COP 29
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath(2 weeks, 6 days ago)
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Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
Oh, my Lords. In 2007, the last Labour Government decided to go back to new nuclear—I was the Minister responsible from 2008 to 2010. We were starting to talk about Hinkley Point C with EDF and about developing a supply chain, and it was not until 2017 that the final investment decision was made. Hinkley Point C had many design changes because it was found that you could not simply take a model from France and put it in Britain without there having to be a lot of changes. However, there were a lot of positives, and it is being built—they are making substantial progress now. The second reactor has been much more efficiently built because they learned from the first reactor. Sizewell C, which will be 3.2 gigawatts, is moving to a final investment decision and will, in essence, be a replica of Hinkley Point C. So, although the noble Lord is right that there has been a lot of delay, I believe we can start to see greater progress. The small modular reactor and advanced modular reactor programmes have great potential for us in this country and for UK companies.
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
My Lords, when it comes to the UK share of the $300 billion, whenever it is paid out to developing countries, which we are all for, can the Minister give some assurances that the money will go to the destinations as directed, and that corruption, which can be prevalent, is taken account of? It may be that the new Government have made a reassessment of that.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, that is a very important point. The integrity of the process is vital in terms of going forward. On our contribution, I think I said earlier that this will have to wait for the multiyear spending review.
Health: Migraines
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath(1 year, 1 month ago)
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Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
The noble Lord makes a very good point. Those who unfortunately suffer from migraine—as we know it comes in different types, stages and forms—can call 111, go to their GP if they can get an appointment quickly or go to their local pharmacy. I hope the noble Lord will find it helpful that the NHS workforce plan, announced recently, includes £2.4 billion funding over the next five years and provides projections for the help needed for dealing with such conditions.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, the noble Lord’s original Question focused on the impact on the workplace. There is a lot of evidence from the Migraine Trust that employers are very unsympathetic to employees suffering from migraine. Does the Minister agree that, if the Government are to take forward a more cohesive strategy, education and working with employers to understand the impact of migraine on many of their employees may well pay dividends?
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
The noble Lord, who has more experience in these matters than me, is quite right. My understanding is that, where an employee suffers from migraine, if the employer does not take it seriously or make certain allowances, this has a great detrimental effect on the employee. The noble Lord will know that the law says someone is disabled if they have a physical or mental impairment that has a
“substantial and long-term adverse effect”
on their
“ability to carry out normal day-to-day activities”,
including work. There is work to be done engaging more with employers to make sure they have that understanding.
Chinese Products and Companies: Human Rights Violations
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
Supply to these markets is obviously important, certainly when talking about the Far East. Looking at that area, although I do not have figures on Taiwan, some crucial goods are imported and exported, and it is therefore important to keep those lines open.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, I know that the noble Viscount says that he has no information about lateral flow tests, but he must surely know that during the public procurement of those tests for the NHS, only 25% passed through all stages of validation, including assessments of performance and quality standards. Surely the Government must be concerned at the poor quality of imports, often from very dubious sources. Is it not the case that his department must be concerned that the UK becomes self-sufficient?
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
I cannot comment on that; it is certainly a point that I am taking extremely seriously, as I said to the noble Baroness, Lady Smith, and the noble Lord, Lord Alton. I will take back the three questions on lateral flow tests, which is clearly an important subject.
Schools: British Sign Language
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Viscount Younger of Leckie
I note the noble Lord’s interest. The Government fully recognise the benefits that a British Sign Language GCSE would bring to the deaf community. I wish I was in a position to give the noble Lord a more definitive timeline. However, as I have said, the process of developing a new GCSE is complex. Typically, it takes at least two years from the start of a reform process to the first teaching of a new GCSE. In this case, it might take longer, as there has not been a GCSE in BSL previously.
