Online Animal Sales: Regulation

Debate between Andy Carter and Jo Churchill

Monday 13th December 2021 Westminster Hall

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Jo Churchill)]

Indeed I will, Mr Mundell; it is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship. I start by paying tribute to the hon. Member for Neath (Christina Rees), who laid out brilliantly the challenges we face: she cantered through the challenge posed by the online world while recognising the work of the Pet Advertising Advisory Group.

I pay tribute to Richard, or Rick, Ackers for the work he has done. As he has heard this afternoon, we do not always speak with one voice in this place, but he has managed to galvanise Members from all sides of the House to put forward a very compelling case that there is a challenge here. I hope he will hear in my response something to give him hope that we recognise not only that the issue is a challenge, but that we need help from people like him to get the right answers. Such cases cause emotional distress. As we heard from the hon. Member for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath (Neale Hanvey), when someone is presented with a small puppy, their heart melts. As a Labrador owner, my sympathy is with Richard, his family and his children. What happened is just grim.

We are a nation of animal lovers—if we wanted to prove that, this afternoon’s debate could not have done a better job. We abhor with one voice the mistreatment of animals. The Government have worked hard to improve the welfare of animals wherever they are, but, as today’s debate has outlined, there are still gaps that need filling. Our record on animal welfare is good, and in recent years we have done more to make sure that we are filling those gaps and that animals receive the care and protection they deserve. Only in June this year, the Animal Welfare (Sentencing) Act 2021 came into force, delivering on our manifesto commitment to increase the sentences available in our courts for the most serious cases of animal cruelty from six months to five years. We also launched our action plan for animal welfare this year, bringing together the wide range of different issues we are dealing with and setting out our future aims and ambitions. In addition, our commitment to maintain the UK at the leading edge of animal welfare is one with which we all agree.

As we have heard, the Justice For Reggie campaign that stems from Reggie’s sad little life focuses on the advertising requirements that apply to the sale of pets. The online sale of pets is currently regulated as follows: under the Animal Welfare (Licensing of Activities Involving Animals) (England) Regulations 2018, anyone in the business of selling animals as pets, or breeding or selling dogs, requires a valid licence. As we have heard, this is a challenge: we have strengthened things up such that dog breeders are expected to obtain a licence if they breed and sell three or more litters per year.

The sale of puppies, kittens, ferrets and rabbits under the age of eight weeks is prohibited, and we talk to Scotland quite regularly about that issue, to ensure we can learn from what is being done there. That prohibition prevents licensed breeders from selling dogs not bred by them and from breeding dogs where it can be reasonably expected, on the basis of their genotype, phenotype or health, that doing so would lead to welfare problems. My right hon. Friend the Member for Hemel Hempstead (Sir Mike Penning) raised that issue.

Licensed breeders must also show puppies to purchasers in the presence of their mum. However, we heard that that is not always the easiest thing to insist on when someone is presented with the puppy, particularly if those around them want to take it home. Licensed sellers advertising puppies for sale must include their number; during the recent Animals (Penalty Notices) Bill, the shadow Minister and I spoke about how that will add another tool to our toolbox. We heard about how Lucy’s law stops the early separation of animals from their mums, unnecessary journeys at a young age from breeder to pet shop, and the keeping of puppies in inappropriate commercial premises. We have also heard that, for all that, these things still go on.

Under these licensing requirements, licensees must meet strict statutory welfare standards. Anybody who advertises must include their number on the advert, and must specify which local authority issued the licence. There is an onus on us, and Rick has said that at every stage he should have done more. However, I am cognisant of the fact that while that is easy to say, it is quite challenging to do.

[Andy Carter]

Does my hon. Friend agree with me that social media companies can play a much bigger part? It is not beyond the wit of man to create a form for that type of information—those licence numbers—to be entered in, so that they could be clearly verified using technology. Could she consider that with colleagues in DCMS?

[Jo Churchill]

My hon. Friend brings up a point about responsibility. There is responsibility on those who purchase and on the breeders, but there must also be responsibility on online companies. The hon. Member for Neath mentioned databases; making sure that databases are functional is also important in this space, and it is something that I think Mr Ackers has also addressed in his work.