Tobacco and Vapes Bill

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Report stage
Tuesday 3rd March 2026 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

My Lords, in an earlier group I spoke about the importance of fixed penalty notices in the Bill, as they provide trading standards officers with an additional enforcement tool to bring retailers into compliance without taking up court resource. I have carefully considered the points raised by noble Lords in Committee about the proceeds of fixed penalty notices issued for licensing offences, including those made by the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley.

I am therefore pleased to have tabled these government amendments because they will allow local authorities in England and Wales to retain all the proceeds from the £2,500 licensing fixed penalty notices for enforcement purposes, rather than having to return proceeds to the Consolidated Fund. That will enable local authorities to reinvest proceeds into strengthening the enforcement of tobacco and vape legislation—something that noble Lords have asked for.

In addition, we are investing up to £10 million of new funding in trading standards annually until 2028-29 to tackle the illicit and underage sale of tobacco and vapes, and to help to enforce the law. This funding is being used to boost the trading standards workforce by hiring 120 apprentices across England, and we will continue to provide funding to support the apprentices over the next three years as they complete their training.

Trading standards plays an essential role in ensuring compliance with tobacco and vape legislation. The enforcement provisions in the Bill, further strengthened by this amendment, will give them the tools they need to carry out that role. Proper enforcement of the law will protect the public from potential health harms and help to realise public health outcomes from policies in the Bill and other tobacco and vape legislation. For these reasons, I hope that noble Lords will feel able to support the government amendments in this group. I beg to move.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, I will speak to Amendments 66 and 68 in my name. These provide that the money collected by trading standards in small fines imposed by fixed penalty notices for offences other than those related to the licensing regulations should go towards smoking cessation services provided by the relevant local authority. The Liberal Democrats have been calling for this since the Bill was first introduced to Parliament.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, despite the comments of the previous two speakers, I will speak to Amendment 199, the purpose of which is simple: to make every future and renewed pavement licence issued by local authorities smoke-free.

Your Lordships will recall that pavement licences first appeared during the pandemic, when indoor hospitality was restricted. They gave cafés, pubs and restaurants a lifeline. It seemed obvious that these spaces should follow the same rules as indoors: no smoking. The LGA supported this, saying that

“it sets a level playing field for hospitality venues across the country and has a public health benefit of protecting people from unwanted second-hand smoke”.

It welcomed this national policy because it stopped the stupid situation of allowing people to smoke in a pub pavement area on one side of the road but not on the other if a local authority boundary ran down the middle of the road and they had different policies. Since then, pavement licences have become a permanent fixture. However, after some lobbying from some parts of the hospitality industry, the requirement for smoke-free was removed without proper consultation of health authorities.

In 2021, this House supported an amendment from the noble Lord, Lord Faulkner of Worcester, noting the missed opportunity to make all licences smoke-free. Amendment 199 seeks to honour that vote and ensure that this health-protecting measure is applied consistently.

There is currently a requirement for some seating to be smoke-free, but the distinction means very little when you talk about a very small bit of pavement. More than 10 councils have made smoke-free a condition of obtaining a pavement licence, including Liverpool, Manchester, Newcastle, Northumberland County Council and Durham—not outstandingly liberal authorities, as far as I can tell. Feedback shows that customers and businesses welcome the change. In Liverpool, a survey of premises found that 74% of those asked expressed support for the scheme, including many smokers. Councils also aim to reduce cigarette litter with this initiative, which would make outdoor seating areas cleaner, more welcoming environments.

Second-hand smoke is harmful at any level. It worsens asthma and other respiratory conditions, and contributes to heart disease, stroke and lung cancer. Smoke-free spaces are also popular with the public. Polling from ASH shows that 59% of people support banning smoking in outdoor areas of pubs, cafés and restaurants; indeed, 40% said that they would be more likely to visit these venues if smoking were banned outside. That is more than double the number of people who say that they would go less often, debunking the idea that smoke-free means customer-free. Making outdoor areas smoke-free is not only sensible but what the public want.

I regret that this issue is not covered by the recent consultation on smoke-free places. It is a shame that the Government felt that they were not able to include hospitality in that consultation at all and that they fell into this false narrative that smoke-free is somehow an economic threat to hospitality.

Less than 12% of the population smoke, so the financial viability of the hospitality industry is clearly not dependent on the continued consumption of tobacco, including outdoors. Indoor smoke-free legislation was a far more drastic intervention, and we heard many of these arguments from those opposed then. However, a survey in 2012 of nearly 5,000 pub customers reported that more than one in five visited the pub more often than before smoke-free legislation. I do hope that the Minister will, in future, consider looking at the pilots for smoke-free pavement licences to assess the economic relationship between the hospitality sector and smoking. As prevalence continues to fall, we must be at a tipping point soon, where these spaces will naturally become smoke-free.

This brings me to Amendment 196, tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Sharpe of Epsom. I think we may disagree on the potential impact any restrictions will have on hospitality, but in any case, the Government would consult on any use of smoke-free powers as they are doing currently.

Moving on, I welcome Amendment 194A from the noble Lord, Lord Kamall, and the noble Earl, Lord Howe. There is no doubt that the public are keen to see more places where smoking and vaping are prohibited. However, this policy must be pursued not merely to cater to the things that people dislike, but also to ensure that it is addressing matters that are harmful to the public. Clearly, reducing children’s exposure to second-hand smoke passes that test. While the evidence of exposure to second-hand vapour remains unclear, I think we can agree that reducing any possible risks around children must be prioritised, following careful consultation.

