European Council

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 25th March 2019 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

First, I do not accept the entire description that my right hon. and learned Friend set out. I say to him that, during the whole process of negotiation, there has been compromise. He was a respected and long-standing member of previous Governments. If he were standing at the Dispatch Box, prior to the possibility of indicative votes—and we will have to see; the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster will give a further explanation of the Government’s position later this afternoon, but if the amendment tabled by my right hon. Friend the Member for West Dorset (Sir Oliver Letwin) passes, those indicative votes will take place—I do not think he would give a blank cheque. I think he is indicating his assent to what I am saying.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister has said once again that the European Union is not going to, under any circumstances, look again at the withdrawal agreement, so I agree with her that indicative votes are a nonsense, because, in the end, they are talking about the future relationship and not the withdrawal agreement. Why will she not start to prepare properly for what I do not call a “no deal”? It is not a no deal; it is a different type of deal that would take us out. [Interruption.] It is a World Trade Organisation deal. Why will she not continue to prepare for that, and to ensure that, in the end, what really matters is the people’s vote, not what this Parliament says?

[The Prime Minister]

I think and hope I have expressed my belief that we should be delivering on the result of the 2016 referendum. We continue to prepare for no deal. Those preparations are being continued.

European Union (Withdrawal) Act

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Tuesday 12th March 2019 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I will give way in a few moments. I will just make a little more progress.

The second element, the statement in relation to the political declaration, sets out a number of commitments to enhance and speed up the process of negotiating and bringing into force the future relationship. There is a new commitment that the negotiating track on alternative arrangements will consider not only existing facilitations and technologies, but also those emerging.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

I thank the Prime Minister for giving way on that point. She said earlier that she thought there had been a change in attitude on looking at different ways to deal with the Northern Ireland-Irish border. Does she agree with me that if the Irish Taoiseach did what the previous Irish Taoiseach did, which was to allow the civil servants to meet with our civil servants, and there really was good will and intention, the Taoiseach would now say that their civil servants should start that process now and not wait until we have gone much further along the line?

[The Prime Minister]

We are happy at any stage to sit down with the Irish Government and talk to them about the arrangements that could be in place in relation to the Northern Ireland border with Ireland.

Leaving the EU

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Tuesday 12th February 2019 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I thank my right hon. Friend for holding his nerve. May I reassure him that, obviously, what we are doing in negotiating this deal is ensuring that we deliver on the referendum? We will be leaving the European Union, but its countries are our closest neighbours and it remains in the interests of this country, and the European Union, for there to be a close relationship between the UK and the EU in future. We have set out proposals for that future close relationship and, obviously, the second stage of negotiations will be putting that relationship into legal text.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister was quite right to rule out again staying in a customs union, which was not on the manifesto of either of the two main parties. [Interruption.] The customs union. Does she think that we might perhaps change the wording in talking about no deal? If we cannot get an agreement, then surely we can go over to the WTO and use article 24. It is not crashing out. People voted to leave; they did not vote for a deal as such. They voted to leave, and we need to leave on 29 March.

[The Prime Minister]

Obviously, the hon. Lady and a number of Members in this House have raised the issue of World Trade Organisation arrangements. Of course, there are many parts of the world that we currently trade with—not just with the European Union—on what are EU terms of trade rather than WTO terms. I continue to believe that the best route for this country is to leave with a deal, which is why we are working so hard to get the changes that this Parliament requested.

Leaving the European Union

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 21st January 2019 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I thank my right hon. Friend for his question. I think that a number of people are surprised at the unwillingness of the Leader of the Opposition to meet me, as the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, when he has met other groups who do not have the national interest of this country at heart. As my right hon. Friend says, I am absolutely working to deliver on the instruction of this Parliament to leave the European Union on 29 March.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

I welcome the Prime Minister ruling out a second referendum, ruling out revoking article 50 and leaving on the table a WTO deal, whether managed or not. However, this is a remain Parliament—the majority of Members of this Parliament voted to remain. Does she agree that one way to show we are honouring what the people said is to speed up the progress of statutory instruments and legislation that need to get through this Parliament, so that we can get out on 29 March?

