EU Justice and Home Affairs Measures

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Chris Heaton-Harris

Wednesday 19th November 2014 Commons Chamber

[Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con)]

Is the Home Secretary surprised, as I am, that the shadow Home Secretary’s speech was all about procedure, not the policy area? She did not mention the fact that one major concern of a number of us on the Government Benches is that we are ceding powers to the European Court of Justice for the first time, and therefore taking away some parliamentary supremacy. I would like to hear the Home Secretary’s views on that.

[Mrs May]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right and I am well aware that for a number of right hon. and hon. Friends the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice is key. I have been clear—as I was in previous debates—that the issue of our relationship with the European Court of Justice should be in the work that we will do as a Conservative Government after next May’s election to renegotiate our relationship with the European Union. That, of course, is not in the motion tabled by the right hon. Member for Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford (Yvette Cooper) today, and there is no reference to it or to the overall opt-out issue.

I think I am right in quoting the right hon. Lady as saying that the opt-out was an opt-in, opt-out “hokey cokey”. I remind her that that opt-in, opt-out hokey cokey was negotiated by the previous Labour Government. I am not sure from her comments whether she now supports our decision to exercise the opt-out, which, as I have said, the Labour Government negotiated, voted against last year, and have never said whether or not they would use. Is she congratulating the Government on successful negotiations in Europe and bringing back a deal that is good for the UK? Does support for our package mean that she supports the return of around 100 powers from Brussels and the largest repatriation of powers since this country joined the EU?

I am pleased that today’s motion supports all 35 measures, because last time the Opposition called a debate on this matter in June last year they highlighted only seven measures that they wanted us to rejoin. The list did not include Eurojust, which the right hon. Lady has now said that she supports, or the prisoner transfer framework decision, which allows us to send foreign criminals home to serve their sentences. It also left off the asset recovery office, which allows law enforcement to pursue the criminal proceeds of crime.

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[Mrs May]

We have not yet notified the European Union. [Interruption.] Someone says, “Why?” It is partly because the timetable has not required us to notify the European Union by that point.

Thirdly, under the convention, we would return to a system where 22 other member states would not extradite their own nationals to the UK and where, owing to constitutional bars, there would be no hope of that situation changing for some countries. In the last five years alone, those 22 states have extradited 105 of their own nationals to us to stand trial. That would end if we returned to the 1957 convention, and victims, and their families, would suffer as a result.

The convention would also mean that, if there is a long delay between the offence occurring and the extradition request being made, extradition can be refused because of the length of time that has passed under a state’s statute of limitations.

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

Will the Home Secretary give way?

[Mrs May]

May I first give a concrete example of that? Last month, Philip Gordon Knowles was jailed for eight years after being found guilty of four counts of gross indecency with a boy under the age of 14 and eight counts of indecent assault on a girl under the age of 16 in the St Helens area in the 1970s. His conviction followed his extradition from Spain using the arrest warrant. In an earlier age, Knowles would have escaped justice. Under the 1957 European convention on extradition, the length of time that had passed between his offences and his extradition being requested would have rendered him immune to prosecution by the Spanish authorities, and he could not have been extradited. It is thanks to the arrest warrant that Knowles is now behind bars.

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[Chris Heaton-Harris]

I thank the Home Secretary for giving way to me a second time. She has made two cases—the reason for opting in and what would happen if we went back to the 1957 protocols—but there were other choices. A couple of years ago, there was the chance to try to have a bilateral treaty with the EU, or indeed individual member states within it. Equally, as the treaties stand, there are transitional arrangements under which the current arrangements could continue. Could she comment on those? I know that the commonly held view in her Department was that the transitional arrangements would be quite short, but I have gathered from the European Commission that they could go on for quite some time. I would appreciate her view on that.

[Mrs May]

My hon. Friend has raised two important points. I will address both of them. He refers to the temporary transitional extension. The option that is proposed to extend that transitional period for a significant time would require secondary legislation to override the primary treaty right of the UK to opt out of measures and would effectively override the opt-out itself. That is a precedent that no one would want to set. A transitional decision is proposed by the European Commission. We have no vote on its adoption. We would have no power to amend the drafting of the decision and it could extend to all 135 measures and make them subject to ECJ jurisdiction to boot. That would effectively hand over our power on this matter to Brussels, which would determine it for us. I think that that would run entirely counter to our aim of bringing powers back from Brussels.

