Commons Financial Privilege

Andrew Turner Excerpts

Wednesday 28th October 2015 Commons Chamber

[Chris Grayling]

As I said earlier, we will give more details about the panel’s composition and terms of reference shortly.

[Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con)]

Is it not true that although changes to the House of Lords might be necessary, the last thing we want is another House of Commons?

[Chris Grayling]

My hon. Friend sets out one of the great subjects of debate: if we replace the House of Lords with something else, should it be elected? As he knows, that has been debated several times since he and I were first elected in 2001, and I suspect that it will now be debated again. The important thing, from my point of view, is to deal in the coming months with the apparent wrecking strategy that Labour and the Liberal Democrats in the House of Lords appear to be taking to the platform of the elected Government, so we have to resolve these matters quickly.

English Votes for English Laws and North Wales

Andrew Turner Excerpts

Wednesday 1st July 2015 Westminster Hall

[Albert Owen (Ynys Môn) (Lab)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered English votes for English laws and North Wales.

It is good to see so many hon. Members from across the United Kingdom who are interested in North Wales. That was the purpose of this debate. We live in interesting constitutional times and I welcome the opportunity to put the case for Wales, and North Wales in particular. In the 1880s we had the Irish question. In the latter part of the 20th century, there was devolution to Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland and we had the West Lothian question. Today, we have the North Wales question, which is an important constitutional issue.

Although I support it, devolution is unbalanced, asymmetrical and needs adjusting, but I do not believe the Government’s proposal for English votes on English laws is the answer. The UK Parliament is creaking and the devolution settlement is messy, but we need to deal with it objectively through a UK constitutional convention. That is the basis of my argument.

I want to make it clear that I support devolution. I supported it in the 1970s, when the majority of my party did not, and I supported it in 1997-98, when it was the will of the Welsh people, and the people of Scotland and Northern Ireland. It is important to remember that part of that devolution settlement was the creation of the London Assembly and the establishment of the Mayor of London, giving powers to the largest city in England. That was important, but we should have gone further. I am not just saying that with hindsight; I was arguing for it at the time, before I was a Member of Parliament, because I could see that it was an uneven settlement. I should have liked the regions of England to have an element of devolution, too, because that would have provided balance.

I go a step further than my party: I believe in a federal United Kingdom. I think we should have an English Parliament within the UK. We should retain the UK Parliament for foreign affairs and other bigger issues that concern the whole United Kingdom. I know, because I am a realist, that this is not an issue for today, but we must look to the future for a UK convention on constitutional rights.

[Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con)]

Will the hon. Gentleman explain whether there would be a separate House of Commons in a federal organisation, compared with the English basis, or can they be combined?

[Albert Owen]

I appreciate that intervention from a fellow islander. I was in Jersey yesterday, watching the Island games and cheering Isle of Wight on. The hon. Gentleman makes a serious point. We need a proper convention to consider these issues, because some of the arguments have not been dealt with in great detail in this House. The knee-jerk reaction of having English laws and English votes is not the answer; it is a sticking plaster and it will cause more problems than it will create solutions.

--- Later in debate ---

[Antoinette Sandbach (Eddisbury) (Con)]

Thank you, Mr Crausby, for calling me to speak. I am grateful to the hon. Member for Ynys Môn (Albert Owen) for securing the debate. In reality, it is easy to answer the question of the right hon. Member for Delyn (Mr Hanson) about how to identify which votes are on English-only matters and which are not. We simply look at the Wales Act 2014, for example, and decide which powers have been devolved to Wales and which are reserved; that will identify them. It happens all the time in the National Assembly for Wales, with the process delegated to the Presiding Officer. I would, however, have a great deal more sympathy with the position of the right hon. Gentleman if he had not voted for that asymmetrical and uneven devolution settlement, described by the hon. Member for Ynys Môn. We need to remember that all the arguments were made when the Government of Wales Acts were before Parliament. All those issues were identified.

I have a great deal of sympathy with the hon. Member for Ellesmere Port and Neston (Justin Madders) on his frustrations with Natural Resources Wales, a body that is incredibly inefficient and should never have been set up; I opposed it when I was in the Assembly. However, the hon. Gentleman still has an ability to influence it, and to contact it on behalf of his constituents, although he does not have an ability to vote on setting up such a body—but that is the position that my constituents are in.