In that respect, I do not support Amendments 194 and 195 from the noble Lord, Lord Udny-Lister, which would remove these powers altogether. However, there is a challenge in all of this. Given the high level of public misunderstanding about the difference in harms between vaping and smoking, as the noble Baroness, Lady Fox of Buckley, has said—and she is quite right —how do we ensure that in creating vape-free places we do not exacerbate those misconceptions? I talked to a young man the other day who asked me, “What are you doing in the House of Lords?” I explained about this Bill, and he said, “Oh, all my friends vape”. He said, “I think it is just as harmful as smoking, isn’t it?” QED. Of course it is not.

I welcome the commitment in the published consultation to treat vaping differently from smoking where it is providing support to smokers to quit. I am on the same side as the noble Baroness, Lady Fox, on that score. Will the Minister say more about how this policy will be communicated to improve public understanding that vaping is less harmful than smoking? How will any exemptions to indoor vaping regulations be used to best effect to encourage more smokers to see vaping as quitting aids?

It is disappointing to see only council-run playgrounds included in the ban on smoking in playgrounds. Why should children playing in settings not run by councils not be similarly protected? There are also other places, such as transport hubs, where the public and workers are regularly exposed to other people’s smoke, so are the Government planning to commit to look at these too?

Amendment 192A from the noble Earl, Lord Howe, is very interesting, but we do not think actors should have to smoke at work. I think it was pointed out in Committee that there are alternative products that can depict smoking for artistic purposes; in particular, I believe that the National Theatre has such a device. If it is good enough for that theatre, it is good enough for me. Moreover, Wales does not have this exemption in place, and it has not harmed Welsh theatres.

We do not think that Amendment 193 is appropriate either: most venues are vape- free anyway, and the law is just really catching up.

On Amendments 197 and 198, I do not think that heated tobacco should have special exemptions at all. Only 1% of the population use it and it is not recommended by NICE for cessation. However, I do have a couple of questions for the Minister about heated tobacco devices, because I have had a letter expressing some concern that the law is not terribly clear. The advertising offence in the Bill applies to any advert,

“whose purpose or effect is to promote … a tobacco product”.

So can the Minister confirm that heated tobacco devices—not just sticks—will be caught under this definition, as advertisement of the device might constitute promotion of the tobacco product?

I see that in Clause 132 the Government explicitly take the power to extend provisions in Part 6 to tobacco- related devices. I understand that this is to future-proof the advertising restrictions against any innovation in this space, as we know the tobacco industry is likely to use any loopholes. I ask the Minister: why are heated tobacco devices explicitly included in Clause 132? Is it because of the difficulties they have had recently with two big supermarkets advertising heated tobacco products? Is it just the devices they are advertising, or are they simply breaking the law about advertising the tobacco sticks themselves? A little clarification would be most welcome if the Minister could provide it, please.

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

My Lords, I am grateful to noble Lords for their contributions on this last group of amendments. It may be helpful if I remind your Lordships’ House that, on 13 February, the Government published their consultation on free-from places. We are consulting on making outdoor public places, including children’s playgrounds, hospitals and schools, smoke-free and heated tobacco-free. Additionally, we are consulting on making outside playgrounds and schools vape-free.

With regard to indoor spaces that are currently smoke-free, we are consulting on also making these heated tobacco-free and vape-free. I want to emphasise—and I hear different opinions on this within your Lordships’ House—that the consultation does not consider extending these proposals to outdoor hospitality. I hope that this addresses the concerns raised under Amendments 194 and 197, tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Udny-Lister, as well as Amendment 196 from the noble Lord, Lord Sharpe.

With regard to Amendment 193 from the noble Lord, Lord Udny-Lister, the vast majority of people—around 90% of those over 16—do not currently vape. Just because someone is present in an over-18 setting does not mean that they are content to be exposed to second-hand harms. This would be of particular concern to those who are medically vulnerable, whose conditions may not always be visible.

Additionally, under the proposals put forward in the consultation, those who wish to vape would still be able to do so in outdoor hospitality settings. I should say that we have been pleased to meet various stakeholders, including UKHospitality and the British Beer and Pub Association, and we have welcomed their input.

Furthermore, a number of establishments, as I am sure we are all aware, have already introduced their own policies restricting vaping indoors. These proposals provide consistency and clarity for the public and businesses, and that is crucial if we are thinking about legislation.

I turn to the evidence. Amendments 195 and 198 in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Udny-Lister, question the need for the vape-free places and heated tobacco-free places clauses. I also refer to Amendment 194A in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Kamall.

We have already published a draft impact assessment alongside the consultation on free-from places. To the points made by the noble Earl, Lord Howe, this sets out the evidence base for the proposed policies. I encourage noble Lords to review the document, which is thorough, if they have not had the chance to do so already. I can say that we will reassess the evidence after the consultation is closed, and we will consider any additional evidence identified before deciding on final policy positions and publishing a final stage impact assessment alongside regulations.

Better Start Longitudinal Programmes

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Tuesday 10th February 2026 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

It is an important point that the noble Lord raises. This is being dealt with by the Government’s proposal to have a three-month consultation, so that we get it right in terms of acknowledging the concerns and challenges of screen time for children. So, I take the point that the noble Lord has made. This is of course a matter for DSIT. I will ensure that it is aware of the noble Lord’s comments, as well as the relevant departments—my department and the Department for Education—in respect of the programme that we are talking about.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, while I welcome today’s announcement about protecting special educational needs funding, I would like to ask about support for very young children with special needs and those with physical disabilities. Parents often find it difficult to find an early-years place or childcare suitable for these special children. Can the Minister point them towards any real, properly funded, properly resourced help from people with the right training looking after these special children?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

I hope I can be helpful to the noble Baroness. In the Best Start for Life strategy, we committed that each Best Start Family Hub will have a children and family services practitioner to support children and families who have additional needs. I feel that this new offer will help parents to understand their child’s development and identify emerging needs sooner. Importantly, it will also support vital join-up across the services, keeping children who have particular needs at the very centre.

