Covid-19 Update

Caroline Lucas Excerpts

Thursday 17th September 2020 Commons Chamber

[Matt Hancock]

My right hon. Friend raises an important point about the mathematics and the science of testing. I am sure he would enjoy reading the annexes to the ONS report that comes out each Friday, which address directly the question how the ONS adjusts for potential false positives, due to the high but not perfect specificity of the polymerase chain reaction test. I am very happy for one of my academics to take him through the rigorous Bayesian mathematics, which I am sure will help to elucidate the debate on this matter still further.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

Because of the testing shambles, I understand that covid tests now have to be rationed to high-risk areas, but that comes at a time of increasing case numbers in Brighton and Hove, where a yellow alert has just been issued amid record cases last week. How will new outbreaks in currently deprioritised areas be identified and contained if we are not testing properly in the community? How will contact tracing function? I am really worried about the impact of the rationing of tests on our chances of knowing about and containing new outbreaks in other regions.

While I have the floor, I ask the right hon. Gentleman to condemn the comments of the Leader of the House about an hour ago, when he told the public to stop their “endless carping” about the lack of access to tests. It is not endless carping; it is genuine concern about people’s health.

[Matt Hancock]

Given the hon. Lady’s understandable concerns for her constituents, she should welcome the record testing capacity that we have and the more than 3,000 tests that have been done in Brighton in the last week.

Coronavirus Response

Caroline Lucas Excerpts

Monday 20th July 2020 Commons Chamber

[Matt Hancock]

I will bring the answer to that question to the Science and Technology Committee, which my right hon. Friend chairs, tomorrow. I commissioned an answer to precisely that question ahead of that appearance and was hoping that he would ask a different question today, but I have been found out.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

A test, trace and isolate system that holds public trust is vital, so can the Secretary of State explain why he considered the data protection impact assessment optional? How will he deal with mistakes that come to light, such as contact tracers sharing patient details on social media, as reported by The Sunday Times? In short, how will he increase trust in this essential system, given that bullish statements are no substitute for due diligence?

[Matt Hancock]

I will not be held back by bureaucracy. We made three data protection impact assessments, which cover all the necessary. I saw the report saying that we should have done one to cover all three, but we did the three and I think that will do the trick.

Covid-19 Update

Caroline Lucas Excerpts

Tuesday 5th May 2020 Commons Chamber

[Matt Hancock]

Yes.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green) [V]]

Can the Secretary of State confirm that directors of public health and environmental health officers will not just be consulted but will be leading the delivery of community tracking and tracing efforts, given that that is what they have been trained to do? Can he reassure us that the Government will not repeat the mistakes they have made with drive-through testing centres and PPE supplies by outsourcing those critical tasks to private companies such as Serco, Sodexo and Deloitte, which, frankly, have proved that they are not up to the job?

[Matt Hancock]

I agree with the hon. Lady on the first part of her question, but she is completely wrong on the second part. In the first part, she asked whether local public health officers and environmental health officers will be a critical part of test, track and trace, and the answer is yes, they will be vital. On the second part, she is completely wrong. There is no way that we could have delivered the testing programme without the unbelievable support, help and effort of private partners in the diagnostics industry and in delivery—companies such as Deloitte and Boots, which delivered that amazing expansion of the drive-through centres in such a short period. I pay tribute, hand on heart, to the work of every single person in that programme, whether they work in the private sector or the public sector—whether they work in the NHS, in the Department, for Boots or for Deloitte. Frankly, to try to divide people in that way suggests that she has missed the tone of where the country is right now.

Covid-19 Response

Caroline Lucas Excerpts

Wednesday 22nd April 2020 Commons Chamber

[Matt Hancock]

We are looking into that question and I will write to my hon. Friend as soon as we have an answer.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green) [V]]

On contact tracing, I welcome the fact that the Secretary of State is working with experts in digital ethics because if it is not run transparently by a public company with code open to public oversight and data anonymised, people will not trust the system and it risks failing. Does he agree that only a community-led process of human contact tracing can provide the fine-grained and reliable data that such an app would depend on? Will he learn the lesson from the over-centralised organisation of the testing approach and instead adopt a more decentralised approach for contact tracing, using local environmental health officers and PHE’s regional outbreak management teams?

[Matt Hancock]

I agree with the first two points, including the importance of people for contact tracing as well as technology—in fact, the two working hand in hand will be the most effective approach. I also agree with the need for ethicists on this. We are all giving up a huge amount of our liberty because of social distancing, so measures to reduce social distancing through the use of data need to be considered in that context. We are making sure that that is done in a way that can provide assurance to people with concerns in that area.