As described by the right hon. Member for Delyn, I have farmers who go over to Wales to sell their products in the market at Mold. They are subject to Welsh tuberculosis restrictions on pre-movement testing of cattle, but cannot vote on the matter. That constitutional settlement was put in place by the Labour party. All the arguments we have heard today were rehearsed then—we have been hearing them for years.

I accept all the points made by Members on both sides of the House about our strong links and ties, which have been there for generations, but we have to deal with the unfairness affecting England. That issue has been raised on the doorstep. The hon. Member for Aberdeen North (Kirsty Blackman) ought to realise that it is a great cause for concern when education or health matters, which are wholly devolved to the Scottish Government, can be voted on by Scottish MPs. In reality, she will have an opportunity to vote on financial matters that may affect her constituents, because there will be a vote on the Budget and an opportunity to debate those matters.

The unevenness of the constitutional settlement was recognised by the fact that the Conservative party secured a majority with an election manifesto commitment to deliver English votes for English laws. My hon. Friend the Member for Vale of Clwyd (James Davies) was right to say that we cannot have it both ways. If something is in the Scotland Act 1998 or the Government of Wales Act 2006, it is devolved, so what constitutes an English or Scottish matter will be very clear to the Speaker. Everyone will vote on the Budget—there is no suggestion that that will not happen—but English votes for English laws is a matter of fundamental fairness in this House, and needs to be addressed. If matters are devolved to Scotland or Wales, it should be English MPs who have the vote on those matters in England. Failing to address that fundamental unfairness undermines the integrity of this House.

[Mr Andrew Turner]

May I ask what the difference is between the system we are proposing and one that includes a long-term think about things, which is basically what the Labour party favours?

--- Later in debate ---

[Pete Wishart]

I am sorry, but I cannot give way, because I have to leave time for the Front Benchers.

Instead, the proposal has been rushed through at breakneck speed. We learned yesterday from the press that the Leader of the House of Commons intends to bring forward his proposals before recess—before anybody has had an opportunity to try to understand and assess what is going on.

My hon. Friend the Member for Aberdeen North (Kirsty Blackman) and several other Members have consistently and continually asked the Leader of the House to start to explain a little about the process and how this matter will be determined. All we hear in return is that he will bring his proposals to the House soon. I think we know that, because he has said it on several occasions, but why can he not answer basic questions about what is proposed? Is what the Government are trying to do with EVEL a state secret?

We need a debate. We have to understand what is going on, because it will impact on my rights to represent my constituents effectively in the House. It will have an impact on the ability of everyone who has contributed to the debate to represent properly the people who elected us to do our jobs here.

[Mr Andrew Turner]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Pete Wishart]

I do not have time to take interventions.

It is important that we have a proper debate and proper scrutiny. We know a little about EVEL because William Hague presented his Command Paper at the end of the last Parliament. We have a sort of EVEL hokey cokey. It looks as though Welsh and Scottish Members will be gatekeepers to Bills—we will all get an opportunity to debate and vote on Second Reading. Then we will all be sent away and there will presumably be some sort of English Grand Committee, where the English Members will work on a Bill and cross the t’s and dot the i’s. The Bill will then come back to us again and, bizarrely, after English Members have done all the work on a Bill, we will get an opportunity to vote it down if we do not like it. Have you ever heard anything so bizarre or absurd, Mr Crausby? We will leave the English Members to do all the work and then decide whether we like what they have done. No wonder so many English Members are furious about the suggestion and do not like the proposals. It is a bizarre way to go forward.

The proposed arrangement will place the Speaker in the most invidious political situation possible, as it will be up to him to determine whether Bills are English only. We see in the Command Paper that the only people he will consult are the Clerks. He has to do better than that. He has to consult the Welsh Assembly. He has to consult the Presiding Officer of the Scottish Parliament to ensure that there is no Scottish consequence or impact—these things need to be determined. And it will not be open to legal challenge—that is the real reason why the Government are not bringing forward legislation. The constitution unit told us clearly that if it was introduced through legislation, there would be the possibility and option of legal challenge—the constituents we represent would be able to challenge something decided in this House. The Government are pursuing the idea of Speaker certification to take it out of the hands of the law, so that no one will have the opportunity to raise questions about its legality. That is unfair and bizarre. It is no way to proceed with something so important. We must have a say. I pity the Speaker of the House of Commons; he will be placed in a political situation of determining whether something has an impact on or consequence for the constituents we represent. That is not fair. No wonder the Speaker is anxious and nervous about being given such powers.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Turner]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Pete Wishart]

I will not give way to the hon. Gentleman.