Viscount Younger of Leckie
I appreciate the detail that my noble friend has given. I would like to add to it, because there are complexities here. For example, GCSEs in other languages require students to demonstrate the four skills of reading, writing, speaking and listening; in BSL there are only two skills: production and reception. We also need to address the question of whether the GCSE would be aimed at students for whom BSL is their first language or at those learning it from scratch. This will have a significant impact on the level of difficulty at which it is pitched.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
My Lords, there was a time when deaf children were punished for using sign language in schools. We have come a long way since then, but will the noble Lord comment on the outcomes for deaf children in the current educational system? We know that they are not very good at all, and I urge the Government to reflect on that. I welcome the review they are undertaking, but I hope they are prepared to make this decision, which would be a huge boost to many young deaf people.
Viscount Younger of Leckie
The noble Lord is correct in that. Our vision for children with a hearing impairment, or any special educational need, is the same as it is for all children and young people. As the noble Lord will know, schools have to make best endeavours—it is a legal expression—to look after those with special needs; they have a duty to do this. By and large, schools adhere to this, but I am sure that more could be done, and I very much take note of what the noble Lord says.
Northern Ireland: Devolved Government
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Viscount Younger of Leckie
I noted the question asked by the noble Lord. To answer that, as I said, no option is off the table. Of course the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland and the Prime Minister are very aware of the tremendous work that Senator George Mitchell did. That remains on the table and may or may not happen; I cannot give any reassurance at this time on that front.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, will the noble Lord return to the point raised by the noble Lord, Lord Empey, about the real pressure and crisis in the health service in Northern Ireland? Who will take responsibility for sorting this out?
Disabled Students: Allowances
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Viscount Younger of Leckie
The noble Baroness will know that all eligible students can access maintenance loans, and we believe that it is reasonable for any student to purchase a standard computer through that support. However, some universities provide additional help to students from low-income backgrounds, and some DSA equipment providers allow students to spread the cost.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, the Government’s stated aim, which is laudable, is to widen access to our universities. They have taken a measure which has clearly had an impact in reducing the number of disabled students in terms of the reduction of 4,600. Why do they not just reverse the policy?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
The reason is because we believe that it is entirely reasonable to allow the first £200 to be spent by the student. In addition, for non-disabled students, full-time students spent an average of £253 on computers, and part-time students spent an average of £243. So again, it is a reasonable argument to ask for the £200 to be paid.
Part-time Study
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Viscount Younger of Leckie
The Open University is a good example. The noble Lord may know that there is a restructuring exercise going on there, and the Open University is looking to change the way it operates to take account of changing conditions and the reduction in part-time study. That is something that we will be looking at.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, the Minister is being remarkably complacent. He and his colleagues have presided over a devastating reduction in the number of part-time students. That is madness when it comes to the priority to upskill people who have missed out on higher education in the past. The Sutton Trust report makes abundantly clear that the reason for the huge reduction is that the Government got rid of maintenance grants and put the fees up by a huge amount. Incidentally, in his Statement to this House in February, the noble Viscount did not mention part-time students. So instead of a review, why do the Government not reverse that decision and restore maintenance grants?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
My Lords, the important thing is to look at the reasons for the decline, and they are indeed complex. Over the past five years, there have been wider changes to the economy and there was the removal in 2008-09 of the HEFCE teaching grant for equivalent and lower-level qualifications, so there are complex issues here that need to be addressed. I also point out to the noble Lord that the numbers have fallen not only in England. The noble Baroness is right that the number has fallen significantly—actually, I have a figure of 63%—so we understand the seriousness of this, but the number has also fallen in Scotland by 22% and in Wales by 46%.
Public Bodies: Appointments
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
To ask Her Majesty’s Government, following publication of the report of the Commissioner for Public Appointments on appointments to the Board of the Office for Students, what steps they are taking to ensure that future appointments made by ministers to the boards of public bodies are in line with the Governance Code 2016.