[The Prime Minister]

We have been laying statutory instruments. Getting statutory instruments through the House requires the usual channels to work together, and I am sure that those on the Labour Front Bench have heard the hon. Lady’s interest in ensuring that those statutory instruments are able to get through the House.

Leaving the EU

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 14th January 2019 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I know that a number of Members were concerned about the phraseology in the political declaration around the future relationship in relation to customs and about building on the protocol and the assumption that therefore what was in the protocol would effectively have to be taken forward into that future relationship. In fact, the letters we have received today from the EU make it clear that that is not the case. My right hon. Friend asks why I believe this is a good deal. I believe it is a good deal because, as I have said previously, it delivers on the vote of the referendum—control of money, borders and laws; out of the common fisheries policy and common agricultural policy; the ability to have an independent trade policy—and enables us to do so in a way that protects jobs and security and gives certainty to businesses.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

I genuinely respect the Prime Minister’s willingness to come back time after time to talk to Parliament and the public about her deal, even if today she has not really brought back anything very different—if we are honest. Will she state very clearly that this Parliament voted to give the people the opportunity to decide whether to leave or not to leave, not this Parliament, and will she therefore state categorically that, whatever happens tomorrow night and in the next few weeks, we will be leaving on 29 March, because that is what the people voted for?

[The Prime Minister]

We will be leaving the EU on 29 March. I believe it is important that Parliament delivers on the vote that people took in 2016. As I just said in response to the hon. Member for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman), Parliament voted to trigger article 50 with the two-year timeframe it contained. For the sake of our democracy, it is important that we deliver on the Brexit vote in 2016.

European Council

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 17th December 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

There have already been fortnightly meetings taking place, and that will move to a more regular rhythm in January as we continue to step up the preparations for no deal.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

May I welcome the Prime Minister ruling out a second referendum when we have not actually implemented the first, and may I also congratulate her—she did not get her hair ruffled by President Juncker in the way he seems to do to everybody? However, has she had a word with the Chancellor of the Exchequer? He implied the people who voted leave—17.4 million people—were extremists. Has she had a word with him to make sure that he is not going to take that attitude to decent people across the country?

[The Prime Minister]

Everybody in this Government recognises that this Parliament gave people the decision on whether or not to leave. People went out and 17.4 million people chose that we should leave the European Union. They did so for a variety of reasons—ending free movement was a reason for many of them, but for many of them a reason was also the concept of wanting a United Kingdom able to stand independent in the world, to make those trade deals around the rest of the world, but to be free of the bureaucracy of Brussels; that was another reason people voted to leave. They did that with their hearts and with their heads and with the best of intentions, and it is our job to deliver on the vote they gave.

Exiting the European Union

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 10th December 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

My right hon. Friend is absolutely right. The only way to ensure that there is no deal is to have a deal. The deal on the table is a good deal for the UK, and we will be leaving on 29 March next year.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister has said that she is going back for more reassurances on the backstop. Does she accept that those reassurances, no matter how strong, will not be legal? Does she not think that she would be better able to negotiate if the EU knew that this House had overwhelmingly voted against the deal?

[The Prime Minister]

I think the fact that I have indicated that it is necessary to go back has sent a clear message to the European Union about the importance of engaging on this particular issue and ensuring that there is the level of assurance that is required by Members of this House that is sufficient for Members of this House to believe that they can have the confidence that the backstop is not indefinite. It is that indefinite—potentially indefinite—nature of the backstop, should it come into place, that has been raising concerns for all Members of this House, and I believe that it is that that we should be addressing particularly.

Leaving the EU

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 26th November 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

The position on the nature of the political declaration is exactly what I set out in response to the question from the Chairman of the Exiting the European Union Committee, which is that it is not possible for us to sign that legal treaty on a free trade agreement with the European Union until we are outside the European Union.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister was told very clearly last November that any backstop would not be tenable and would not be acceptable, yet she has carried on with allowing it to be put in. But not only is it in; it is in in a way that we cannot get out of unless the EU allows us to do so. Does the Prime Minister agree that that is not really giving back sovereignty to our country—to the people who voted to leave?

