Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill (Eleventh sitting)

Allan Dorans Excerpts

Committee stage
Thursday 10th June 2021 Public Bill Committees

[Alex Cunningham]

That is most certainly the case. We have seen a breakdown in those relationships in recent years, but funding for work in that area has also suffered considerably. The real point of this—I do not think we can say it often enough—is that BAME individuals are less likely to admit guilt and receive an out-of-court disposal. They are more likely to face prosecution; if they face prosecution, they are more likely to end up in prison; and if they end up in prison, they could be there for much longer under some of the legislation that the Government are promoting.

During the evidence sessions, that issue was raised by a series of witnesses as an area of concern. Phil Bowen of the Centre for Justice Innovation said that

“we would strongly argue that it should be possible to offer the community caution—the lower tier of the two tiers—to individuals who accept responsibility for their behaviour, rather than requiring a formal admission of guilt. This is an idea that was raised in the Lammy review and has subsequently been raised in the Sewell report. We think it would be better if that lower tier could be offered to people, who are required only to accept responsibility for their actions. As the Lammy review suggests, that may encourage the participation of people from groups who tend to have less trust in the police and the criminal justice system.”––[Official Report, Police Crime Sentencing and Courts Public Bill Committee, 18 May 2021; c. 44-45, Q63.]

[Allan Dorans (Ayr, Carrick and Cumnock) (SNP)]

Does the hon. Gentleman agree that where the offence is not admitted, it is only right and proper that the matter be referred to a court in the interests of justice?

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There is none the less an important point, which the hon. Member for Enfield, Southgate made in, I think, an intervention on the shadow Minister. He mentioned the issues with BME suspects being reluctant to engage with cautions because they do not trust the system and therefore opting for formal prosecution. I think there is an issue there to do with—I was going to say “education”, but that is patronising. Let me say instead “confidence building”—a better phrase. Clearly, if the alleged perpetrator goes down a prosecution route, it could end up worse for them, because if they get convicted, they could end up with a significantly higher sentence, so we need to work with these communities to explain how the system works and how it might actually serve their interests better to accept the caution, rather than going into a more formal court process, which will take longer and may end up in a significantly higher penalty for them. Of course, the CPS or police may choose to charge them, because they think that the offence may merit it, but we need to ensure that the suspect or the alleged perpetrator properly understands what they are getting themselves into. That is something that I will take up with my hon. Friend the Minister for Crime and Policing.

[Allan Dorans]

Does the Minister agree that the regulatory framework of diversionary and community cautions will prevent many young people from entering the formal criminal justice system—including having their fingerprints and photographs taken—which could affect their life chances and employment chances in later years for a mistake that they made at a very young age; that these measures will be welcomed by the parents who see their children perhaps having a second opportunity to live a crime-free life; and that this will allow rehabilitation within the family and the community?

[Chris Philp]

I do agree. Of course, I know that the hon. Gentleman had a long and distinguished career with, I think, the Metropolitan police.

[Allan Dorans]

It was.

[Chris Philp]

Therefore the hon. Gentleman’s comments are based on that long experience of public service in the police force. It is clearly better if we can get people to stop their offending by way of early intervention such as this, rather than having them end up in a young offenders institution or somewhere similar, which often leads to a pretty bad outcome. We should take this opportunity to stop that pattern of behaviour developing and worsening. That is why these conditions are important —to ensure that that prevention and rehabilitation take place. I fear that otherwise we are missing an opportunity —an opportunity that the shadow Minister is poised to grasp.

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[The Chair]

There we go. Mr Dorans, are you happy with that description of your constituency?

[Allan Dorans]

Yes, Sir.

[The Chair]

Excellent.