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
My Lords, the Governance Code on Public Appointments was introduced in January 2017. Ministers are required to make appointments in accordance with the code as well as the relevant legislation. The Commissioner for Public Appointments provides independent assurance that the governance code is followed. The Government are grateful for the commissioner’s report on the appointments process to the board of the Office for Students. We will consider his recommendations carefully to ensure best practice for future public appointments.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, in addition to his department’s lamentable performance over the appointment of Mr Toby Young, the commissioner’s report identified a number of problems which relate to many public appointments. They include all-male appointment panels, failure to provide information to the commissioner in good time and risking, as he said, the independence of boards by a too-partisan approach to appointments. The Minister referred to the code. What is the point of the code if Ministers such as Jo Johnson can ignore it with impunity? What action will be taken against Mr Johnson for so grievously breaking the code?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
There is no evidence that the Minister broke the ministerial code. In terms of the governance code, there are some failings and the noble Lord will be aware of those. This Government set up the governance code following the independent review by Sir Gerry Grimstone and I am pleased that that is the case. The commissioner himself pointed out that in his experience, this episode is unrepresentative of the hundreds of public appointments that take place each year.
Disabled Students’ Allowance
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Viscount Younger of Leckie
The £200 student contribution towards the cost of a computer is something that all students get. I realise that some evidence and figures show a reduction in the cost. We are looking into that but we are adamant that all students, disabled or not, should receive the £200.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, will the review look at the fact that prospective students have to pay a charge, often amounting to hundreds of pounds, for the second assessment? Given that many of the people we are talking about come from lower-income households, how is that consistent with the Government’s approach to widening access? As I understand it, the review is not looking at the issue of charges. Will the Minister agree to extend it?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
We have made it clear that the review is not considering the issue of who should pay for such a diagnostic assessment. The reason for that is that we want to see the result of this review as to whether the diagnostic assessment should occur post 16 or before that.
Office for Students
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord, but I have to say that the response in no way measures up to the seriousness of the case and the commissioner’s report. The Government only recently told the House that the process to appoint Mr Young was a fair and open competition in accordance with the code of practice, but the commissioner has found that this was not the case. Indeed, it is a damning indictment of the department and of the Minister responsible, Mr Jo Johnson. The department delayed responding to the commissioner, which held up the investigation. The appointments were not conducted in respect of all the candidates on an equal basis, and an all-male appointment panel was used twice. Moreover, can the Minister tell me why it was impossible for the department to check Mr Toby Young’s past social media activity when it was quite easily able to check the social media activity of the candidate found suitable for appointment to the student experience representation role? Why was it not made clear in the advert that Ministers had decided not to appoint someone with close links to the National Union of Students? Will the Minister tell me why being elected by students somehow makes someone unsuitable to represent them?
The commissioner concludes that the code was broken. Can the Minister tell the House whether the Cabinet Secretary is now investigating that breach and other breaches raised by my noble friend Lady Prosser in a recent debate? Further, does the Minister believe that after this level of interference, we can possibly call the Office for Students an independent body? Finally, can the Minister tell me why Mr Jo Johnson, who was responsible for this debacle, has not resigned?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
My Lords, the noble Lord asked a number of questions and I will attempt to answer them. On the question about delay, we understand that this was the first formal investigation under the Government’s code, and formal timelines had not yet been identified for such an investigation. This necessitated liaising with colleagues in the Cabinet Office who led on the Government’s code. Much has been said about the failings in respect of the Toby Young appointment, as the noble Lord put it, and I informed the House of our views on that. As I promised, lessons are being learned and have been learned. The department has set up a nominations committee as a result of the issues that have arisen, so action is being taken within the department to ensure that these problems do not occur again. That action particularly focuses on the due diligence involved. I emphasise that the 40,000 to 50,000 tweets were obnoxious and salacious and must not occur again; the department must improve the due diligence. I assure the noble Lord that the Office for Students is independent, but as he will of course know from the debates on the Higher Education and Research Bill, the ultimate responsibility lies with the Secretary of State.