The other point is that it has been clear in discussions we have been having with the European Commission that the purpose of the transition arrangement was, for a very limited period, potentially to ensure that while the process of opting in was taking place there was no operational gap, so that we would make sure there was no point at which it was possible for somebody to claim that an arrest warrant, for example, was no longer operational as a result of the decisions we had taken.

In relation to the suggestion that we could have negotiated a separate treaty with the European Commission, reference is often made to the Danish position on that, but in fact that is different as the Danes have no alternative option for participating in the JHA measures. Protocol 36, the opting-out decision protocol, sets out our ability to opt out and to rejoin these JHA measures, so it puts us in a different position. The EC argues that that provides us with an adequate ability to go into these measures, and therefore renders a third-country agreement unnecessary.

Given my hon. Friend’s interest in European Court of Justice jurisdiction, the other point I would make is that in all the measures Denmark has negotiated separate arrangements on with the EC, it has been required to submit itself to the jurisdiction of the ECJ. That has been the price of getting the negotiated agreement with the European Commission, so I really do not think it is an option that resolves the issues my hon. Friend and others have concerns about.

Child Sex Abuse (Rotherham)

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Chris Heaton-Harris

Tuesday 2nd September 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

We would all agree about the importance of sharing information appropriately among the various agencies to pick up any children who are vulnerable or might be sexually exploited so that the relevant people are aware of that information and therefore take action.

[Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con)]

Given the activity—or, indeed, the lack of activity—of Shaun Wright, the police and crime commissioner for South Yorkshire, does the Home Secretary believe that there is now a reason to introduce a system of recall for PCCs?

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Chris Heaton-Harris

Monday 7th July 2014 Commons Chamber

[Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con)]

12. What assessment she has made of the effect of serious and organised crime on communities.

[The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)]

Serious and organised crime has a damaging and corrosive impact on communities across the United Kingdom. This includes violence, drugs trafficking, fraud, modern slavery and child sexual exploitation. Reducing the effects of these crimes and bringing the perpetrators to justice is why I launched a comprehensive new strategy and a powerful new crime-fighting organisation, the National Crime Agency, in October 2013.

[Mrs May]

I thank my hon. Friend for his question. Protecting communities lies at the heart of how we want to deal with serious and organised crime. We work with a range of partners to ensure that we tailor our response to the needs of individual communities such as Brierfield. We are also ensuring that every possible avenue is taken to deal with serious and organised crime. Lancashire police’s Operation Genga is bringing together about 20 local organisations to address the issue, and it is a very good example of the benefits that can be achieved through such a partnership approach.

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

What actions is my right hon. Friend taking to seize more of the proceeds of organised crime?

[Mrs May]

My hon. Friend touches on an important issue. Criminals pursue criminal activities for profit, and by seizing their assets we can have a significant impact on them. We have set out in the serious and organised crime strategy our approach for attacking criminal finances. We want to make it harder for criminals to move, hide or access the proceeds of crime. The criminal finances board, overseen by the Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department, my hon. Friend the Member for Staffordshire Moorlands (Karen Bradley), oversees cross-departmental work to improve performance on accessing and recovering assets. We are also taking extra powers in the Serious Crime Bill, which has already started its passage in another place, to make it easier for us to get hold of criminals’ assets.

Romanian and Bulgarian Accession

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Chris Heaton-Harris

Wednesday 27th November 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

It behoves all of us to speak on this important issue in a measured and sensible way. This is a matter of grave concern, and the people who are going round making exaggerated claims of that nature do a disservice to all of us, especially those of us in the Government who are taking measures that will have an impact on the people coming here and measures to reduce the pull factors. We are also taking wider measures in the Immigration Bill to ensure that people who come here cannot use our public services without contributing to them.

[Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con)]

I welcome the statement. I happily voted for the Immigration Bill, and the Opposition would have more credibility on this issue had they done so as well. Has the Home Secretary sought and received any guidance from her Department on extending the transitional arrangements, on how long the infraction procedure would take and on the likelihood and amount of any fines?

[Mrs May]

I thank my hon. Friend for reminding us of the Opposition’s failure to support the provisions in the Immigration Bill. Had they given that support, the shadow Secretary of State’s contribution today might have had a little more credibility. Given my hon. Friend’s background, he will know the legal position on the accession treaty. As I have said, the Government are taking every step they can and looking at all the issues in dealing with this matter.