[Mr Turner]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Pete Wishart]

Can the hon. Gentleman not hear? Is he incapable of hearing, Mr Crausby? [Interruption.]

Business of the House

Andrew Turner Excerpts

Thursday 4th June 2015 Commons Chamber

[Chris Grayling]

I know that this issue has already been raised with Ministers this week, and that they take Members’ views on it seriously. I will ensure that the hon. Gentleman’s concerns are once again passed on to my colleagues in the Department of Health today.

[Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con)]

There is a troubling example of poor development in an area of outstanding natural beauty in my constituency. Will my right hon. Friend consider finding time for a debate on the subject, and in particular whether there should be restrictions on the use of retrospective planning permissions in AONBs?

[Chris Grayling]

I am always concerned when I hear about planning going wrong in the way I suspect it has done in my hon. Friend’s constituency. It may be most helpful to Ministers if he could produce a short summary of what has gone wrong and pass it to them. That will enable them to look at the regulations and see whether anything needs to be changed.

Oral Answers to Questions

Andrew Turner Excerpts

Thursday 4th June 2015 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

I call Ian Austin—not here.

[Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con)]

3. What his policy is on the House sitting later into the evenings on Tuesdays and Wednesdays.

[The Deputy Leader of the House of Commons (Dr Thérèse Coffey)]

The Government currently have no plans to bring forward changes to the sitting hours of the House.

[Mr Turner]

A large majority of Members are simply unable to get home in the evenings, and we did not come to London to be given lots of free time. As we have so many new Members, may we ask again whether it is the will of the House that we sit later on Tuesdays and Wednesdays? I would certainly vote in favour of such a proposal, and I know that many other right hon. and hon. Members would agree with me.

[Dr Coffey]

Hon. Members had the opportunity to vote in the previous Parliament, and I suspect that my hon. Friend and I were in the same Lobby at the time. The Procedure Committee revisited the situation, and could do so again if Members made representations to it, but I repeat that the Government have no plans to change the sitting hours of the House.

Business of the House

Andrew Turner Excerpts

Thursday 28th May 2015 Commons Chamber

[Chris Grayling]

I am proud of what we have done to encourage the growth and development of sciences in this country. It is a matter of record that while we had to take difficult public spending decisions in the previous Parliament, we also managed to protect the science budget and to do all we could, through the development of apprenticeship programmes and of higher standards in schools, to encourage more people to learn sciences, develop science skills and, hopefully, go on into teaching. Teach First offers an opportunity to get smart people into deprived areas to provide high-quality teaching, and we will continue with that policy.

[Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con)]

Yesterday, I was present for Her Majesty’s most Gracious Speech. Had I not been, I would have accepted an invitation from Red Funnel to hear the announcement that its new vessel, Red Jet 6, is to be built on the Isle of Wight. She is the first vessel of her kind to be built in the UK for 15 years, and the contract was won in competition with shipyards around the world. Will the Leader of the House find time to hold a debate on the future of British shipbuilding?

[Chris Grayling]

May I congratulate my hon. Friend’s constituents on winning that contract? The Red Funnel line is vital to them. As he knows, I travelled on it recently when I came over to visit him. I met some of the staff who work on the line, and I was very impressed with the service, which is crucial to the island. I know that my hon. Friend will use the opportunities that are available to Back Benchers to continue to bring forward debates on this and other matters of importance to his constituency in the way he has done since we were both first elected in 2001.

Business of the House

Andrew Turner Excerpts

Thursday 5th March 2015 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

As the hon. Gentleman will know, the two right hon. Members in question have referred themselves to the Parliamentary Commissioner for Standards. That has been the correct thing to do, and the matter will now be investigated.

On Prime Minister’s questions, I am sure that in future Parliaments—in the next Parliament—the Procedure Committee and the House as a whole can consider any suggested changes. We can always change and improve our procedures, and it is always important to have an eye on doing so. I would only add that in my experience all over the world as Foreign Secretary for most of the past five years, our Parliament and its proceedings are widely admired. Many people in countries all over the world have expressed to me the wish that they could question their Head of Government in the same way we can here in this House, and so we must not lose that central aspect of our proceedings.

[Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con)]

Reports this week of a woman acting as a surrogate to give birth to her own son’s baby have shocked many people, not least because the procedure was reportedly carried out in a clinic licensed by the Human Fertilisation and Embryology Authority. Will my right hon. Friend, as one of his final acts, find time for an urgent debate on the actions of the HFEA and the fertility clinic involved in this case? If an urgent debate is not possible, what will he do?

[Mr Hague]

Given the time constraints that I have mentioned several times, an urgent debate is not possible. I do not know the details of the case my hon. Friend has raised. Nevertheless, I can understand the debate and concern about such issues, so I will inform my colleagues at the Department of Health of his interest in this matter and the fact that he has raised it, and ask them to respond to him.

Business of the House

Andrew Turner Excerpts

Thursday 5th February 2015 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

The hon. Gentleman raises an issue about which Members on both sides of the House will have strong feelings. Victims of such crimes, like Phebe, deserve justice. I know that much ministerial attention has been given to the issue in earlier years, but I do not deny that there is a good case for Parliament to examine the matter. We do not have much time for additional debates, but the hon. Gentleman will be able to raise it with Ministers at questions and with the police and crime commissioner in his area. I will also convey his remarks to Ministers in the Ministry of Justice and the Home Office.

[Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con)]

Many people on the Isle of Wight are dismayed that sailing has been axed from the 2020 Paralympic games in Tokyo. My young constituent, Natasha Lambert, who suffers from cerebral palsy, proves that disabled people can now compete on more than equal terms—she is inspirational. Will the Leader of the House join me in praising Natasha’s considerable achievements and find time for a debate on how that decision can be challenged?

[Mr Hague]

One of the greatest things about our hosting of the Olympic games was the immense success of the Paralympic games. We should be grateful to my hon. Friend for bringing the inspirational achievements of Natasha Lambert to the attention of the House this morning. The decision on what sports are in the programme for each Paralympic games is a matter for the International Paralympic Committee. National governing bodies can make representations, but it is not something for us in Parliament or Government to decide. I will certainly share Natasha’s achievements and her concerns with my colleagues in the Department for Culture, Media and Sport.

Devolution (Implications for England)

Andrew Turner Excerpts

Tuesday 16th December 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

Yes, indeed. As the right hon. Gentleman knows, regional policy has been pushed forward very seriously by the whole approach to city deals, local enterprise partnerships and local growth deals, and parts of the north-east are already benefiting from that. Indeed, there are city deals involving Newcastle and Teesside. So there ought to be greater opportunity for that whoever is in government in the coming years. That opportunity, however, does not resolve the issue of law making, which requires us to address issues in this House.

[Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con)]

I am very grateful to the Leader of the House for the work he is doing to introduce EVEL—English votes for English laws. Will he ensure that the English can vote as quickly as possible, particularly to protect smaller island and rural areas from city deals and metropolitan areas like Manchester and Birmingham?

Business of the House

Andrew Turner Excerpts

Thursday 11th December 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

I think the Ministers responsible might get a little anxious if I made off-the-cuff announcements about changing Government policy on the spur of the moment, so I will resist the hon. Gentleman’s kind invitation to do so. It is open to him—as I have said to other hon. Members, particularly in relation to a Select Committee report—to pursue the case for a debate with the Backbench Business Committee. That is partly what Backbench Business and Westminster Hall debates are for, so I encourage him to pursue the matter in that way.

[Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con)]

Next year, we will have almost reached the 100th anniversary of the murder of 1.5 million Armenians. May we have a debate on that issue?

[Mr Hague]

There is always a good case for a proper understanding of history—I am a great proponent of that—and that requires its discussion. We will be commemorating many events a century on over the next few years through the centennial anniversaries of the first world war, but I cannot offer a debate specifically on the subject that my hon. Friend raises, although I know it evokes strong feelings in this country and many other countries, so he might need to pursue the matter in other ways.

Business of the House

Andrew Turner Excerpts

Thursday 30th October 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

There is a very good case for economic debates. The Chancellor will present the autumn statement in the usual way, but I hope there will be a great deal of scope to discuss economic matters after that. I absolutely agree with my hon. Friend about the importance of the issue of workless households. The number of workless households has gone down by 670,000 since the last general election, and the number of households where no one has ever worked has gone down by 50,000. That is an enormous change in this country that would never have happened under the policies of the Labour party.

[Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con)]

Will my right hon. Friend arrange for the Foreign Secretary to find out whether the UK could benefit from an emergency cap on all migrants from within—and, indeed, without—the European Community, so that in future no more than 100,000 bodies are allowed?