Higher Education (Access and Participation Plans) (England) Regulations 2018
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Viscount Younger of Leckie
My Lords, I thank all noble Lords for their contributions. I was given prior warning that this debate on the regulations would turn into a broader debate on a number of issues raised during the long passage of the Higher Education and Research Act, and I welcome that. It is good to go over these issues again, and I hope that I can address all the questions asked by noble Lords. If I do not do so or need to get some more specific detailed answers to noble Lords, I will certainly do so and put a copy of the letter in the Library of the House.
I shall address the issues raised in no particular order. The noble Baroness, Lady Wolf, began by asking about the role of the OfS and the link with government. I think she said there was a danger that the Government might be seen to be telling universities what to do. I reassure the noble Baroness that the OfS is an arm’s-length body. The Secretary of State can give guidance or directions to it and, in doing so, they must have regard to the need to protect the institutional autonomy of English higher education providers. HERA sets clear limitations in this context in order to protect academic freedoms and institutional autonomy. For the first time, it also makes explicit that guidance cannot relate to parts of courses, their content, how they are taught or who teaches them, or admissions arrangements for students. The OfS will absolutely be left to do its job as the regulator. I know we had much discussion about this, but I further reassure the noble Baroness that this is the case.
The noble Baroness also raised concerns about specified persons or students. I reassure her that there is no intention to set targets or quotas. To do so would infringe institutional autonomy, one of the hallmarks of our world-class higher education system. The OfS, like the DFA under the 2004 Act, has a duty to protect academic freedom.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
It is all very well saying that this body has institutional autonomy, but it is well known that Ministers put pressure on the chairman to appoint Mr Toby Young. That is not a very good sign of autonomy, is it?
Office for Students: Appointments
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Viscount Younger of Leckie
I say at the outset that this is very much a time of reflection following the resignation this morning. We will want to learn from this. It is regrettable that the offensive tweets were not picked up on or before the appointment. The Prime Minister herself made it clear that a repeat of any such language from someone within a public position would not be acceptable. There is always a balance of proportionality in undertaking due diligence. In this case, there were more than 50,000 tweets, some of which were completely abhorrent. We need to learn from this and be sure that the due diligence is improved.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, with the greatest respect to the noble Viscount, the job specification required candidates to have “good judgement” and “high levels of integrity”; to,
“inspire confidence with a wide range of stakeholders”,
and,
“demonstrate high standards of … personal conduct”.
Is the noble Viscount saying that these objectionable tweets were not known to his department and Mr Jo Johnson? Is it not the case that Jo Johnson imposed this wretched man on the board of the OfS? Will he now tell me, as Jo Johnson has been removed, that the independence of the OfS, which the Government guaranteed during the passage of the Higher Education and Research Act only recently, will now be established?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
My Lords, there is no imposition of a candidate into this particular position. The current make-up of the Office for Students is a broad church. It is a broad range of people, which is what we set out to do in the first place. On the noble Lord’s question: no, we did not know about the obnoxious tweets that came out. That is why I said at the outset that we need to do better. With 50,000 tweets, some of which were completely obnoxious, this is something that we should have known about. We need to learn lessons from this.
Disabled Students’ Allowance
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Viscount Younger of Leckie
Yes, indeed, I am aware of the note that my noble friend Lord Agnew sent. The review will start to take evidence from those invited early in the new year, and we hope that it will report within a few months. I have a little more detail, in that it will consider the evidential requirements for students applying for disabled students’ allowances with specific learning difficulties, and particularly for those with dyslexia.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, with the greatest respect to the Minister, he is relying on the autonomy of the universities and various bits of guidance. However, as the noble Lord, Lord Addington, said, by July barely half of universities actually had a policy in place, so the experience of disabled students will be very variable where they have special requirements. Because the universities are producing such a patchy performance, we need reassurance that there will be some kind of regulatory intervention if they do not get their act together.
Viscount Younger of Leckie
We do not think it is right to go for regulatory action or for legislation. This is not just because there is so much guidance, although there is, but there is also the HEFCE review, which had a 76% response rate. Nearly all respondents have recently carried out a review of support or have plans to do so in the near future. Some providers have made significant progress, particularly in lecture capture and accessibility audits, but the research also highlights the need for sustained investment in infrastructure by these institutions to support disabled students and for a continued and accelerated effort by providers to make the necessary changes. So there is more work to be done.