[The Prime Minister]

As I said in my statement, the position is very simple: there is no withdrawal agreement without a backstop. Without a backstop there is no deal. That is because of the commitment that both sides wanted to give to the people of Northern Ireland to ensure there was no hard border between Northern Ireland and Ireland. That is very simple; any other arrangement—any other agreement on trade with the European Union—would have a backstop.

Progress on EU Negotiations

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Thursday 22nd November 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I thank my hon. Friend for bringing his constituent’s views to the House today. I think that, when every Member of this House looks at the meaningful vote, they will have to ask themselves precisely the question that that constituent has asked—does this deliver on the vote, and does it do it in a way that is good for the United Kingdom? I think the answer is unequivocally yes.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister seems to imply in paragraph 27 that the new facilitative arrangements and technologies to prevent a hard border are new. They have been around for some time, and customs officials—all sorts of people—have written about this. The fact is that the Prime Minister’s team have not looked at this seriously until very recently. Even at this late stage, could I say to the Prime Minister that the backstop has no need to be in a legal agreement, and that it should be taken out and we should get on with getting the kind of changes that would make a hard border impossible?

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Lady is right that of course there have been ideas around for some time in relation to the way in which customs and the treatment of customs is developing with today’s technology, but there are further technological solutions that I think will be available. On the question of no hard border, we have a commitment to no hard border, but I believe it is important that we also try to work to ensure that businesses and people in Northern Ireland are able to carry on their business and their daily life much as they do today. This is about no hard border but it is also about our overall commitment to the people of Northern Ireland.

EU Exit Negotiations

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Thursday 15th November 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

There are, indeed, clauses that link the withdrawal agreement to the future relationship. The legal term “best endeavours” is used in a number of places in relation to this matter to ensure that that future relationship is in place. Obviously, as I said earlier, we are still to negotiate further details in relation to that future relationship, and it is the determination of both sides, as expressed in these documents, that that future relationship should be capable of being put into place at the end of the transition period.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister made a very dignified statement in difficult circumstances, but does she realise that when people outside this House read these hundreds of pages of Eurospeak, they will realise that, in a way, we are being sold out? We have been sold out by our negotiators, who have allowed the EU to take the lead. Will she not accept that at this stage not only are we all being collectively sold out, but the people of Northern Ireland are being sold out absolutely?

[The Prime Minister]

I do not agree with the hon. Lady in relation to the suggestion that in some sense the European Commission and the European Union have given nothing away to the UK during these negotiations. These have been tough negotiations; this is a complex matter. For example, as I referred to in my statement, the EU has been clear for some time that the choice we had in our future relationship was a binary one between the Norway model or the Canada model, but it has now accepted that that is not the case and there is a bespoke agreement for the United Kingdom. They said we could not share security capabilities, but, as is clear in the outline political declaration, we do have access to certain security capabilities. They said we could not preserve the invisible border between Northern Ireland and Ireland without splitting the UK’s customs territories—that is now no longer the case. These are all issues that our negotiators have negotiated in the interests of the United Kingdom.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Wednesday 14th November 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I can reassure my hon. Friend that we will become an independent coastal state, and it will be the UK negotiating on the UK’s behalf in terms of access to UK waters.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister will know that, back in 1965, there was a neighbourhood agreement between Northern Ireland and the Republic that each could fish in the other’s six-mile waters. Two years ago, the Irish Republic reneged on that. We, of course, taking the moral high ground, did not renege, so now all the Irish fishermen can come into Northern Ireland waters, but Northern Ireland fishermen cannot go into Republic waters. Will the Prime Minister try to speak up sometimes for Northern Ireland fishermen and not feel that she always has to support the Irish Government?

