which gave me the public sector perspective on the challenges of decarbonisation and the public estate in Northern Ireland. The second roundtable was with private business and industry, with the Belfast chamber of trade and commerce. What I took from that opportunity to speak specifically about Northern Ireland’s concerns and opportunities was that there are challenges in Northern Ireland. In particular, it will probably achieve net zero later than 2050. On our overall UK net zero target, that is the case for both Northern Ireland and Wales. For Scotland, it will be a bit sooner, in 2045, as I am sure the Minister knows given that his constituency is at the forefront of bringing forward some of the green opportunities that will allow Scotland to go further and faster.

[Andrew Bowie]

indicated assent.

[Chris Skidmore]

A really important part of the report, which I will come on to in the moment, is taking a place-based approach to net zero. We will achieve net zero in a more affordable and efficient way if we allow local communities, whether they are cities or rural areas, the opportunity to be more empowered to understand how to achieve net zero in a way that suits their local communities.

In Northern Ireland, I listened to concerns about how agriculture could be decarbonised. Northern Ireland wants a whole raft of new biomethane plants. At the same time, there is a new fleet of hydrogen buses in Belfast—it is really pushing forward on fully decarbonising public transport. There was a fascinating discussion on how Northern Ireland wanted to be a leader on green hydrogen. It may not have much offshore wind, but there is a huge opportunity for onshore wind and for the use of hydrogen to drive a whole new economy. Picking up all the pieces that come together that demonstrate the opportunities in every region is exactly what the report tries to reflect.

The report sets out the new narrative that net zero is the primary economic opportunity of this century, but if we do not invest now—that investment is primarily private sector investment, but it needs certainty, clarity, consistency and continuity from the Government on policy—we will turn our backs on a potential £1 trillion of investment by 2030 and turn our backs on up to 480,000 new jobs by 2035. In a way, the net zero review is a bit of a misnomer. I was keen to look at the targets that have been set and to understand how we will realistically meet them. The worst thing one can do in politics is overpromise and underdeliver; it completely undermines confidence in the ability to deliver on our climate commitments and the energy transition.