Student Loans
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
To ask Her Majesty’s Government what is their estimate of the number and percentage of students who will pay back their student loans in full.
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
My Lords, the Government estimate that, following the increase from £21,000 to £25,000 in the repayment threshold that applies to post-2012 student loans, 30% to 35% of borrowers with higher education loans and 40% to 45% of borrowers with advanced learner loans will repay their student loans in full. Of those starting courses in 2016-17, that would equate to 135,000 to 160,000 borrowers with higher education loans and 35,000 to 45,000 borrowers with advanced learner loans fully repaying their loans during their 30-year repayment period.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister. What he said was that the majority of students will never repay their loans in full. We also know that up to 45% of the total loan outlay will never be paid. The poorer students end up with the biggest debt. Last week, the National Audit Office said that two-thirds of students consider that universities do not provide value for money and that proper independent advice is not available to them when they make these decisions, which have such a large financial consequence for them. How can we have confidence in the forthcoming review when the Government resolutely and so determinedly defend the present wretched system? Will the Minister accept that the current system is failing and that we need a new system that is fair to students?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
The noble Lord raises a number of points, but we believe that the student loan system is working well. There is always room for improvement. We believe that students do get good advice before they take on loans; indeed, they have to sign some papers for that.
On some of the noble Lord’s more major points, we are very keen to pursue the value-for-money approach, and Jo Johnson in the other place has made it clear that universities must provide value for money for students. The House knows that the whole graduate student payment system is designed with a deliberate subsidy in place, and we are on track with a complicated formula to achieve that.
Student Loans Company
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
To ask Her Majesty’s Government what steps they are taking to improve the performance of the Student Loans Company, in the light of the dismissal of Steve Lamey, the Chief Executive.
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
My Lords, the performance of the Student Loans Company remains strong, with customer satisfaction rates for applicants currently stable at around 85% and for borrowers in repayment at around 72%. So far in this academic year, the SLC has processed over 1.4 million applications for student funding and has paid out approximately £2.5 billion in maintenance funding and £2 billion in tuition-fee payments to providers. The SLC board acted swiftly to appoint a highly experienced individual as the interim CEO.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, the noble Viscount says that the company’s performance is strong, but it has long had a reputation for poor performance, bureaucracy and overcharging on student loans. The last chief executive, Steve Lamey, was appointed to improve performance, and it looked as though he was doing so. This year he had a performance appraisal in which the chairman commended him for re-energising the business, but two months later he was suspended and was sacked this month. Can the noble Viscount confirm that the reason for his dismissal, as recounted in the Times, was that he publicly informed people about the problems with the company? Will the noble Viscount publish the findings of an internal investigation in which 52 of the 58 allegations against Steve Lamey were dismissed?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
First, the performance of the Student Loans Company has improved year on year for the past six years. I cannot go into the precise details of Steve Lamey’s dismissal; I can only say that his behaviour as a leader and a manager fell below that expected of the position that he held.
Brexit: EU Students
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath(7 years, 2 months ago)
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Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
To ask Her Majesty’s Government how they intend to ensure that the benefits to the United Kingdom arising from European Union students studying at United Kingdom universities will be maintained post-Brexit.