On the final point, we have to make the appropriate use of both national and local resources. In testing, for instance, organising drive-through centres across the country and home testing is inevitably an issue that needs to be done centrally, and then other testing laboratories are organised locally. It is about getting the best of both worlds.

Coronavirus Bill

Caroline Lucas Excerpts

2nd reading & 2nd reading: House of Commons
Monday 23rd March 2020 Commons Chamber

[Matt Hancock]

If it is deemed a risk to public health, the Bill does give the potential power, through secondary legislation, to take action if that is needed.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

I mean this in a constructive way, but it does feel as though we are constantly behind the curve; we are always waiting for people not to do what we have asked them to do before we then step in and introduce more strict communications. So I beg him: will he underpin this legislation and everything else the Government are doing with a much bigger, wider, louder and more comprehensive public education campaign, because right now the message clearly is not getting through? Anyone who was looking at the coverage over the weekend of people gathering in Richmond park and elsewhere will know that it is not being heard. We need to be doing an awful lot more to be able to catch up and get ahead of this.

--- Later in debate ---

[Jonathan Ashworth]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right, and his point has been made repeatedly by my right hon. Friends the Leader of the Opposition and the shadow Chancellor. The challenge of social isolation will not be boredom and fatigue, as some behavioural scientists have suggested; I think the biggest challenge of social isolation will be personal finances, and so on. That is why our proposed measures on sick pay are so important, and it is why we welcomed some of the measures announced by the Chancellor last week, but we think they need to go further.

[Caroline Lucas]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for giving way and for taking the issue of communication more seriously than the Secretary of State. We need leaflets going house to house, and we need them in different languages so that different communities can hear this.

The hon. Gentleman’s point about a strict lockdown is well made, but I echo what others have said about the importance of guaranteeing economic security to make it much more possible for people to cope with that lockdown, particularly the self-employed who are now struggling so much. Statutory sick pay is not enough for them.

[Jonathan Ashworth]

The hon. Lady is absolutely right. I am proud to represent the great city of Leicester, which is probably the most diverse city in the United Kingdom—every language in the world is spoken there—so I entirely endorse what she says. If we funded local government properly, it would be able to put such measures in place.

I entirely agree with the hon. Lady’s broader point that if we have to ask people to stay at home, or if we have to force them to do so—we would support the Government if they took that action, and I think they do need to take that action—we would also need to provide them with the economic security they rightly deserve.

--- Later in debate ---

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

I very much appreciate the spirit of co-operation and purpose in the Chamber today. We all want the same thing: for the coronavirus outbreak to be over, for people to be safe, and for our public services to be resilient and well resourced enough to cope. I believe that to achieve that, we need today’s legislation, but we also need to speak the truth, which is, sadly, that we have wasted weeks—time that could have been spent ramping up testing, acquiring more protective equipment and ordering more ventilators. This emergency legislation is welcome, but more than anything else, decisive Government action is overdue.

The UK had the advantage of being able to learn from the experiences of China and other countries, yet to people watching from the outside, we have too often seemed like a nation in denial. We cannot change where we are now, but only by understanding the answers to those questions can we ensure that similar errors of forward planning do not cost lives. So let us put that right now with a clearer and stricter lockdown—I agree with the shadow Secretary of State, the hon. Member for Leicester South (Jonathan Ashworth), on that—and, crucially, with the economic security that will make that possible. I echo everything that others have said about the importance of underpinning the livelihoods of those who are self-employed, and crucially—I make no apology for repeating this—we need a much, much clearer, more comprehensive, wall-to-wall public education campaign to underpin all that.

The message from our health workers could not be clearer: stay home to save lives. We owe them a massive debt of gratitude, but more than that, as MPs in particular, we owe it to them to listen and model the behaviour that we are asking of our constituents. The clearest way to do that is for Parliament to start meeting virtually and voting electronically, rather than putting staff at risk here and risking sending mixed messages to the rest of the country.

I have three brief points to make about the Bill. The first, on sovereignty and democracy, has been made by many others and I am very grateful that the Government have accepted the amendments to ensure that the legislation will come back to the House after six months, rather than waiting two years. It is crucial that we have the opportunity to correct any mistakes that could easily have been made in the understandably speedy drafting of this very large piece of legislation.