Under-16s Energy Drinks Ban

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Tuesday 10th February 2026 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Walmsley]

To ask His Majesty’s Government when they expect to publish a timeline for legislation banning the sale of energy drinks to under-16s.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Health and Social Care (Baroness Merron)]

My Lords, we are taking decisive action on obesity, easing the strain on our NHS and creating the healthiest generation of children ever. As part of this, we will fulfil our commitment to ban the sale of high-caffeine energy drinks to children aged under 16, introducing the ban within this Parliament. Our consultation has closed. We are analysing the responses and will set out further information on our timelines in due course.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, the Government promised to ban the sale of energy drinks in this Session. The consultation has ended but we have not seen the results yet. When will the responses be published and when will the Government publish the regulations? Will the ban extend to all under-18s and all retailers, including vending machines and schools? There is still time to pass the regulations before Prorogation. Will the Government get on with it? Otherwise, it will be a promise made but a promise broken.

National Cancer Plan

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Monday 9th February 2026 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, from these Benches, we very much welcome the national cancer plan and support its ambitions—and it is very ambitious. Many organisations and committees have called for an integrated, long-term plan, so it is very good that the Government have listened and, in particular, have taken note of the views of patients and their families—the people with lived experience of all these problems. However, may I reiterate Cancer Research UK’s response to the plan? It said:

“The key question that patients and their loved ones will ask, however, is how quickly will they see progress in cancer survival and outcomes? The improvements they are waiting for will depend on how this plan translates into delivery. Funding must match the ambition of what has been promised, or the NHS will struggle to expand its diagnostic capacity or introduce innovation at scale. And clear leadership and accountability are also crucial”.


Many of those points have also been mentioned by the noble Earl, Lord Howe, just now.

We know that outcomes in England have lagged behind comparable countries for decades, so it is positive to see improving cancer survival at the centre of the plan. However, it is going to be tough to achieve and will require much faster progress than what we have heard so far indicates. The key, of course, is improved diagnosis at an early stage, so I welcome the renewed commitment to earlier diagnosis and to meeting all cancer waiting time targets by 2029. It is outrageous that 92% of trusts do not reach the target for starting treatment. I welcome the full rollout of lung screening by 2030 and increasing the sensitivity of the tests used in bowel screening by 2028. However, what about breast screening? There have been problems in some parts of the country in getting that done. Can the Minister say whether these plans will be fully resourced? There is no point in doing the screening and tests unless an expert is there to interpret them. There are bold promises, but will they be matched with the resources and training required?

The plan talks about AI tools and liquid biopsy tests, which could certainly hold real potential for increasing productivity. However, before they are introduced, they must be robustly tested so that only safe and effective innovations reach patients and those that do not work can be dropped.

While there is a focus on diagnosis and treatment, I was pleased to see that the plan includes a commitment to increase action on lifestyle factors which we know cause cancer. Smoking tobacco, being overweight or obese, alcohol and UV exposure still cause many cancers that could be prevented. Fortunately, the Tobacco and Vapes Bill should certainly have a positive effect over the coming years in stopping people smoking in the first place. It is also positive to see action to strengthen protections on sunbed use and measures to drive HPV vaccination uptake, particularly in underserved groups. The new ad hoc committee on childhood vaccine rates is, I hope, going to contribute to that.

More action is needed to drive the shift from sickness to prevention, which is one of the Government’s core objectives in their 10-year health plan. There is still more to do to help millions of existing smokers quit smoking and to prevent someone becoming overweight or obese in the first place. Tightening regulation on alcohol through introducing minimum unit pricing, as implemented in Scotland and Wales, was a missed opportunity. Will the Government reconsider?

Rare cancers make up about 24% of cancers diagnosed in the UK and the EU every year. This includes cancers of children and young people, because they are less likely to suffer from the cancers caused by the lifestyle issues I have just mentioned. This is where research comes in, and the ability to implement research findings into the NHS. It is a sad fact that the NHS has been slow in the past to implement new cutting-edge treatments, so it is welcome that the plan has some important commitments in that respect. However, as with other aspects of the plan, the devil is in the detail.

The focus on ending delays in cancer treatment is a step forward, but funding 28 new radiotherapy machines is not enough when the treatment is so cost-effective and successful. We need to end the radiotherapy deserts. Will the Minister extend her ambition to the 200 extra radiotherapy machines that the Liberal Democrats have proposed? Another 28 will probably only replace the old machines that need to be replaced anyway—it will not take us forward. Can the Minister tell us about the plan to train the operatives for these new machines? Resources, training and accountability are at the heart of this. We have not had a lot of detail yet, so I look forward to getting more.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Health and Social Care (Baroness Merron) (Lab)]

My Lords, I am grateful for the warm welcome from both Front Benches for the national cancer plan. This is a moment when we transform our cancer care and we make it personalised—we wrap it around the person instead of expecting it to be the other way around. The 62-day treatment standard has not been met since 2015, and outcomes, as we have talked about a lot in this Chamber, continue to lag behind those of comparable countries. That is what has driven us to this point to ensure that, by 2035, three in four people diagnosed with cancer will be alive five years later, whereas at present, the figure is three in five. That represents 320,000 more lives saved, with all the effects on their friends, families and communities, as well as themselves. That will be the fastest improvement in cancer survival this country has ever seen.