Treaty on the Functioning of the EU

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Chris Heaton-Harris

Tuesday 9th July 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

The hon. Lady is absolutely right to refer to the excellent working relationship between the Garda and the PSNI, which has resulted in many benefits over recent months and years. There is absolutely no reason why the Government’s decision on the 2014 opt-out should do anything to damage that relationship. Indeed, I am sure that the decision that we wish to rejoin the European arrest warrant will be welcomed.

[Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con)]

I welcome the Home Secretary’s statement. I have been lobbying very hard for the block opt-out to be enacted, but does she understand the concerns of some of us on the Back Benches about the activist nature of the European Court of Justice? We have only to consider the Metock case in Ireland, which led to that member state having to change its immigration rules domestically, to understand why there is such concern. I look forward to taking part in the debate.

[Mrs May]

I thank my hon. Friend, who is absolutely right, and I recognise the concerns that he and other Members have raised about the European Court of Justice. Of course, it is not just another member state that has to abide by the implications of the Metock judgment; we all have to abide by them. There has been an increase in sham marriages following that judgment—it related to the rights of those married to EU nationals—and we now have to deal with that issue. One of the reasons we have considered these measures very carefully is the question of the operation of the European Court of Justice. As I have said, however, the measures that we wish to rejoin are those that will be of benefit and I believe that they are in our national interest.

Family Migration

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Chris Heaton-Harris

Monday 11th June 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

If the hon. Gentleman were to look back at the speeches and comments I have made on immigration over the past two years, he would see that I frequently say that immigration has been a positive benefit to this country. But what I think is not good for this country is uncontrolled immigration. That is why this Government are bringing some control into our immigration system. We made it clear two years ago that we would look at every aspect of immigration, and we have done so. We continue to look at issues associated with immigration, and it is absolutely right that we set out clearly what we believe are the parameters within which it is right for someone to be able to bring a spouse or partner here to the UK.

[Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con)]

I congratulate the Secretary of State on making one of the most important announcements of this Session in this House today. It is so important that I am here to ask a question about it instead of watching England against France. [Interruption.] I am doing my bit. There is a distinct lack of public confidence in our immigration system. Is not the best way to tackle that by introducing these sorts of measures, which strengthen public confidence as a result of strong, robust immigration measures?

Abu Qatada

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Chris Heaton-Harris

Thursday 19th April 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

The hon. Gentleman is wrong. It is a simple question of mathematics, as I have made absolutely clear.

[Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con)]

Does my right hon. Friend accept that there is a great deal of legal debate as to whether an injunction based on a rule 39 action is enforceable? What is the worst thing that could happen if we ignored this injunction?

[Mrs May]

I dealt with this issue in answer to questions raised with me on Tuesday. Of course, I believe that the Government should operate within the rule of law. A rule 39 injunction has, indeed, been placed on the deportation of Abu Qatada, as it was during the period following the judgment of 17 January. As I am sure my hon. Friend will be aware, if the Government were to take action to break that injunction, not only would that be contrary to that legal judgment made by the European Court, but the first step would be to ask for an injunction here in the UK courts. If the Government were to act against that injunction, not only Ministers, but anybody involved, would be acting illegally, and I do not think that is right.

UK Border Agency

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Chris Heaton-Harris

Monday 20th February 2012 Commons Chamber

[Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con)]

Does the Home Secretary agree that because the previous Labour Government were so uninterested in protecting our borders, they allowed the bizarre culture of ignoring ministerial direction to embed itself at the head of the UKBA? Will she assure the House that that culture will not be allowed to continue following this Government’s measures and the Vine report?

[Mrs May]

The precise reason for separating the UK Border Force from UKBA is to give the UK Border Force a much clearer focus on its key job of maintaining security and conducting controls at our borders. However, I am bound to comment to my hon. Friend that, as he knows well, this Government have a proper immigration policy and are doing our best to control it.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Chris Heaton-Harris

Monday 12th December 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

I thank my hon. Friend for his reference to the work previously done by the Home Affairs Committee on this important issue. The Government are looking across the board at sources of proposals for dealing with this problem. As I have said, our cross-Government action plan included 12 Departments and made a significant number of commitments to ensure that we do what all in the House would want: end violence against women and girls.

[Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con)]

2. What her policy is on the designation of (a) target sports clubs where historical pistols are studied and shot and (b) other target sports clubs.