My second concern is about what is missing from the legislation: from closing detention centres and safely housing those released to allowing asylum seekers to work and have recourse to public funds; and from preventing utility companies cutting off anyone’s water, gas, phones, internet or electricity to putting real pressure on the insurance companies who are hiding behind the definition of notifiable diseases and refusing to pay out to businesses that are forced to close. Powers are needed to make them play fair. The Bill should give local authorities the power to grant council tax holidays and suspend all business tax payments, with central Government meeting the lost revenue. It needs to freeze household and business rental payments across all sectors, again, with compensation for landlords for the lost rent—not just for three months but for as long as is necessary—and to allow for flexible provision for those at risk from domestic abuse, sexual violence and child abuse. Above all. the Bill needs to include those measures to protect people’s incomes, not just their wages.

So many people in Brighton have raised with me the fact that their concerns have not been covered by the Government’s guarantees so far. As a nation, we are rightly proud of our entrepreneurs, creators and innovators. We need to remember that many of them lack all the legal protections of redundancy and other rights that exist to help employees who are faced with a sudden lack of income. They need to be included in the Government’s scheme. Something like 80% of their average wage needs to be made available to them as well and it needs to happen very fast.

My last point is simply that, as we go through this crisis, we need to do it in a way that prepares us for the next crisis, which is still there, my friends—the climate crisis. Therefore, the kinds of measures that we put in place—for example, when it comes to choosing which businesses we are bailing out—must also be driven by a concern for the climate and ensure that we are supporting the green economy, not the fossil fuel economy of the past.

Coronavirus

Caroline Lucas Excerpts

Tuesday 3rd March 2020 Commons Chamber

[Matt Hancock]

Yes—I would say that this is an example of the devolved Governments and the UK Government working well together. The best example of that is the four chief medical officers. As my right hon. Friend well knows from his time as a Secretary of State, each devolved nation has its own CMO, and the forum of the four of them provides an extremely useful place to debate and then to agree, so that we can have a UK-wide answer even though some areas, such as NHS delivery, are devolved.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

In times of crisis, fear can foster discrimination. There is serious concern about reports of racism being linked to the coronavirus outbreak, with people being singled out and abused simply because of east Asian appearance, and some children being bullied. Does the Secretary of State agree that inaccurate terms such as “Wuhan coronavirus” should be avoided because they sadly reinforce racist views? Will he take steps to ensure that Government communications always use medically accurate terms? Will he ensure that the Cabinet acts to ensure that everything possible is done to stop the denigration and blaming of people in relation to this outbreak?

[Matt Hancock]

Yes—I agree with all those points.

Wuhan Coronavirus

Caroline Lucas Excerpts

Tuesday 11th February 2020 Commons Chamber

[Matt Hancock]

I hope that I have demonstrated my willingness to keep the House informed. In the way that we respond to these public health emergencies, it is incredibly important that we are clear, straightforward and transparent with the public. The ability to communicate in what is inevitably a fast-moving situation is always a challenge, but I pay tribute to Members of the House for responding—and probing, of course—in a reasonable and sensible way, and to large swathes of the media, who have reported on the coronavirus outbreak in a way that is essentially guided by the science.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

In Brighton and Hove, our thoughts are with those who have tested positive in our city and those linked to them who are in isolation. The Secretary of State will know that there are real concerns locally, with another health centre closing today. People need and want more timely and accurate information—not just about washing hands and tissue use, vital though that is, but about such things as what self-isolation actually looks like. I think we need a much higher-profile public health campaign, so what steps is he taking to work across Departments—including with the Department for Education, the Department for Work and Pensions and so on—to proactively disseminate key public health messages without causing panic or compromising patient confidentiality? Will he also assure me that the Foreign and Commonwealth Office consular department is proactively offering support and assistance to people who are isolated in countries such as France?

[Matt Hancock]

The hon. Lady makes an important point, especially in relation to communicating through, for instance, the Department for Education and schools to make sure that schools get the reassurance that they need. I pay tribute to the way the hon. Lady has conducted herself, given the number of cases in her constituency, and the impact on local health services. We have taken action urgently where contact tracing has shown that it needs to be taken, and we will take that proportionate action. I am also very keen to be able to provide reassurances to people that we are taking the action that is needed and that the threat to the public remains moderate, even as we have seen the increase in numbers.