[The Prime Minister]

Consistently throughout these negotiations one of the issues that I have had at the forefront of my thinking has been the people of Northern Ireland. The hon. Lady raises a specific issue about fishing, and I am happy to look at the specific issue of the six-mile waters. We will become an independent coastal state, as I have just said in response to my hon. Friend the Member for Cleethorpes (Martin Vickers). We will ensure that it is the United Kingdom that is negotiating on behalf of the UK for access to UK fishing waters, but the people of Northern Ireland are at the forefront of our concerns in relation to the deal that we are negotiating.

October EU Council

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 22nd October 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

Obviously, my right hon. Friend, as a former Trade Minister—a position he held with distinction—understands these issues and their intricacies. Of course, in a customs union, trade policy—with all the issues like trade remedies and trade sanctions—will be a matter for the European Union and not the UK. I believe that we should be making those decisions for ourselves here in the UK.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

Does the Prime Minister agree with me and many, many people in Northern Ireland about the remarks of Taoiseach Varadkar at a dinner—at which I understand the Prime Minister was not present—when showing photographs of a terrible atrocity on the border and implying that that was somehow what would happen if there was a hard border? The EU does not want a hard border and will not put one up. We will not put one up. The Republic of Ireland will not be putting one up. Who is going to put this hard border up?

[The Prime Minister]

We are obviously committed to no hard border, and we have made it clear that in any circumstances, including in a no-deal situation, we would be doing all that we could to ensure that there was no hard border. We would look to work with Ireland and the European Union to ensure that there was no hard border, but there has been no commitment in relation to that.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Wednesday 4th July 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I am happy to join my hon. Friend in recognising the vital role that small businesses play in our economy and, indeed, in our local communities. They provide valuable services, products and jobs for local people, and we should never fail to recognise the great work that they do. Government’s role is to ensure that there is a strong economy in which those businesses can thrive, and that is exactly what the Conservative Government are doing.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

Q12. The Prime Minister will know that later this month Zimbabwe will have its first election since Mugabe was ousted by a military coup. The hon. Member for Bournemouth West (Conor Burns) and I have recently returned from Zimbabwe, and we heard from Zimbabweans concerns that that will not be a genuinely free and fair election. The constitution is not being adhered to, and the main opposition do not have a chance to reach the state media. Will the Prime Minister give an assurance that our Government will not rush to agree that this is a free and fair election until we have seen that it really means change, not just for the election?

[The Prime Minister]

I commend the excellent work that the hon. Lady continues to do as chair of the all-party parliamentary group on Zimbabwe. We obviously welcome the announcement of the date of the election on 30 July, but we urge all parties involved to pursue free, fair and peaceful elections, because that is absolutely what the Zimbabwean people deserve. We will certainly watch very carefully to see how those elections are conducted, and consider the conduct of those elections as appropriate. We have repeatedly said that if the Zimbabwean Government can demonstrate commitment to political and economic reform, the UK stands ready to do all that it can to support recovery, but that commitment is essential.

European Council

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 26th March 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I thank my hon. Friend for that suggestion. I am very happy to join him and the British delegation in making that request.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

May I congratulate the Prime Minister on getting unanimity on Russia?

Will the Prime Minister state categorically today that no matter what happens, the implementation period will end at the end of December 2020? Does she agree that to go into any negotiation saying that one will never walk away is not the way to get the best result?

[The Prime Minister]

I certainly agree with the hon. Lady on that point, which I have made in the Chamber in the past. Anybody going into a negotiation needs to be able to take that position.

On the end date of the implementation period, I have spoken about it being around two years. In the negotiations, the European Union wanted it to be at December 2020, and I felt it was appropriate that we had that firm date, so that everybody is clear about when the implementation period will end.

UK/EU Future Economic Partnership

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 5th March 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

Absolutely. The European Union asked for more detail to be set out. I said that I would do that at the appropriate time. I have now done so both on security and on our economic partnership. My message to the European Union in relation to the negotiations is, “Let’s get on with it.”

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister made some very sensible suggestions in her speech about the relationship with regard to the border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland. Has she read a very good report by the European Parliament’s Committee on Constitutional Affairs about how the border issue can be solved by innovative technology and so on? Will she make sure that her officials also read that before they go back into negotiations?