I will try to deal with some of the Front-Bench questions. I agree with much of what has been raised, including the recognition of all those, including those with lived experience, who contributed to what is, in my view and experience, a very bold 10-year strategy that actually sets out how we will do this. Both the noble Earl, Lord Howe, and the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, asked about clear milestones. I am glad to say that those are set out at the end of each chapter, with dates and the responsible organisations for all key actions and commitments.

The noble Earl raised the workforce plan. It will be published in the spring and will set out guidance—this goes to the point raised by the noble Baroness—not just on expanding numbers but on ensuring that staff are properly trained and supported. This will require a multidisciplinary team approach. We will use training directly as a lever to prioritise training places in trusts, often in the rural and coastal areas that the noble Earl asked about, as it is indeed the case that vacancy rates are higher and performance is lower. Training doctors of course takes time, but this is about long-term sustainable change and about turning around the whole of the cancer pathway. It is the exact opposite of us tinkering here and there. We are working with the royal colleges to boost the numbers of doctors specialising in clinical and medical oncology.

The noble Earl asked about bringing NHS England into the department. I see that as a great opportunity. Within the plan, we have set out a reformed national cancer board. It will be comprised of cancer experts, and it will be accountable—this is so important, as the noble Baroness said—for the overall delivery of the plan. Regionally, we will keep and strengthen the role of cancer alliances, which will work hand in glove with NHS regions to deliver cancer improvements.

The noble Earl asked how young people are being engaged. We worked with the Children and Young People Cancer Taskforce to ensure their voices were heard through its patient experience panel. Importantly, we will appoint a lead for children and young people with cancer to be part of the revamped national cancer board. We want their voices to continue to be heard. We definitely recognise the distinction between children and young people; they have different needs. For example, the plan highlights the importance of play for children, as well as the role of youth support co-ordinators in providing educational, emotional and fertility support for teenagers and young people. I agree with the noble Earl that cancer has a profound psychological impact on all patients and those supporting them. The plan sets out how that support must be standardised for children and young people, including the provision of longer-term support.

The noble Baroness asked about improving early diagnosis. We are providing £2.3 billion of investment in diagnostics to deliver 9.5 million additional tests by 2029 across screening and symptomatic diagnosis. The noble Baroness asked about seeing change; I say go to a community diagnostic centre. That epitomises where we are going with our National Health Service. We will also spend more than £650 million to complete the rollout of lung cancer screening by 2030, which is one of the things that can make the biggest difference in more disadvantaged areas, as well in prevention.

On radiotherapy machines, the responsibility lies at a local level. We expect local systems to continue to invest in new machines to meet the ambitious targets. Through the spending review, providers have been allocated with £15 billion in operational capital for local priorities and £5 billion to support a return to constitutional standards, including for radiotherapy machines.

Baby Milk Powder: Cereulide

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Wednesday 4th February 2026 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

As ever, the noble Lord has put things better than I did. I understand the point he is making. The FSA’s role, certainly in the incident response, includes chasing supply chains to identify any additional potential products and businesses. I certainly agree that it is very important to stem any difficulty. But, as it is a live incident, the only point I would make, as I said to the noble Baroness, is that the focus is very much on managing the situation. Therefore, there has not been the opportunity to look into the detail that I agree it needs. That will happen, as it always does, in an incident such as this.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, is the Minister aware that it took Nestlé four weeks from its first notification of contamination to the Dutch Government to initiate the first product recall on 5 January, following further tests? Does she agree that there should be independent testing, rather than relying on in-house testing by the formula producers? Does she agree that that independent testing should be triggered, at the very least, at the first whiff of any possible contamination?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

In my preparation for this Question, which is an important one, I asked a similar question to officials, particularly those from the FSA, and they assured me that testing shows we are meeting the right standards. They also made the point that this is all covered by the Food Safety Act. In their opinion, they have the tools to do the job. I am not aware that there has been something wrong in the management of this live incident, but I am aware that the FSA and the UK Health Security Agency are liaising very closely with the manufacturers to establish the root cause of the possible presence of this toxin. But I can also reassure your Lordships’ House that it is confined to certain batches. That is the information that is going out.

Tobacco and Vapes Bill

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Committee stage
Monday 17th November 2025 Grand Committee

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, I will speak first to my Amendment 176. As the noble Lord, Lord Kamall, said, his Amendment 178 does something very similar. As I have often said, policy should be based on evidence, so this amendment seeks to tease out exactly what evidence the Government plan to use when designating a new area as smoke-free.

The Government have already said that their consultation on further smoke-free areas will focus on schools, playgrounds and hospitals. It is fairly clear that areas in and close to schools should be smoke-free, in the same way that local authorities now have powers to prevent the opening of new fast-food outlets near schools because of the health dangers of much of their sales.

However, some playgrounds are very large and it is possible that a parent waiting on a bench for a child, well away from the play equipment, may want to smoke a cigarette—if they are of legal age, of course. Although it would set a bad example, it would be hard to understand the level of risk to the children playing; it would depend how far away they are. As for hospitals, many of them have already designated their grounds as smoke-free, although it has been hard to enforce. Many of us will have seen people smoking outside St Thomas’ Hospital, underneath the “No smoking” sign. Many hospitals have distinct outdoor smoking shelters. The matter is complicated, which is why my amendment probes the Government on the criteria they will use.

