Apprenticeships

Debate between Barry Sheerman and Gordon Marsden

Tuesday 12th March 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Marsden]

I entirely agree with my hon. Friend. Indeed, I would go further and say that a number of large companies—BAE Systems, for example, where I was last Thursday—have led the way on this issue including with their supply chain. It remains to be seen whether the Government take that message across a broader palette.

[Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op)]

My hon. Friend and I worked together on skills and apprenticeships for many years and, like me, he will know that the tragedy of our economy is that only about 10% of employers take on apprentices. If we could get the other 90% to take on an apprentice, we could really do something for young people in this country.

[Mr Marsden]

I had the enormous pleasure of serving under my hon. Friend when he was the Chair of the Children, Schools and Families Committee, and he has probably taught me as much as anyone in this House on this subject. He is absolutely right and he hits the nail on the head: a step-change in the number of apprenticeships is central. It is the focus of our motion.

We resurrected that historic badge of excellence, but this is not a matter for party politics. When the hon. Member for South Holland and The Deepings (Mr Hayes) was the Minister with responsibility for apprenticeships, he spoke movingly about what he had learned about the value of the skills of hand and eye from his father. I, too, saw those skills through the working life of my father as an engineer. When he was apprenticed at the age of 14 to the engineering company Crossley Brothers in Manchester just before the second world war, my grandfather told him, “Now Crossleys has taken you on, you will have a job for life.”

Today’s apprentices often face very different challenges and prospects, because many young people can expect to go through half a dozen job or career changes in their lifetime, some probably not even thought of when they start their apprenticeship. That means it is critical to get the mix of bespoke and portable skills right at the apprenticeship stage; and that the range, content and quality remain relevant to the businesses and local economies in which they are embedded. These are challenging issues that demand a co-ordinated and hands-on approach from government, as well as from businesses and educators.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Sheerman]

I take a bipartisan approach to these things, but is not one worry the fact that it is difficult for people promoting apprenticeships to get into schools, many of which resist apprenticeships because they want to keep bums on seats in return for the financial reward? That is very common.

[Mr Marsden]

Like my hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham, Selly Oak (Steve McCabe), my hon. Friend the Member for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman) is telepathic, because I shall be returning to that point later.

The Government are fond of saying that they have created more than 500,000 apprenticeships, but less fond of saying that in axing Train to Gain they also axed more than 500,000 training places. Many of these additional apprenticeships are merely relabelled and transferred in-work provision from Train to Gain, as Doug Richard, the entrepreneur behind the Government’s commissioned report, confirmed last week and as has been shown by detailed analysis from the sector publication, FE Week, which the Skills Minister and I read with great relish every week.

Government statistics in the Richard review have borne that out. The proportion of apprenticeships that are in-work apprenticeships rose to 70% in 2012 in comparison with 48% in 2007, so the Government’s figure of 500,000 hangs entirely on the huge growth in post-25 apprenticeships. If significant numbers of these fall away as a result of an adverse reaction to the Government’s controversial FE loans system, the fragility of their much-trumpeted figure of 500,000 will be rapidly exposed.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Sheerman]

rose—

[Mr Marsden]

I will take one more intervention from my hon. Friend and then I must make progress.

[Mr Sheerman]

Again, I am not trying to make party political points, but have we not all found that if we are to have apprenticeship champions, we have to locate them somewhere? Whether they are in local enterprise partnerships, chambers of commerce, local authorities, colleges or anywhere else, we have to have champions if we are to get the number of apprenticeships this country deserves.

[Mr Marsden]

My hon. Friend is quite right. When different places choose different champions in different sectors, the secret is getting them to co-operate with each other.

Last year we laid out all the measures I have set out in this debate, but the centrepiece is something that the Government could move to tomorrow if they wanted to: using the tens or even hundreds of billions of pounds of public procurement that come from Government contracts to create apprenticeships. That is the core of today’s motion. As far back as August 2011, we set out our stall, when the then shadow Business Secretary, my right hon. Friend the Member for Southampton, Itchen, announced that we would require all companies bidding for Government contracts above £1 million to put in place a scheme to create apprenticeships before they could get them. That is an initiative to do much of the heavy lifting that we need to provide the step change, the exponential shift, in the sheer volume of apprenticeship numbers. Since then, his successor, my hon. Friend the Member for Streatham (Mr Umunna), has taken that proposal forward on every possible occasion, not only on the ground of the economic necessity for growth but as an ethical imperative. That is why, last week at the EEF, he outlined our position, which is that it is simply unacceptable that two thirds of larger employers are still not offering apprenticeships.

It was my right hon. Friend the Member for Southampton, Itchen who laid out the direction of travel for this initiative when we were in government. Along with my hon. Friend the Member for Wallasey (Ms Eagle), he launched the official Office of Government Commerce guidance encouraging this approach. That Labour Government then proceeded with major projects such as the Kickstart housing scheme, launched by my right hon. Friend the Member for Wentworth and Dearne (John Healey), and Building Schools for the Future, as well as working with the contractors on the Olympic park, which resulted in the creation of thousands of new apprenticeship opportunities.