Access to Medical Cannabis

Caroline Lucas Excerpts

Monday 8th April 2019 Commons Chamber

[Matt Hancock]

I spoke to the Home Secretary this morning about the issue, and we proposed to see it as a health matter, not a borders matter. The Border Force officers were merely following the rules, and the question is about whether the drug is licensed. If it is not licensed, but it is controlled, the question is about whether it has clinical sign-off. The truth is that the compound does have negative effects, so it must be a controlled drug. I do not support the legalisation of all cannabis. Unless one supports the legalisation of cannabis in all cases, it has to be a controlled drug, which leads us to where we are. We must get the evidence of the medical and clinical benefits that the families have emphatically explained, and I want to see this situation dealt with properly.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

Some reports suggest that even Alfie Dingley, whose case gave rise to the new legislation, probably would not be eligible for medicinal cannabis under the new regulations because they are so strict. The Health and Social Care Secretary says that 95,000 clinicians are ready and waiting to sign off prescriptions, but can he explain why they are not doing so? If it is as easy as that, surely they would be doing it, so what else will he do to look at the barriers?

[Matt Hancock]

We have ensured that all the patients who received access to medicinal cannabis on an exceptional basis before the law changed on 1 November can continue to access it. If that is not the case in any instance, I want to know about that so that we can fix it. Alfie Dingley would be eligible for these drugs if a clinician were prepared to sign off the benefits for Alfie, and such decisions must be led by clinicians. I am doing everything I can to get the evidence and second opinions in place and to ensure that the process works as well as possible. That is what I can do. What I cannot do—it would be unreasonable for any Health Secretary to do so—is overrule clinical decision making in individual cases. That would be wrong, and I do not think that any Member of this House would propose that I should do it.

Acquired Brain Injury

Caroline Lucas Excerpts

Monday 18th June 2018 Commons Chamber

[Alex Chalk (Cheltenham) (Con)]

rose—

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

rose—

[Steve Brine]

Ladies first.

[Caroline Lucas]

Does the Minister share the concern raised with me by my Brighton constituents who travelled up to Westminster to share their stories, about the lack of funding for support for relatives and carers—in particular, the education that family members and carers need about how to look after someone with ABI? It can be incredibly stressful for the person themselves and for family members if people do not know how best to provide care. Funding can make a huge difference.

[Steve Brine]

I thank the hon. Lady for that point, which I shall come to. There are other Ministers on the Bench with me, including from the Department for Work and Pensions, because I wanted them to hear other parts of this debate. The hon. Lady’s point is well made.

Health and Social Care Budgets

Caroline Lucas Excerpts

Tuesday 14th March 2017 Westminster Hall

[Meg Hillier]

I know that my hon. Friend the Member for Sheffield South East will discuss the funding of social care in more detail.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

I, too, congratulate the hon. Lady. Does she agree that Ministers are engaged in wishful thinking? The ability to reduce the number of hospital beds relies on the availability of better and more social care, yet in Brighton our sustainability and transformation plan footprint means that we are being forced to find another £112 million in efficiencies specifically in social care. It just does not add up, and it is not sustainable.

[Meg Hillier]

One concern that our Committee has uncovered is the pressure to make 4% efficiency savings. That figure was used in the last Parliament, but has now been acknowledged to be too stiff a target. However, we are also seeing a move to 4% efficiency savings in STPs. That is challenging to achieve while going through transformation. One would expect the Public Accounts Committee to be no slouch in considering where efficiencies can be found, but even with efficiencies there is just not enough money in the system. It is being squeezed.

One welcome aspect of the Budget—I hope that the Minister can give us more detail—is that there will be a Green Paper later in the year on the future funding of social care; again, I know that my hon. Friend the Member for Sheffield South East will want to talk more about that. There are also other bits of money: £100 million to support 100 new on-site GP triage projects at accident and emergency departments in hospitals in time for next winter; £325 million in capital funding to support the implementation of sustainability and transformation plans that are ready to proceed; and a multi-year capital programme for health. That all sounds like a lot of money, but relative to the total NHS budget, it is a very small amount, and the concern is that it is not long-term and sustainable. That is what our Committee said. A long-term plan is necessary for funding the NHS.

After looking at this year’s accounts, we are concerned about the number of trusts in deficit; perhaps the Minister can update us on that. As of month 9 of this financial year, 74 of 238 trusts were in deficit, to the tune of £886 million total. Granted, that is less than the £2.5 billion last year, but it is still not a healthy situation. Raiding capital funds to pay for resource and other such measures is just not acceptable in the long term.