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
My Lords, EU and international students enrich the UK financially and culturally. We will always ensure that our world-class higher education sector can attract students from Europe and elsewhere overseas. To support evidence-based decision-making on the future migration system we have commissioned the independent Migration Advisory Committee to report on the impact of EU and international students. To provide certainty to prospective EU students we have guaranteed that those starting courses in 2018-19 or before will remain eligible for student support.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, it is very difficult to know why the Government have referred this to the advisory committee given that the Minister’s colleague, the Home Office Minister, yesterday admitted that overseas students have negligible impact on the net migration statistics. The Government should just remove them entirely from that statistical return. He has guaranteed EU students up to 2018-19, but what then? It is now that students from other EU countries are considering coming to the UK in a couple of years’ time. We risk losing them to other countries. Will the Minister guarantee home-fee status and access to grants and fee loans for students from the EU from 2019-20 and access to the Erasmus+ programme?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
The Government want to provide certainty to EU citizens living in the UK. We know that the sector cares about its current and prospective EU staff and students living in the UK and we want to reach a reciprocal agreement for EU citizens in Britain and UK nationals in Europe as quickly as possible. That is why we published our policy paper on 26 June to outline our offer for EU citizens and to provide them with the certainty that they need for their future.
Student Finance
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath(7 years, 2 months ago)
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Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for making that Statement. In her speech at the Conservative Party conference, the Prime Minister promised a major review of university funding and student financing, yet details about that review were absent from what the Minister said this afternoon. What are the review’s terms of reference, who will conduct it, what is the timetable, and when will the Government make a Statement to both Houses on it?
Ministers did not say anything either here or in the Commons about the policy on maintenance. Are the Government considering restoring maintenance grants, as they briefed to the media? They have also said that they will publish the revised resource accounting and budgeting charge—the Government’s estimate of the portion of loan that will never be repaid by graduates, which has risen steadily under the jurisdiction of this Government. Have they calculated the impact on the RAB of this latest announcement? If so, why have not they published it with the announcement?
Separately, there is a question about the impact on the department’s own budget in this and future financial years. Will the Government make an additional allocation for the department to cover the costs of the announcement, or does it imply cuts in education spending? Will there be any reduction in funding for universities as a consequence of these changes?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
I thank the noble Lord for his questions. First, as I said, the Prime Minister indicated that there would be a review. Actually, the tuition fee system is kept under constant review, so what she announced was that more detail and information would come out towards the end of the year on what is proposed. However, I cannot go into further detail at present.
The noble Lord also asked about maintenance grants. No, there is no plan to bring back maintenance grants, but he will have to wait until the end of the year to see what further announcements might come, as Jo Johnson said earlier in the Commons.
As the noble Lord will know, the resource and accounting figures come out regularly. I understand that the latest figures will be out soon. They will show that we are on track in effect to write off—as of before the announcement—around 30% of all the loans. This is all part of the complicated funding formula used for the tuition fee system. Of course it should be noted that, with the changes that we have announced, the write-off will go up slightly to between 30% and 40%.
Universities: Vice-Chancellors’ Pay
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath(7 years, 3 months ago)
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Viscount Younger of Leckie
There is a mood in the country, and there has been a lot of interest in the press, about vice-chancellors’ pay. That is an obvious point to make. However, as a result of the work that we did on the Higher Education and Research Bill, particularly in this House, we are empowering the new Office for Students to act to ensure value for money in focusing on senior staff pay. This is happening in a number of ways. We are introducing a new condition of registration, requiring the governing bodies of approved fee cap providers to publish key figures so that in future the number of staff paid more than £100,000 per year will be published, broken down into pay bands of £5,000. Also, the names of staff paid more than £150,000 per year, along with the justification for those salaries, will be produced by the OfS, and I think that that is a good step.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, is the noble Viscount confident that that will be effective? My understanding is that just a handful of current vice-chancellors earn less than the £150,000 threshold that he has referred to. Can he confirm that the Government have had a similar scheme in operation for civil servants, whereby Her Majesty’s Treasury has to give approval to any salary above a £150,000 threshold? The figures published by the Government in December 2016 show hundreds of civil servants earning above the threshold. Can the Minister really be certain that the measures announced will be effective?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
We believe that it is absolutely the right course to take. I say again that universities need to be good stewards of their resources: they need to manage in a responsible manner, there needs to be strong leadership, and it is important that vice-chancellors’ pay is restrained. I understand that the average salary for 2015-16 was £234,000. Of course, the salary depends on the size of the institution and the responsibilities. At the end of the day, what counts is whether the pay is right for the responsibilities of the role and the size of the institution. That is one thing that has to be focused on by providers and universities.