On the other hand, Amendments 175 and 179 seek to specify in the Bill the areas that can be designated as smoke-free. This could restrict the Government from acting in other areas in future. Obviously, we want the same rules in all parts of the UK, to save confusion. There are several reasons why the Government should not be limited in this way, and they must bear in mind the different circumstances that prevail in different areas. For example, as the noble Baroness, Lady Bennett, mentioned, there are many children on beaches, and discarded cigarettes are a real litter problem, according to coastal local authorities. As she said, transport hubs may also come into focus, because of the crowded conditions in many of them, especially at certain times of the day such as rush hour. We think the Government need flexibility on this issue. Indeed, somebody might be more affected by second-hand smoke in a transport hub than at the far side of a very large playground, which is why I would like to see an evidence test.

We do not support Amendment 177 in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Udny-Lister, as the Government may want to restrict smoking in uncovered hospitality areas in the future. However, if they do so they will have to explain the reasons why, and we could debate it then. The fact is that the prohibition on smoking in indoor hospitality venues has proved very popular with customers and landlords alike and has certainly not had a damaging effect on footfall or expansion of the sector. The same might apply to uncovered hospitality areas in the future, if they are considered for the ban.

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

My Lords, as we have heard, all the amendments in this group seek to limit the powers in the Bill to make additional places smoke-free in England. On Amendment 176, tabled by the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, we know that passive smoking, whether indoors or outdoors, poses a risk to health. The rule of thumb is: if you can smell cigarette smoke, you are inhaling it. This is particularly important for children, pregnant women and those with pre-existing health conditions such as asthma or heart disease, which may not be visible to the smoker.

However, despite these well-known and very well-evidenced harms, trying to ascribe specific harms to locations is somewhat challenging, as this debate shows. For example, as the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, mentioned, in a large children’s play area it is difficult to evidence that exposure to second-hand smoke has caused a specific harm in a specific place. I can assure noble Lords that we are extremely mindful of this. Therefore, the test referred to in the amendment is overly restrictive, technically very difficult to do and not necessary, given the extensive evidence of harm to vulnerable people. It would also likely lead to a scenario in which we are unable to protect the most vulnerable in society from the harms of second-hand smoke.

Similarly, on Amendment 178, tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Kamall, as I mentioned, we know the harms of passive smoking. There is strong indirect evidence but, as I said, it can be difficult to demonstrate this evidence in specific locations. Again, this restrictive test would prevent areas where there are harms of second-hand smoke to children and medically vulnerable people from becoming smoke-free. Furthermore, as this amendment would apply in England only, it would leave England with more restrictive smoke-free provisions than the devolved nations. 

Amendments 175 and 179 were tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Kamall. As we have made clear but I would like to reiterate, in England we plan to consult on extending smoke-free places as and when. In the first instance, it would be to the outdoor areas of schools and early years settings, children’s playgrounds and healthcare settings. I can assure the noble Lord, Lord Kamall, and the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, that all proposed smoke-free locations will be subject to consultation both now and into the future and that regulations will be subject to the affirmative procedure. We will be guided by public health advice. The noble Baroness, Lady Bennett, rightly observed that the powers within the Bill allow us to respond to evolving evidence at a later time, particularly where there is evidence of clear harms to children and vulnerable people.

On Amendment 177 tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Udny-Lister, we have made it very clear—I am glad to take the opportunity to do so again, not least because the noble Lord, Lord Kamall, raised this—that outdoor hospitality settings will not be in scope of the consultation on smoke-free places. We fully recognise the balance that is needed to protect the most vulnerable as well as ensure that businesses are not financially impacted. We are confident that we have the balance right in deciding the places, which I have already outlined, on which we plan to consult.

However, the powers in the Bill, as has been observed, allow for additional places to be designated smoke-free in the future, subject to further consultation and parliamentary debate. The landscape may change significantly on tobacco legislation, as it has done over the years. Evidence and attitudes may also shift, again as we have seen over the years, so it is sensible to ensure that the Bill is future-proofed and can respond to evolving evidence. I therefore ask the noble Lord to withdraw this amendment.

Tobacco and Vapes Bill

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Committee stage
Thursday 30th October 2025 Grand Committee

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

The noble Lord will be glad to know that I am reminded of what I should know already: matters in relation to the dates for Third Reading are matters for business managers. It will also depend on how much progress we make.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

I ask for a brief clarification. Is the Minister claiming that Amendment 12 is not necessary because she will accept Amendment 148?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

No, that is not the case. I urge the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, to withdraw her amendment.

Young Children: Convenience Foods

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Wednesday 4th June 2025 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Walmsley]

To ask His Majesty’s Government what steps they are taking to address the nutritional content, labelling and promotion of convenience foods aimed at very young children, including fruit pouches and snacks.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Health and Social Care (Baroness Merron) (Lab)]

My Lords, good nutrition is essential to our goal of raising the healthiest generation of children. Foods for infants and young children have to meet regulations on nutrition, composition and labelling standards. More widely, we are committed to tackling the child obesity crisis and government actions, including the junk food advertising ban, demonstrate the scale of our ambition in this area.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, I echo the comment of the noble Lord, Lord Kirkhope, “Oh dear”, because this issue is not new. In 2019, Public Health England drew attention to the fact that these products contain free sugars, they are not advised by the Scientific Advisory Committee on Nutrition for these young children and they are very misleadingly labelled. Every time the Government respond to this, they do what the Minister has just done and say that there are very good regulations about nutritional content and regulation. But does the Minister agree that regulations are only as good as their enforcement, and these are not being enforced? So, when the Government have their many conversations with the food industry, will they please get a grip and stop these companies producing products that are making our children obese, with rotting teeth?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

I hope the noble Baroness will be pleased to know that I recognise the view she states. I realise that this has gone on for some time and I am grateful for her work in this area, including through chairing the Lords committee that produced a very helpful report. I recognise that the current situation is not good enough.