European Council

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 18th December 2017 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

The fact that nothing is agreed until everything is agreed is actually in the joint progress report that was published by the UK and the European Union. There will be various stages at which this Parliament will be able to vote on matters relating to our leaving the EU. I just referred to the withdrawal agreement and implementation Bill, and there will be other pieces of legislation as well. Separate from the formal withdrawal agreement that will bring those matters into UK law, we will of course be able legally to sign our new trade agreement with the EU once we leave the EU.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

If we will no longer be in the internal market and the customs union during the implementation period, why can we not negotiate, sign and implement new trade deals before the end of that period?

[The Prime Minister]

The purpose of the implementation period is to ensure that businesses and individuals do not have to make two sets of changes because of a new relationship that is put in place as part of our future partnership with the EU. That is why, as we look at the implementation period, I and the Government are clear that although we will be formally out of the customs union and the single market, we expect to be able to operate on the same terms as we currently do. That is what limits the ability to implement new trade deals elsewhere.

Brexit Negotiations

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 11th December 2017 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

For the avoidance of doubt, I should say to the whole House that I regard any reference to Geoffrey Boycott as a compliment. What is said in the joint progress report is that these payments will be made as they fall due, unless otherwise determined by the United Kingdom and the European Union.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

This is a little bit of repetition, but to be absolutely clear, will the Prime Minister confirm that leaving the single market—the internal market, as I prefer to call it—and the customs union is not an option, and that anyone who is pushing for that is really still trying to stay in the EU?

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Lady asked me to confirm that anybody wanting to leave the single market and the customs union effectively wants to stay in the EU; I think she meant that anybody who wants to stay in the single market and the customs union wants that. [Interruption.] She is nodding her affirmation. Yes, that is absolutely right. It is clear that actually leaving the EU means leaving the single market and the customs union.

UK Plans for Leaving the EU

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 9th October 2017 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

Yes, I believe that such a relationship is in the interests of the remaining 27 members states of the EU and that as they come to look at this issue—they were not previously focusing on it, but Florence has now triggered their thinking on it—they will see the benefits of such a relationship not just to us but to them as well.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

The European Commission talks continually about the need for Her Majesty’s Government to provide certainty and clarity. Is there not one area in which we could provide that certainty and clarity very plainly, today and in our negotiations? Could we not make it clear that in March 2019 we will withdraw from the common fisheries policy, take back all our fisheries, and ensure that our fishing communities actually take back control of who fishes in British waters?

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Lady is right to suggest that when we leave the European Union one of the aspects of leaving it will be leaving the common fisheries policy. Of course, we will need to consider the arrangements that we want to put in place here in the United Kingdom for the operation of our coastal waters and the operation of fishing around them.

Article 50

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Wednesday 29th March 2017 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The Conservative-led Government’s long-term economic plan, on which we all stood at the last election, has enabled our economy to have the necessary strength. We are pleased that we are able to maintain and build on that strength in our economy. She talks about the WTO arrangements. What I say in the letter to President Tusk is very clear:

“If…we leave the European Union without an agreement the default position is that we would have to trade on World Trade Organisation terms.”

In that kind of scenario, both the UK and the EU would of course cope with the change, but it is not the outcome that either side should seek. We must therefore work hard to avoid that outcome. I am clear that we want a comprehensive free trade agreement with the European Union, and that is what we will be working for.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

On what is a genuinely historic day for our country, may I pay tribute to the Prime Minister and to the Brexit Ministers for their determination and dedication in getting to this stage today to implement the will of the British people? Does she agree that one area on which we should be able to move forward very quickly in negotiations is getting back control of our fishing grounds?

European Council

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Tuesday 14th March 2017 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

In our negotiations, the Spanish Government have been concerned and clear that it is not possible for a country to break away from a member of the European Union and immediately rejoin the European Union—the Barroso doctrine, which has been reaffirmed by the European Commission. As for Scotland, independence would not mean membership of the European Union. Scotland would remain outside the European Union.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

I am sure that the Prime Minister will be pleased to know that millions of Labour supporters across the country will be delighted and will share her and my pleasure at the legal decision taken by Parliament. Did the right hon. Lady have any chance at the Council to discuss informally with EU leaders the position of British citizens in other countries? Are those leaders sticking up for our citizens there in the way we are sticking up for their citizens here?

