Working People’s Finances: Government Policy

Debate between Alison Thewliss and Miriam Cates

Tuesday 21st September 2021 Commons Chamber

[Miriam Cates]

The hon. Lady makes an excellent point. While, overall, on a macro level, having more jobs available for British workers will push wages up, it is of course the case that certain sectors will need specific interventions to save them, and I would support any such measures.

While there are concerns like the one the hon. Lady has raised, and concerns in the wider economy, our plan for jobs is working and the future is optimistic. None the less, there are some long-term structural issues with the cost of living and threats to living standards that must be addressed, and this is the moment to do so. We must find a solution for the sake of future generations.

First, housing affordability is a key driver of problems with the cost of living. Solving the housing crisis will unlock many issues, such as generational inequality, and it will reduce the cost of living. I am delighted that the Secretary of State for Levelling Up, Housing and Communities, my right hon. Friend the Member for Surrey Heath (Michael Gove), has been appointed to look at this specific problem, because it is very important. Many of the serious issues that Members have raised in this House today would be much aided by a reduction in the cost of housing.

Secondly, we also need to look at fairer finance for families. Again, much has been said about the changes to universal credit, but I want to consider what we could do in our taxation system to make life fairer and cheaper for families. Unlike many countries, the UK has an individualistic tax system. We tax individuals rather than households, which means that we do not take into account the number of dependants in a particular house, and that can make life very expensive for families. Some families on low and middle incomes can end up paying around 30% more tax than individuals living on their own. When we couple that with the way that benefits are clawed back as people earn more, some families can effectively face a marginal tax rate of 75%, making it very difficult for them to get out of poverty. We must recognise the importance of raising children not just for the nuclear family, but for our whole society. We need to look at how we can make it less expensive for families to exist and to raise their children.

[Alison Thewliss]

The hon. Member is making an interesting point about support for families. Does she agree that the UK Government’s two-child benefit cap punishes those who have a larger family and puts them in a position where they cannot work their way out of poverty?

[Miriam Cates]

What is far more significant is the way in which we tax individuals—potentially spreading people’s income tax allowance and things like that—rather than looking at household income; that would give families far more choice about how they spend their income and organise their lives, and make family life much more affordable.

Thirdly, we have to address the long-term affordability of our public spending commitments. The welfare state that we have today was designed 80 years ago, when life was very different. Demographics were different then. There was no paid-for childcare or paid-for social care. Most women did not work. There was a huge amount of free care and community living going on that we just do not have, or that there is not nearly as much of, today. Of course, people then also spent a far higher percentage of their life working, whereas now people spend much longer in education and much, much longer in retirement, which means that proportionally, over the course of someone’s life, they are spending far less time paying tax and paying for insurance—paying for the benefits that we all want to enjoy.

The Office for Budget Responsibility forecasts that public sector net debt could rise to 300% of GDP by 2070. We just cannot continue in the way that we are now. We need a reset. We need to redesign our public spending and welfare state for modern life and modern demographics. I think we have already established that we cannot tax our way out of this. Of course, we should be trying to grow our way out of it, but we also need a fundamental redesign of the welfare state and public spending.

We also need much more emphasis on community solutions and prevention. It has been an honour to be part of the early years review of my right hon. Friend the Member for South Northamptonshire (Dame Andrea Leadsom), whose start for life recommendations look at the importance of the first 1,001 days of a child’s life. If we get that period right, we can prevent so many problems that destroy people’s lives in the long term and which are incredibly expensive for public spending. We must spend more and invest in the early years and health prevention. About 40% of the NHS budget is spent on preventable and lifestyle diseases. We have to tackle those things if the state is going to be affordable in the long term. Of course we should innovate, use technology and look at what other countries are doing to address these issues.

We should be concerned about the cost of living. Families up and down the country are struggling, and there are families that are not able to take advantage of opportunities in jobs and higher wages. But this Government have taken action on jobs over the last 18 months, and that is bearing fruit. As our economy is reset, we now have an important opportunity to solve some of the structural issues that we face.