On the matter of food regulations and enforcement, it is the responsibility of local authorities in England to enforce legislation where breaches are suspected. Local authorities will liaise with businesses to clarify and, if necessary, agree the action to put it right. It is indeed the responsibility of individual businesses to ensure that they comply with the law, and I assure the noble Baroness that that is a matter we will continue to press, as well as keeping those food regulations under review.

Social Care Reform

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Thursday 22nd May 2025 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

I understand that, but the noble Lord said we were just waiting until 2028, and I am not aligning myself with that.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

It is recognised that any meaningful social care reform must deliver for unpaid carers. Will the Minister say what role carer organisations are playing in shaping these talks?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

Unpaid carers are key because they provide care and support to those who require care. The needs of unpaid carers will be very much part of the commission. I know that the noble Baroness, Lady Casey, will be speaking to relevant organisations and those with lived experience.

NHS and Care Volunteer Responders Service

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Tuesday 20th May 2025 Lords Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Health and Social Care (Baroness Merron) (Lab)]

I start by saying, as I am sure the noble Earl agrees, how grateful we are for the generous contribution made by volunteers. They play a vital role in supporting patients, staff and services in many ways. The national NHS and Care Volunteer Responders programme was first established as part of the Covid response, and the noble Earl helpfully set out its contribution. The fact is that a model that worked well in a national crisis is no longer the most cost-effective option, so there will be a new recruitment portal for NHS volunteers to be fully launched this year. This is all about expanding voluntary opportunities and getting more volunteer hours to further support patients even better than volunteers do already.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

Where will the current funding for this programme go? Will it go into the new scheme the Minister has mentioned, or into community services or support for vulnerable groups, or will this result in some kind of cut to services?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

I assure the noble Baroness that there is no intention that this will impact on services. As I mentioned, this is about getting value for money; the previous scheme did so during the Covid pandemic and just after, but we are in a totally different world now. All those who volunteered through the scheme that is being brought to an end will have been sent an email advising them how they can continue their volunteering—we do not want to lose people—and how it will be easier. The launch of the portal will provide a one-stop shop, overseen by NHS England. That is what will be funded. I hope that the noble Baroness and other noble Lords will find the website a much friendlier place through which they can volunteer.

Soft Drinks Industry Levy

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Tuesday 18th March 2025 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

I thank the noble Lord for that point. He will know that the Defra-led food strategy will assist us across government in tackling this.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, I will follow up on the question from the noble Baroness, Lady Bennett of Manor Castle, about the regulation of foods for babies and toddlers. Is the Minister aware that some of the fruit and vegetable pouches marketed for babies from four months onwards—despite the advice that they should not be weaned until they are six months old—contain more sugar per 100 millilitres than Coca-Cola? Some toddlers’ teeth are being rotted as they emerge from their gums. When will the Minister take action on this?

Prostate Cancer: National Screening Programme

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Thursday 27th February 2025 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

My Lords, I am glad to hear that the right reverend Prelate had such good care in the NHS. His comments are appreciated, and we are very pleased that things have out turned so well for him. The issue, as I know he will he understand, is that we cannot offer an inaccurate test to high-risk groups, not least because that increases the risk of adverse effects, unnecessary treatment and misdiagnosis. We are not yet in a scientifically and evidence-based position to offer the national screening programme, and that is why we are taking the action that I outlined in my Answer.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, while we wait for a more reliable screening tool, what are the Government doing to inform men about the very clear risk factors that are known about? To that I would add that maintaining a healthy weight reduces the risk. Additionally, what can the Minister do to reassure men that, if they are in any way worried about any symptom, they are not wasting their GP’s time if they go along and get it checked out?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

The noble Baroness is absolutely right. I encourage everyone, men and women, to be aware of any changes in their bodies. They are not wasting the time of their GP. That is exactly what they should do. As she says, men are disproportionately affected by a number of health conditions, including some cancers, heart disease and type 2 diabetes. As part of addressing this, the Secretary of State has announced that we are developing a men’s health strategy, not least because we know that men are less likely to come forward to deal with health matters.

Young Disabled People: Social Care Services

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Tuesday 28th January 2025 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

I understand and am sympathetic to the points that the noble Baroness makes about Cameron and his family. I listened very closely to the concerns that she raised. As I mentioned in my Answer, we are very aware and absolutely accept that the services are not in the places they need to be. That is why I made the commitment to work closely with the relevant department.

Looking to the future, as recently as November we published what I regard as a very ambitious and wide-ranging whole-system plan, called Keeping Children Safe, Helping Families Thrive. It seeks to break the cycle of crisis intervention and to rebalance the system back towards earlier help for families, which I hope would have been helpful in the situation the noble Baroness describes. All local authorities, including Somerset, have to set out the support available for those with special educational needs and disabilities as they move into adulthood.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, the duty of local authorities to carry out a transition assessment includes whether the child, or their carer, is likely to have needs for care and support after the child in question becomes 18. In the light of that, what resources and guidance are the Government giving to local authorities about the needs of the carers of those transitioning to adulthood? Does the complexity of this whole issue not indicate the need for care co-ordination?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

It certainly does. The noble Baroness has been positive about the plans that we have for the independent commission, led by the noble Baroness, Lady Casey, to resolve once and for all, on a cross-party basis, adult social care. The noble Baroness makes a very good point about the role of carers. Indeed, when we think of a young carer particularly, it is crucial that their needs are considered and that support is given. It is part of the whole way in which we support someone who needs social care, no matter what their age.