[The Prime Minister]

I have had several discussions with European leaders on that point. That is why I said in response to an earlier question that there is good will on both sides about dealing with the issue and about recognising the needs not only of UK citizens living in other EU member states but of EU citizens living here in the UK. There is good will, but, as has been made clear in the past, no discussion can happen until the negotiations have been formally triggered.

Informal European Council

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 6th February 2017 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. With his particular constituency interest, he is very aware of the issues around migrants being in the camp at Calais and the pressure that that puts on Dover, particularly when people are trying to get through to the United Kingdom. We will make every effort to work with the French Government to ensure that we do not see a return to the sort of camps that we saw last year in Calais before they were cleared.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

Is the Prime Minister disappointed that the mantra of nothing will be agreed until everything is agreed has been adopted as far as EU citizens in all our countries are concerned? Is it not possible for her to have an informal letter with the Prime Ministers of Spain and France to agree informally, as soon as it is technically possible after the start of article 50 negotiations, to bring in that reciprocality?

[The Prime Minister]

It is not the case that people are saying that, in this particular issue, it can only be agreed at the end of the deal when everything else is agreed. What they have said is that they do not believe that negotiations and discussions on it should not start until article 50 has triggered the formal negotiations. I have every expectation, from the good will that I have seen from others, that it will be possible to get an early agreement on this matter to give people the reassurance that they need.

European Council

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 24th October 2016 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

All I would say to my hon. Friend is that, regardless of which side of the debate Members were on before 23 June, we should all accept the voice of the British people and put that into practice.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

I congratulate the Prime Minister on her handling of her first European Union summit. I will not ask her whether she enjoyed it, but does she accept that millions of people who voted to leave—including, let us not forget, millions of Labour voters—will only believe that we are really leaving when we invoke article 50? Will she assure the House that she will not be taken in by those who want to delay and delay and delay in the hope that somehow, somewhere, they will get another referendum?

[The Prime Minister]

I have made it very clear that there is no question of another referendum. While I felt that it was right for us to take some time to prepare before the start of the negotiations through the invoking of article 50, it is also true that, as the hon. Lady says, members of the public will want to see article 50 invoked so that they know that this is going to happen. That is why I think that the timetable for invoking it by the end of March 2017 is the right one.

Criminal Law

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 10th November 2014 Commons Chamber

[The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)]

I beg to move,

That the draft Criminal Justice and Data Protection (Protocol No. 36) Regulations 2014, which were laid before this House on 3 November, be approved.

Protocol 36 is the part of the Lisbon treaty that relates to the United Kingdom’s opt-out from the policing and criminal justice measures that were adopted before the treaty came into force. The opt-out provisions are unique to the United Kingdom, and were negotiated by the previous Administration. Under the terms of protocol 36, the UK had to decide before the end of May 2014 whether it wished to opt out of all the police and criminal justice measures—some 130 in all—that predate the Lisbon treaty. The opt-out had to be exercised en masse; we could not simply leave the measures that we did not like.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

I want the Home Secretary to be very clear, and give a yes or no answer. Will the House get the chance in the next couple of weeks to vote on the European arrest warrant?

[Mrs May]

The House is getting a chance today to debate the European arrest warrant. The House has been clear that it wished to have such a debate. We were very clear during the debate on the business motion that regulations are before the House, and the House will vote on those regulations. I have also been very clear about the Government’s position. We have brought those particular regulations before the House because they are the only ones that we need to transpose into UK legislation. I will come on to comment on the European arrest warrant. As I said earlier, I am very clear that the vote today relates to whether or not the UK opts back in to the package of measures that we have negotiated. The package comes together; it is not an a la carte menu from which one can pick and choose.