Student Loans: Interest Rates
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath(7 years, 3 months ago)
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Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
To ask Her Majesty’s Government whether they plan to reduce the 6.1% rate of interest to be charged on student loan debt from September 2017; and if so, how.
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
My Lords, student loan interest rates vary with income: 6.1% is the maximum rate, and many students will be charged less than this. Borrowers in repayment who earn under £21,000 pay 3.1%. Borrowers are protected, and repayments are linked to income, not interest rates or the amount borrowed. Our student finance system ensures the costs are split fairly between graduates and the taxpayer, and does this while helping more young people to go into higher education than ever before.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, the noble Viscount failed to mention that the moment a student gets to university, the 6.1% rate applies to them. At the end of three years, it has been estimated that the average interest added, at 6.1%, will be £5,800. Why are the Government determined to put students into even more debt than they are now? Why is RPI being used as the rate of inflation when the Government themselves have rejected RPI when it comes to benefits and pensions? Indeed, it is only students and railway passengers who are penalised by the use of RPI. When will the Government get real and review the rate of interest, as a first stage towards reform of our university fee system?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
My Lords, the details of the scheme continue to be kept under review, but the student loan system is working well. The Government’s reforms to the undergraduate student finance system have ensured that it is financially sustainable for the taxpayer in the long term, while enabling those with the talent to benefit from a higher education to do so. Young people from the poorest areas are 43% more likely to go to university than they were in 2009-10. This is a very good step in the right direction.
Employment: Zero-hour Contracts
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath(11 years, 1 month ago)
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Viscount Younger of Leckie
I believe that I have already given that reassurance and some examples to the House.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)
My Lords, perhaps we can come back to the issue raised about care workers. It is widely reported that thousands of care workers are employed under zero-based contracts—often, as my noble friend Lord Christopher said, delivering care visits of no more than 15 minutes while not being paid for transport or time costs between visits to different care settings. Much of that arises from the commissioning policies of local authorities. Is the Minister as surprised as I was that two days ago, the Government tabled an amendment to the Care Bill which stopped the Care Quality Commission from investigating the commissioning duties of local authorities in relation to care homes?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
There is opaqueness between the zero-hours contracts and the payment of travel time relating to care workers. The noble Lord brings up an important point. I have already said how much importance we attach to the care sector. As the noble Lord will know, the payment for time spent on travelling is complex. I do not wish to go into the Care Bill at this stage.
Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Bill
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
Viscount Younger of Leckie
My Lords, this has been an interesting and lively debate. I am very grateful to all noble Lords for their contributions.
I turn to some of the points raised by noble Lords during this debate. First, the noble Lord, Lord Whitty, raised the issue of the impact assessment, and the noble Lord, Lord Curry, referred to this as well. The noble Lord, Lord Whitty, pointed out that the Government’s best estimate is a cost to the rural workers of £236 million over the next decade. Abolishing the Agricultural Wages Board would bring agriculture into line with all other sectors in the economy. Allowing farmers to compete fairly in the labour market and allowing agricultural wages to follow market levels will enhance the competitiveness of the sector and may increase employment. This would in turn encourage long-term prosperity in rural areas.
The impact assessment itself gives a range of impacts and makes it clear that there is considerable uncertainty, with a potential £238 million impact for workers being at the upper end of the range. The impact assessment also makes clear that there may be, in fact, no reduction in wages or worker benefits. I would like to give a little more information than was asked for in terms of how we arrived at these figures. I stress that the figures are the upper estimate, based on empirical research comparing wages in fisheries and the agricultural sector over an 11-year period up to 2010. The figures are based on two particular issues. First they are based on existing workers. With the abolition of the Agricultural Wages Board, one assumes that existing workers on contracts would not receive a pay rise over 10 years. Therefore there would be a definition of wage slippage, allowing for inflation. Secondly, it allows for new workers who may be taken on at the national minimum wage rate, not the old agricultural wages rate, if the Agricultural Wages Board was abolished. So it assumes the very worst scenario, with no increase at all on what there was before, and it assumes, in effect, that farmers would be sitting on their hands. I would argue that this would be highly unrealistic.