Puberty-suppressing Hormones

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Monday 16th December 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, on these Benches we welcome the tone of the Secretary of State’s Statement. I have often said that there are many ways of being human. Growing up can often be a very trying time for teenagers. How much more difficult, then, for those young people with gender distress who are struggling with finding out who they are while being different from their peers, and all without adequate support? It is high time that proper services were put in place for young people struggling alone with these issues. Their families too need help to support them at this difficult time. For too long, children and young people who are struggling with their gender identity have been badly let down by a low standard of care, exceptionally long waiting lists, even by the standard of mental health waiting lists, and an increasingly toxic debate.

We always want to see policy based on the evidence. With any medical treatment, especially for children and young people, the most important thing is to follow the evidence on safety and effectiveness. It is crucial that these sorts of decisions are made by expert clinicians, based on the best possible evidence. It is also important that the results of the consultation and the advice of the Commission on Human Medicines are made public.

Some might wonder why the treatment is deemed not safe for gender dysphoria patients but safe enough for children with early-onset puberty. More transparency might clear up the confusion and give more confidence to patients and their families. However, the Secretary of State himself admits that he does not know what effect the sudden withdrawal of this treatment for young people already embarked on a course of puberty blockers will have. These are the young people with the most urgent need for other types of care in the current situation, so what clinical advice have the Government taken about the effect of withdrawing these drugs on the physical and mental state of young sufferers of gender incongruence already on the drugs, and what physical and psychological support will be offered to them?

In the current circumstances, plans for a clinical trial are welcome, but we would like to know the criteria for those eligible to participate. What assessment have the Government made of the recent Council of Europe report, which raises the ethical and rights implications of offering participation in the trial to only a small group of patients? If the only way to continue access to these drugs is through participation in the clinical trial, whose scope, length and start date have yet to be announced, this lays the Government open to accusations of coercion and breaches of human rights.

We welcome the plans for additional treatment centres in Manchester and Bristol as well as London, but can the Minister say why they will not be up and running for two years? Is it lack of funding, lack of premises or lack of sufficient therapists with the appropriate specialist training? This is a very sensitive area, so the wrong people could do more harm than good. If that is the reason, is there a plan for training up more qualified therapists in time for the opening of the regional treatment centres? I very much look forward to the Minister’s replies to these questions.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Health and Social Care (Baroness Merron) (Lab)]

My Lords, I start by thanking the noble Baroness, Lady Cass, for her work in this very important area. I also refer to the actions taken by the previous Government, which set in train the action we are continuing. As both the noble Lord, Lord Kamall, and the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, rightly said, this is about keeping children safe. There is nothing more important than evidence-based action—which is what we have before us—and taking the necessary steps.

The Cass review made it clear that there is not enough evidence about the long-term effects of using puberty blockers to treat gender incongruence to know whether they are, first, safe and, secondly, beneficial. It is important to bear both in mind. The Commission on Human Medicines independently found that clear evidence of unsafe prescribing exists and recommended that there should be a ban until there can be a safe prescribing environment. That is where we start, and last week’s laying of legislation stops that unsafe prescribing to children and allows time to develop the necessary safeguards, as recommended by the commission. I should just clarify that the legislation is indefinite, not permanent. There will be a full review in 2027 so this continues to be a very live issue.

The clinical trials, referred to by both the noble Lord, Lord Kamall, and the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, will be a world first. It is important to pay tribute to that. In addition to the work currently being undertaken to respond to the recommendations of the Commission on Human Medicines, the trial is presently undergoing development and approvals. The aim is to begin recruitment early in the new year. I am sure there will be an opportunity to update the House on that detail.

In answer to the point from the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, the numbers will be uncapped, which is important. I am sure we all agree that better-quality evidence is critical. The development of the clinical trial between the National Institute for Health and Care Research and NHS England will provide the better-quality evidence that we are all looking for.

The noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, spoke about new services. To make the situation clear, NHS England has already opened three new services in the north-west, London and Bristol. The fourth will be in the east of England and will open its doors in spring next year. The noble Baroness also asked about the timetable; we are on course to have a service in every region of England by 2026. I cannot always confirm developments of that nature, so I am glad to do so because it will help reduce the waiting list, which noble Lords are rightly concerned about. It will also bring services closer to home, which is crucial too.

Furthermore, this is a very specialist area, so recruitment and training are key. This is part of the reason for the—I would not call it a delay—realistic timetable. There is also the need to work with local trusts and take into account all the various operational considerations, so realism rather than delay is how I would put it to the noble Baroness.

I agree with the points made by noble Lords on the Front Bench about tone and discourse. I am very grateful to the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, and the noble Lord, Lord Kamall, for welcoming the way the Secretary of State made the announcement and what the announcement refers to. We have a real responsibility in this House—and outside it—to handle conversations on this topic extremely sensitively. This is about people’s lives. I absolutely agree with the point just made: the public debate has been frighteningly toxic. Irresponsible statements made recently have put young people at risk of serious harm and that has to stop. That is one of the many reasons I welcome the Statement—and the tone and discourse this evening.

On the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Kamall, about alternatives to puberty blockers, no exact alternatives are being offered. However, within the new services there will be an emphasis on, for example, psychosocial support.

In response to the point made by the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, about the—she did not use this word, but perhaps I might—transparency of evidence, all the commission’s recommendations have been published in full as part of the Government’s response to the consultation. The full advice, as I hope the noble Baroness will understand, was prepared solely for Ministers, but we are considering whether it should be published. I know the noble Baroness will understand that, as with all advice prepared for Ministers, there are legal and other matters that must be considered before it can happen.