Olympics (Security)

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Thursday 12th July 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

We have obviously had discussions with LOCOG and G4S about their plans for the numbers that they were bringing on board at any particular point in time. It has become clear to G4S that it cannot guarantee the numbers that it had previously given us reassurances about. It is in those circumstances that we have made the contingency arrangements.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

I welcome the use of extra servicemen and women at our Olympics. The three Olympic games that I have attended have had many representatives of the armed forces, who do a brilliant job. Perhaps they should have been involved from the beginning and the money that has gone to this security force could have gone to them to start with. Can we please remember that this is a sporting event? I worry that we are going so over the top on the security aspect that people have forgotten that this is about countries competing in sporting endeavours in a friendly way.

[Mrs May]

The hon. Lady makes an extremely valid point. This is a sporting event. We want people to come to London 2012 and enjoy it as a sporting event. We want them to feel safe and secure while they are doing that. That is why it is appropriate for us to ensure that the venue security arrangements are right. She referred to the military being engaged in other Olympic games. The military in the UK provides security at other sporting events, such as Wimbledon, so it is not unusual. What is different is the scale of this event and, therefore, the scale of the venue security that has to be provided.

Abu Qatada

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Tuesday 17th April 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for his question. I suspect that more lies behind it than merely the deportation of Abu Qatada.

In cases such as this, when we are dealing with individuals who are a danger to the United Kingdom and are suspected of terrorist offences, the Government explore every avenue. However, as I pointed out earlier and as my right hon. Friend will know, decisions about prosecution in the UK are not decisions for the Government. As I have said in response to a number of questions, we and other members of the Council of Europe are looking at the efficiency of the European Court, because the matter was before it for a significant period.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

Does the Home Secretary recognise that the vast majority of the British public who have heard her statement today will not understand why we, a so-called independent country, cannot get rid of someone who is a risk to our security? She has said, and I accept it, that we do not want to be seen to be breaking the law, but the law is clearly wrong, and we must find ways of changing it so that we can deport, as soon as possible, people whom we do not wish to be in this country.

[Mrs May]

I thank the hon. Lady for what I think is her support for my statement. We will be considering, in particular, the systems that are available to other countries to establish whether there is anything that we should be doing here in the UK to ensure that we can deport people who are dangerous to the United Kingdom, who are suspected of terrorist offences, and who pose a national security risk, far more quickly than we do now.

Metropolitan Police Service

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Monday 18th July 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

I thank my hon. Friend for making that point. As he will know as a member of the Home Affairs Committee, the Committee will have a chance to question both Sir Paul Stephenson and John Yates tomorrow at its further meeting.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

Does the Home Secretary have any concern that the basic principle that someone is innocent until they are proven guilty in a criminal court has been thrown out of the window?

[Mrs May]

That is an important principle on which we must base what we do. That is why I try not to comment on things until I have seen the evidence on matters of concern. It is of course true that these investigations must be followed through properly and fully, so that those who are guilty can be brought to justice and any speculation about those who are innocent can be cleared up.

Prevent Strategy

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Tuesday 7th June 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

We work closely with the Government of Pakistan on counter-terrorism matters, and I should put on record in the House, as I believe I have on previous occasions, that in fact the Pakistani people have suffered significant losses to terrorist attacks. Several thousand people have died in Pakistan in recent years as a result of such attacks, and we should never forget what is happening to people living there. Of course, there are considerable links between this country and Pakistan, and as I said, we work closely with the Pakistani Government in examining counter-terrorism issues.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

I very much welcome the better targeting of our resources, but will the Home Secretary ensure that projects and schemes that are doing extremely well in inner cities, such as some around the mosque in Lambeth, are protected or at least not arbitrarily thrown away just to save money?

[Mrs May]

One aspect of the new strategy that we are adopting is a much closer evaluation of the work that is done, so that we can identify precisely the projects that are working well and should continue to be supported. At the same time, we will also identify groups that we feel it is no longer right for the Government to fund.

European Investigation Order

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Tuesday 27th July 2010 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

I thank the hon. Member for Bolsover (Mr Skinner) for that sedentary intervention.