Finance Bill (Seventh sitting)

Debate between Alison Thewliss and Miriam Cates

Committee stage & Committee Debate: 7th sitting: House of Commons
Tuesday 16th June 2020 Public Bill Committees

[Miriam Cates (Penistone and Stocksbridge) (Con)]

I welcome the measure. The Moto-Trek manufacturer in my constituency makes exclusive hand-built motorhomes, so I know that the clause is very much welcomed by the industry. It certainly makes sense to tax motorhomes as vans, since they are mostly built on van chassis and do not do many miles, although they do, of course, emit carbon dioxide. It is right that we incentivise the manufacture of low emission vehicles, but motorhome users are very much committed to UK holidays and do not fly as a result, which is very positive for the environment. As we come out of covid, it is really important that we do everything that we can for UK manufacturers, for UK motorhome vehicle sales and, of course, for tourism. I therefore very much welcome the clause.

Question put and agreed to.

Clause 84 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clause 85

Exemption in respect of medical courier vehicles

[Alison Thewliss]

I beg to move amendment 12, in clause 85, page 72, line 33, after “supplies” insert “, including human breastmilk”.

This amendment would ensure that vehicles carrying human breastmilk would benefit from the exemption from Vehicle Excise Duty.

I am delighted to continue my personal journey to ensure that breastfeeding is mentioned in every possible place in this House. I am chair of the all-party group on infant feeding and inequalities, so I declare that interest up front.

The measure I seek to add to the Bill would cost the Government very little, if anything at all, but would send a very strong signal that the Government support and recognise breast milk banks across the UK. Sub-paragraph 2(b) of proposed new paragraph 6A to schedule 2 to the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 refers to

“medicines and other medical supplies”.

I am not quite sure whether that would capture breast milk. I seek clarification from the Minister on that, because I do not think it is clear enough, which was why I tabled the amendment.

Human breast milk banks exist across the UK. Some do not exist quite to the size and scale that we would like, so the amendment would help to encourage them that there is Government support for what they are doing. I mention the Human Milk Foundation, the Northwest Human Milk Bank, Hearts Milk Bank and Milk Bank Scotland, which is based in Glasgow and the one that I know best. Having spoken to Debbie Barnett, its donor milk bank co-ordinator, I know that Milk Bank Scotland does not have its own vehicles at the moment, but relies on the Glasgow Children’s Hospital Charity volunteers, who transport the milk, after picking it up from donors, and take it out to those who need it. Having its own vehicles would be something for a future point, but the amendment would certainly support the milk bank, and others across the UK, in doing that.

Like blood, breast milk has to be properly processed, and there are procedures in place for doing so. Like blood, it needs special carriage to take it from donors to the milk banks for processing, and back out again. The National Institute for Health and Care Excellence guideline 93 on donor breast milk banks says that, when transporting milk to the milk bank, critical conditions for transport include

“temperature and time limit, to ensure that donor milk remains frozen during transport.”

The guideline also states that donor milk should be transported

“in secure, tamper-evident containers and packaging”

and that a range of procedures are in place for achieving that.

In chapter 33 of its guide to the quality and safety of tissues and cells for human application, on the distribution of and transport conditions for human milk, the European directorate for the quality of medicines states:

“During transport, milk should remain frozen and dry ice may be used for this purpose.

The use of validated, easily cleaned, insulated transport containers is recommended.

The transport procedure should be validated, and the temperature of the transport container monitored during transportation.”

All those measures are relatively similar to how blood and other blood products are transported around the UK, and would fit quite well with the medical courier vehicles exemption set out in the Bill. Many of these organisations are charities, and they would very much appreciate support in moving milk around the country.

I appeal to the Government to accept the amendment, which is uncontentious—and indisputable, really. Doing so would send a good signal that the UK Government support milk banks, the people across the UK who wish to use them, and the science behind them. They are particularly important in supporting premature babies in their earliest days. The World Health Organisation recently indicated the significance of breast milk during coronavirus, and that women should be supported whenever possible to feed their babies with human breast milk. Covid-19 is not present in breast milk, and the milk is therefore of huge benefit in supporting babies in their earliest days. I encourage Ministers to take on the amendment, if they can take on anything at all, and to show support for milk banks across the UK.