Baroness Goldie
Main Page: Baroness Goldie (Conservative - Life peer)Extradition Treaty: UK and the State of Kuwait
Baroness Goldie Excerpts
Baroness Goldie (Con)
My Lords, I am pleased to speak for the Government today on the important matter of extradition, a matter in which I know the House has taken a close interest over recent years. By way of introduction, I say to the noble Lord, Lord Collins, that I have observed his disquiet over procedure. In the small number of debates we have had on treaties—I think we had two before tonight—we have not had speakers’ lists, but I am prepared to take it up with the usual channels, because in terms of certainty, and so that people can make a judgment on whether they wish to participate in the debate, further information might be helpful. I undertake to relay that to my very good chum the Chief Whip and see what progress I can make.
I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Collins, for securing this debate to discuss a further step forward in enhancing the close relationship between the UK and an important and valued historical friend in the Middle East: Kuwait. Our co-operation with Kuwait in recent years has spanned the entire spectrum of the UK’s strategic priorities. It has focused on building links between our economies through developing trade and investment, working together to counter the threat from extremism, radicalisation and terrorism that we both face, and continuing to enhance our close and valuable military relationship. Together, we also strive to support peace and stability in a changing region. Kuwait is a major donor in areas of conflict, providing humanitarian aid in Syria and Yemen, as well as supporting projects for the reconstruction of Iraq.
The UK has strongly supported Kuwait’s mediation efforts in recent talks in the Gulf and its support for de-escalation and Gulf unity has demonstrated its commitment to regional stability. As a non-permanent member of the United Nations Security Council since January 2018, Kuwait has also worked effectively alongside the UK, during which time Kuwait has arranged a fact-finding mission on the Rohingya crisis, supported sanctions against the DPRK and condemned the use of, or threat to use, chemical weapons following the appalling incident of the Salisbury poisoning in our own country. As a close friend, we are also able to offer support and advice, where appropriate, as Kuwait continues to develop its democracy, governance and human rights frameworks. I will come to this point and points specifically raised by noble Lords in the course of my comments.
The next important frontier in our co-operation with Kuwait is that of criminal justice. The noble Baroness, Lady Northover, asked about the context of all this. I have tried to explain that we value our very close relationship with Kuwait and we want to reach a mutually supportive situation in which we can each play our role in dealing with challenging issues that arise in the field of and in relation to criminal justice. That is why co-operation on criminal justice with Kuwait is very important.
In July, the Policing Minister laid before Parliament a package of judicial co-operation measures, comprising treaties on mutual legal assistance and extradition. Kuwait has acted with admirable swiftness to be ready to ratify both treaties. I am very pleased that they have now been laid before the House for the requisite number of sitting days to now allow the Government to move towards ratification. As your Lordships may be aware, the mutual legal assistance treaty needs no further legislation to be able to enter into force and will be ratified in the coming months.
In accordance with the provisions of the Extradition Act, Kuwait must be designated a Part 2 country before ratification of the latter treaty can take place. As the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, observed, there have been pressures on the parliamentary timetable with Brexit, but the Government intend to lay a statutory instrument to effect ratification as soon as the parliamentary timetable allows. Orders made under the Extradition Act are made under the affirmative procedure, so it will not be long before your Lordships have the opportunity to debate this treaty a second time. Work is proceeding on the drafting. As I say, the next task is to find a slot in the parliamentary timetable.
By way of general comment on extradition, the UK’s extradition framework is an essential tool for ensuring that those who seek to flee from their crimes are not able to evade justice. In a world where crime and terrorism are no longer contained within national borders, the importance of ensuring effective co-operation on criminal justice has never been greater. We all share a deep respect for the fundamental principle that no one should be above the law. The extradition treaty we are discussing tonight is a further building block in an international structure that will facilitate our collective global ability to bear down on terrorism and serious organised crime. The Government are pleased to have the co-operation of Kuwait on this important issue.
The noble Lord, Lord Collins, and the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, have tonight raised a number of issues relating to Kuwait’s human rights record and the continued use of the death penalty. Let me reaffirm: this Government are committed to upholding human rights and oppose the death penalty in all circumstances as a matter of principle. The safeguards available in the Extradition Act are strong and reliable in that respect. Extradition from the UK is not possible if it would be incompatible with a person’s human rights. The Home Secretary must not, in law, order an individual’s extradition if they have been, will be or could be sentenced to death. I hope that clarifies matters that naturally concerned the noble Lord, Lord Collins, and the noble Baroness.
On the broader issues raised, the Government of Kuwait respect our position on this matter and we have accordingly included provisions in the treaty before both Houses that make it entirely clear.
On human rights, the noble Lord, Lord Collins, referred to the position of LGBT persons in Kuwait. I was looking at the grounds for refusal in the treaty.
Lord Collins of Highbury
I am sorry to interrupt the Minister. I did read out the grounds and it did not seem clear that sexual orientation was covered, although there is a sentence referring to “sex and other”. Could she clarify that?
Baroness Goldie
I would take great pleasure in doing that. I am just talking about the first paragraph, Article 3(1)(a), which I think the noble Lord read out. My understanding is that the specific reference to sex, or indeed to status, is intended to ensure that persons are not wrongly persecuted for their sexual orientation and that extradition under this treaty shall be refused in any such cases. I hope that that clarifies the understanding of the position.
Lord Cashman (Lab)
Can I seek a further reassurance? As regards the reference to “other” status, as in the UN Declaration of Human Rights, in my dealings with some African, Caribbean and Pacific countries I have noted that some significantly fail to recognise that “other” status includes sexual orientation.
Baroness Goldie
I have described the grounds on which extradition under this treaty would be refused. As your Lordships will be aware, the exercise of extradition is a matter for both the Home Secretary and the courts. The courts must consider the actual application. That is our interpretation of what the phrasing means.