I did make that statement on sovereignty in relation to the EIO. We are opting in to the draft directive, over which there will be negotiations in the coming months. However, I said what I said because the order and the directive are not about sovereignty moving to Europe, but about making a practical step of co-operation to ensure that it will be easier for us not only to fight crime, but crucially, to ensure that justice is done.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

I am disappointed but not surprised by the Government’s decision to opt in to the EIO. I was a Home Office Minister some years ago, and even then officials tried to push all kinds of things, by which more power was taken away from this country. Following the Secretary of State’s previous answer, is she saying—let us let the public know the truth—that once we opt in, no matter how much we find that it is not working in our interest or that it is costing huge amounts of money, there is absolutely nothing we can do?

[Mrs May]

I thank the hon. Lady for her question, which shows not only that matters European divide different parties, but that people within the same party take different attitudes. She assumes that opting in to the order will mean extra costs and extra burdens for UK police, but I repeat what I said in response to my right hon. Friend the Member for Wokingham (Mr Redwood): we are talking about codifying arrangements that already exist. We are not suddenly being asked to sign up to something new that has just been plucked off the shelf. The suggestion is for practical co-operation that codifies and simplifies arrangements that already exist and that benefit police forces here in the UK.

Identity Documents Bill

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Wednesday 9th June 2010 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

No. I shall come to that point later. There are biometric residency permits for foreign nationals and they are completely separate from the identity card scheme. They were rolled into the ID scheme only because the Labour Government were trying desperately to bolster it; they claimed that the residency permits were somehow part of the ID card scheme, which they are not. Those biometric residency permits will continue to exist.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

As one of the Labour Members who opposed identity cards from the beginning, I am delighted that the Bill is one of the first pieces of legislation that the new Government are putting through. Will the Home Secretary say something about people who went ahead and rather stupidly bought an identity card? Does she feel that they should be recompensed or does she think they should have listened to those of us on both sides of the House who said, “This is the wrong scheme and you shouldn’t be doing that”?

[Mrs May]

I thank the hon. Lady for her intervention. She does indeed have an honourable record of maintaining opposition to identity cards. I will make reference to this point later, but I can tell her now that we will not be offering refunds to all those who chose to get an identity card. [Hon. Members: “Outrageous!”] Labour Front Benchers shout “Outrageous”, but we made it clear that we were opposed to identity cards. The Liberal Democrat party made it absolutely clear that it was opposed to identity cards. People knew well before the election what would happen if a Conservative Government were elected.

Cumbrian Shooting Incident

Debate between Baroness May of Maidenhead and Baroness Hoey

Thursday 3rd June 2010 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

I assure my right hon. Friend that when we have had an opportunity to look at the full facts of this case, we intend to learn any lessons that come out of it. On the issue to which he alludes, I have spoken to the chief constable about the reaction times that were available. My right hon. Friend, and others, will be aware that there are particular circumstances in Cumbria involving its geography, and the knowledge of the local area of the individual concerned in this incident, Derrick Bird. Of course operational matters are for the police, but I assure my right hon. Friend that if there are any lessons to be learned, they will be.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

I thank the Home Secretary for her very measured statement. I do not think that words can really describe the horror of what happened yesterday. Does she agree that we already have the most stringent gun control laws in Europe, and that before making any changes, or doing anything that she thinks may be done, we should consider this in the widest and most measured way possible so that we do not stop people who legitimately use weapons for sport and in other legitimate ways, and do not have an automatic knee-jerk response? I very much welcome the fact that she wants to see all the facts before we make any decisions or even start to discuss this.

[Mrs May]

The hon. Lady is right that we have among the most stringent gun regulations in Europe. We must not respond immediately by taking a decision as to what is necessary, but wait until we know the full facts and then take the opportunity to look at the results of the police investigation, to consider what has happened in this incident and to ask ourselves whether there are lessons to be learned and whether we need to take further action. I am very clear that we must not have a knee-jerk reaction to this incident, but it is right to look at it properly in due course and take any decisions that are necessary. As I say, it would be my intention, subject to others, to provide an opportunity for Members of this House to debate these issues before the summer recess.