I will say a word on mental health support, which is so important for children and young people. An offer of an appointment with a mental health professional has been made to everyone on the national waiting list for children and young people’s gender identity services. Those who joined the waiting list on or after 1 September will have an appointment with a mental health professional or paediatrician before being referred to specialist gender services. Those who are not on the waiting list and are directly affected by the restrictions can access NHS mental health services through a dedicated single point of contact, supported by clinical nursing.

I hope that is helpful, and if there are any points I have missed—

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

Can the Minister address the issue of the children who are part-way through a course of treatment? Will they get mental health support as a priority?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

For those who are already on puberty blockers, there is an immediate withdrawal. But I hope that what I have outlined on mental health support covers all the areas the noble Baroness, and indeed all of us, are concerned about. The approach is as compressive as possible, and the new gender services I described should make it even easier to provide the service. It is not a matter of waiting until 2026; we absolutely understand the need to provide that support now, and we are making that available.

Bread and Flour Regulations 1998

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Wednesday 11th December 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

I will be glad to look into that and to update the noble Lord and your Lordships’ House on the matter.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, I congratulate the noble Lord, Lord Rooker, on his persistence; these Benches have always supported him. I welcome that more NTDs will be prevented. However, given that we have to wait yet another two years and that the Government’s guidance for women who wish to become pregnant or who are pregnant is to continue taking folic acid supplements, are the Government looking at creative ways of making it easier for them to do that —for example, having them available for free in antenatal clinics or at family hubs?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

As I mentioned earlier, while 24 months is a realistic transition, not everything will wait that long. It is the case, as the noble Baroness says, that there is still advice to women who could become pregnant to take folic acid supplements, and it is important that we keep that message going. However, 50% of pregnancies are not planned, so it is not possible to prepare by taking supplements. We are looking at all ways of effectively getting the message across.

Bread and Flour Regulations 1998

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Wednesday 11th September 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

My noble friend has been a tremendous campaigner. Indeed, he reminded me that this is, I believe, his 22nd Question on this matter, so I do not wish to test his patience. I absolutely assure him that, as he said, the policy is being taken forward as a UK-wide measure and all the necessary preliminary legislative steps have been taken, including the public consultations he mentioned, which were reported on earlier this year. Subject to renewed collective agreement in England, Defra will lay legislation later in 2024.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, I am hearing that, unfortunately, the Government are not being very ambitious in the level of fortification that they will propose. They are considering a level that will reduce neural defects by only about 20%, whereas 1 milligram of folic acid in 100 grams of flour could reduce neural tube defects by 80%, which is a massive amount. Can the Minister at least reassure me that the appropriate committees will look at the level of fortification being proposed, so that it is appropriate and safe?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

I assure the noble Baroness that that has already happened. As I am sure your Lordships’ House is aware, the proposal is to add 250 micrograms of folic acid per 100 grams of non-wholemeal wheat flour. I emphasise that this fortification would be in addition to the foods that are already voluntarily fortified, such as a wide variety of breakfast cereals, so we are not talking about just bread. The feeling among the experts, to whom we listen, and the committees to which the noble Baroness referred is that this is the right level at which we can provide reassurance, and so this is where we are focusing our efforts.

NHS: Breast Screening Programme

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Tuesday 3rd September 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

If a woman in the age group to which the noble Baroness refers has concerns, she may request follow-up and investigation. But it is the case that we follow the scientific advice, which is that going beyond that age as a matter of course will not give the rewards that we would hope. I can certainly reassure any woman in that age group that she will be seen should she have concerns, and she should present herself as soon as possible.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, artificial intelligence has been very efficient in helping to interpret breast imaging, reducing false positives and false negatives, and significantly reducing the workload of the second reader. We know that early detection is key to reducing mortality, and I understand that AI can be used to identify patients with high risk so that they can be screened more frequently and proactively. What work is being done to use AI to identify high-risk individuals, so they can be screened more frequently?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

It is important to ensure that the service is there for those who are at greater risk. The noble Baroness is right to refer to the growing interest in and potential use of AI, which is indeed very exciting. The National Screening Committee is very aware of this point. The committee is working with the National Institute for Health and Care Research and NHS England, and has designed a research project to see whether AI can be safely used to read mammograms in the breast screening programme, and whether that is acceptable both to women and to clinicians. That work will continue.

NHS Blood and Transplant Service: Blood Stocks

Debate between Baroness Walmsley and Baroness Merron

Tuesday 30th July 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

I will need to come back to my noble friend on that last question, but I assure your Lordships’ House that action was taken to increase the number of donors and the supply of the necessary blood even before the alert was announced. An alert creates better conditions, because more people come forward and rally. I thank them very much for that. On the donor centres, it is possible, of course, to give blood every day of the year apart from Christmas Day.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, as the universities return in the autumn, many new students will be recruited to be blood donors, which is a very good thing, because they often remain blood donors for many decades. The system needs to recruit 140,000 new donors every year for various reasons. But what about other young people? Will the Government do what they can to help the blood transfusion service to devise ways and means of encouraging other young people to become blood donors and, we hope, carry on doing so for decades?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

The noble Baroness is absolutely right that we need to encourage young people to come forward and to stay in the system. I have been in discussion with the chief executive and the chair of the service about how we can build more resilience and extend the number of donors. I am sure noble Lords will be pleased to know that, with the assistance of the actors Hugh Jackman and Ryan Reynolds, there is an exciting partnership with the Disney action film “Deadpool & Wolverine”, which is exactly intended to reach new and younger donors, and donors of black heritage. I am sure it will.