Lord Collins of Highbury
My question did not relate specifically to crimes because of somebody’s sexuality. There can be circumstances where, if someone is being sent back to a country where homosexuality is illegal—and certainly homosexual acts are—and it becomes known that that person is gay, they might be accused or charged with one crime but could then be subject to treatment because of their sexuality. It is that issue that I sought clarity on.
Baroness Goldie
I will write to the noble Lord in further detail. This will come before the House again in the form of the affirmative statutory instrument, but I am very happy to seek further clarification on the points being raised to see whether I can go further than what I have before me this evening.
The noble Lord, Lord Collins, and the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, also raised the matter of the decision in the cases of Alexanda Kotey and El Shafee Elsheikh. That was not an extradition of individuals. It was a decision by the Home Secretary to provide assistance, including mutual legal assistance. The decisions are taken in accordance with the Government’s overseas security and justice assistance guidance, which requires an assessment of human rights risk, including the death penalty. Overseas security and justice assistance guidance has always permitted the Government not to require assurances in mutual legal assurance requests where there are strong reasons not to do so. I reiterate that the UK remains opposed to the death penalty in all circumstances as a matter of principle.
I think that the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, raised the particular matter of Al Rajaan. I cannot comment on individual cases, I am afraid; that is not the policy of the Government. On the serious issue of the 2017 executions, I repeat the Government’s position on the death penalty: we believe that the death penalty undermines human dignity, there is no conclusive evidence of its deterrent value, and any miscarriage of justice leading to its imposition is clearly irreparable. We raised our concerns with the Government of Kuwait at the time and expressed our disquiet that this should have taken place. Again, regarding potential extraditions, we do not comment on individual cases.
The noble Baroness, Lady Northover, raised the matter of other Gulf states. As noble Lords have pointed out, extradition is clearly possible on a case-by-case basis with all countries, regardless of treaties. The Government discuss mutual legal assistance and extradition with partners in the course of bilateral relations. The extradition treaty was negotiated in its own right without linkage to other policy areas. There is a word here that I cannot make out because the writing in the Box is, I am afraid, not of the clarity that I was taught to observe in primary 1 in my Scottish school. I beg the Box’s pardon. It was laid in Parliament as part of a judicial co-operation package alongside a mutual legal assistance treaty. I hope that that reassures the noble Baroness.
In conclusion, we are committed to the global campaign to abolish the death penalty and continue to maintain this position in discussions with the Government of Kuwait. This forms part of the advice and support, which I mentioned earlier, that we provide as Kuwait continues to develop its democracy, governance and human rights frameworks. We share with Kuwait a commitment to pursuing justice internationally.
Baroness Northover
Perhaps when the Minister writes to the noble Lord, Lord Collins, she might also address some of my other questions with a bit more precision—perhaps she will be able to read the writing of the people in the Box. I would be grateful if she did that.
Baroness Goldie
Yes, of course. I will be very happy to do that. As your Lordships are aware, I do look at the Official Report and try to address any points I may have overlooked in the debate. I certainly undertake to do that.
Viscount Waverley (CB)
In the spirit of writing, perhaps the Minister might wish to reflect on this. Given that she has suggested that this is going to come before the House again, I have been reflecting on it during the debate but I have not fully worked out my thinking. Is there any question in relation to the European arrest warrant? Some odd cases have come through the system where the system has been somewhat abused, if I may say, by certain states. Is there any possibility that European arrest warrant issues will come into play and be relevant to this? People are shaking their heads but perhaps the Minister might wish to respond.
Baroness Goldie
It is a rare pleasure to receive comfort from the Liberal Democrat Benches. I understand from the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, that this does not appear to be germane to the issue under discussion—but I hear what the noble Viscount says.
A noble Lord
Viscount Waverley
It was a question of whether any other state within the European Union could come into play and make an issue in relation to the European arrest warrant that might affect the process.
Baroness Goldie
I can see a whole debate being possible on this issue alone. I hear what the noble Viscount is saying and we will certainly bear that in mind when we come to a later state of the procedure.
I am sure your Lordships will have realised that the whole purpose of this is to ensure that criminals are brought to trial. But it also means, as noble Lords have rightly pointed out, ensuring that our judicial system maintains its full respect for human rights and protection of those procedural safeguards necessary to ensure the fairness of our system. Our extradition framework, including this treaty, achieves a balance of these fundamental principles, and we look forward to the success of our future co-operation with Kuwait on this crucial subject.
In conclusion, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Collins, for introducing this very illuminating debate, which was a helpful prelude to the debate that will take place when the affirmative instrument comes to the Chamber. It has been a useful opportunity to listen to the exchange of views and I thank noble Lords for their contributions.
Lord Collins of Highbury
I thank the Minister for her response. I have attended one other debate on the treaty. The noble Baroness who moved that Motion exercised her right of reply and, as there is no speakers list, I will do the same.
I just want to reassure the Minister that I do not see this treaty as something bad or regrettable. It is an opportunity. As the Minister says, individual cases can be considered anyway by the courts, but in negotiating and agreeing this treaty, the opportunity was there, as she rightly said, to raise issues about due process and human rights and our concerns over the use of the death penalty. I am somewhat reassured by her comments in this regard.
The Minister said that the purpose of the treaty is that no one should be able to avoid justice—absolutely right. We certainly need to ensure that globally people cannot act with impunity. She knows that I have raised this point on many occasions. No one should avoid justice, and justice must be served and be seen to be served. That is why it is really important for the principles we have raised in the debate to be heard. I am grateful to the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, for her contribution. It is absolutely right that we see these things in context and see them as an opportunity to bring change. The fact that there are still countries in this world where being gay is subject to execution is absolutely disgusting and we need to challenge that.