As I mentioned earlier, the reality on wages will depend on demand, and evidence shows that demand is increasing. Farmers will want to be more flexible and will be able to be more flexible with the abolition of the Agricultural Wages Board.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
What impact has the Minister’s department assessed there will be as a result of supermarkets forcing down costs on farmers, and what will be the impact of that on wages?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
I am glad that the noble Lord has brought up this point because I was about to move on to the issue of supermarkets which was raised by the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Hereford and, indeed, by the noble Lord, Lord Whitty. From our perspective, we do not have any evidence at all that supermarkets—some names were mentioned by the noble Lord, Lord Whitty—would put pressure on farm workers’ wages.
Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Bill
Debate between Viscount Younger of Leckie and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath(11 years, 11 months ago)
Grand CommitteeRead Full debate Read Hansard Text
Viscount Younger of Leckie
I have to say that it was news to me—I have heard it today for the first time—that there was one week’s consultation. It is my clear indication that it was not one week. It was a lot longer than that. I do hope that it was at least four weeks, but I will certainly get back to the noble Lord to clarify this, as it is important.
The noble Lord, Lord Whitty, in expressing concerns about the consultation responses, also stated that he wanted clarification. On the question of where the consultation responses are, all the responses are publicly available in the Defra library. Moreover, Defra officials specifically alerted the former Unite leader to the availability of the responses.
On the content of the responses, it is worth pointing out to noble Lords that there were 939 respondees, of which 345—37%—agreed with the proposal to abolish the Agricultural Wages Board; some 575—61%—were against, and 2% were “don’t knows”. The main point I want to make is that of the 575 against, 242 came from the same website.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
With the greatest respect, I imagine that some of those people represented about 157,000 workers, so it seems to me that that is not at all unreasonable.
Viscount Younger of Leckie
If the noble Lord prefers, I can get back to him—I will, indeed, get back to him—with more details concerning this response. I was purely expressing some facts concerning the response.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
With respect, it is not unusual for organisations to send notes to their members detailing changes that are going to be made and their implications. The noble Viscount seems to be saying that because these figures came through websites—I think he mentioned five websites—somehow they should be discounted. Surely that cannot be right. Is the Government’s new approach to consultation to make judgments about who they are going to listen to and to discount those responses that they do not like?
Viscount Younger of Leckie
With respect to the noble Lord, I did not say that I was discounting them. I was just producing some facts. However, it is strange that such a high number of responses came from the same website. I hope that that is a reasonable view to express. As I say, I shall be delighted to get back to the noble Lord with some clear figures and a response to that.
The noble Baroness, Lady Donaghy, raised the question of whether Northern Ireland or Scotland had been asked for a view on the abolition of the Agricultural Wages Board. I should clarify that the Agricultural Wages Board in Northern Ireland and the Agricultural Wages Board in Scotland constitute separate bodies and it is for their respective devolved Governments to take a view on their future.
The noble Lord, Lord Whitty, asked about the terms and conditions of farmers and their pay and sick pay under the current regime. Having two systems which may apply on the same site for the same organisation is not ideal. This measure obviously covers agricultural workers and will cover others who fall into the non-agricultural sector. Surely it is more confusing and difficult to operate such a system. As I said in my opening speech, farm businesses are increasingly diverse and carry out non-agricultural activities.
The noble Baroness, Lady Donaghy, asked why there was a difference between the first and second impact assessments. The first impact assessment was informed by independent research which compared the agricultural sector with the forestry and fisheries sector in order to assess the effect of the Agricultural Wages Board minimum wages. However, this did not allow for the fact that forestry is covered by an agricultural wages order. Since the consultation, the contractors have revised the analysis to correct this.