European Union (Referendum) Bill

Baroness Anelay of St Johns Excerpts

Friday 31st January 2014 Lords Chamber

[The Deputy Chairman of Committees (Lord Geddes) (Con)]

The Question is that the House be resumed. Since this is a somewhat unusual situation, I should advise the Committee that this Question is debatable and, if necessary, divisible.

[Baroness Anelay of St Johns (Con)]

My Lords, clearly, I listened very carefully to what the noble Lord, Lord Lipsey, said. My role as government Chief Whip is very clear. In scheduling Private Members’ Bills, it has always been the practice of all government Chief Whips in all parties to consult the sponsor of the relevant Bill in that scheduling. My role in the proceedings has been to facilitate the scrutiny of this Bill by this House. As ever, progress is in the hands of the House. We are a self-regulating House. Therefore, the Motion moved by the noble Lord, Lord Lipsey, is, indeed, a legitimate Motion. As he says, it is unusual for a Back-Bencher to move it, but it is by no means not available to him. That is a double negative, but I mean that his action in moving the Motion is legitimate.

The noble Lord referred to the House’s use of time and predicts that it will progress so slowly that it will not rise, at this rate, until the early hours of the morning. I do not like to predict; I like to go on what is and what has been. That is what I sought to do last week when I gave advice to the House. Last week, we got through 14 groups of amendments in reasonable time. Several of those debates involved big, important subjects. Indeed, the Committee amended the referendum question itself. This week, there are 15 groups of amendments, after about another 14 were tabled between the two stages. They are largely on second-order matters —some are important—but we have made rather less progress.

[Noble Lords]

Oh!

[Baroness Anelay of St Johns]

It is clear that we have made less progress. Noble Lords may disagree with me on whether they are first-order or second-order matters; it will be a matter of opinion—I appreciate that.

It is, of course, for others, not me, to judge, but some Members of this House may believe that not everybody has focused entirely on the amendments in hand. Comments were made, particularly on the previous group of amendments, on why matters were not grouped. I am not expressing my view wearing any of my three hats. By the way, I do not like wearing hats—I am just straightforward; I get on with it.

I am certainly grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Lipsey, for the way in which he put his Motion. He was very courteous. However, I would like my name to be pronounced properly once in this Chamber. It would be nice as I have been here since 1996, but there you go. The noble Lord has moved that the House be now resumed. That would mean that we would now abandon the Committee stage, if that is what the House wishes to do. The noble Lord has done the House a service because he has enabled every single Member present today to put on record whether or not they wish the Bill to pass.

[Noble Lords]

No!

[Baroness Anelay of St Johns]

My Lords, if the Motion is agreed, I will not be able to offer my noble friend Lord Dobbs more time for the Bill because the House itself will have collectively indicated that it no longer wishes to consider the Committee stage. If the House disagrees the Motion, I will take that as a desirable, clear indication that we should complete the remainder of the Committee stage today.

It is not a difficult question and I think we all know where we are so, after some consideration of our proper conduct, I beg to move that the Question be now put.

[The Deputy Chairman of Committees (Baroness Morris of Bolton) (Con)]

My Lords, I am instructed by order of the House to say that the Motion “That the Question be now put” is considered to be a most exceptional procedure and the House will not accept it save in circumstances where it is felt to be the only means of ensuring the proper conduct of the business of the House; further, if a Member who seeks to move it persists in his or her intention, the practice of the House is that the Question on the Motion is put without debate. Does the noble Baroness still wish to move the closure Motion?

[Baroness Anelay of St Johns]

I wish to move it.