Armed Forces Restructuring

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Thursday 23rd January 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for his suggestion. The balance between the different arms and the focus that we put on different parts of our defence infrastructure is quite properly reviewed in the strategic defence and security review process. I am glad, and I am sure he will be too, that we have now placed this on a firm quinquennial footing so that the issues can be reopened and re-examined regularly. It is quite proper to do so.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

Is not the failure of the Army recruitment strategy the reason the redundancy numbers are smaller than originally envisaged?

[Mr Hammond]

We constantly look at all the levers—as the Army calls them—of manning. The levers are recruitment levels, voluntary outflow—people leaving the service before the last possible date—and redundancy, which is always the last resort. There is a constant rebalancing. We had already reduced intended recruiting numbers to minimise redundancy, but we cannot do the whole restructuring through the recruitment lever alone because in some areas we have to take personnel out of the structure in order to deliver Future Force 2020.

Defence Reform Bill

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Wednesday 20th November 2013 Commons Chamber

[Thomas Docherty]

No, I will not. We hear quite enough from the hon. Gentleman at other times.

It is not the Royal Army: we have a Royal Navy and a Royal Air Force, but a British Army. I make that point not to take up valuable time, but because the Secretary of State seems to think that it is the job of Ministers of the Crown, not of Parliament, to make decisions about the Army.

In an earlier exchange about the Back-Bench debate, the Secretary of State said from a sedentary position that it was a Back-Bench vote. The problem with his approach, and the one advocated by the hon. Member for Canterbury (Mr Brazier), is that if there is an annual report that Members of Parliament want not only to debate but to vote on, it is clear that the Secretary of State’s intention would be to ignore any such decision.

This is our last chance to tell the Government that although the House supports the broad thrust of the Army reforms, they are clearly not going according to plan. The Secretary of State has already demonstrated that he has the courage to change tack, as he did on the aircraft carriers, when something is clearly going wrong. I am genuinely surprised that he is not prepared to say, “This is not going as well as we want. We need to slow the rate of progress, so that we do not end up in a disastrous position.”

[Mr Philip Hammond]

For a moment, I thought that the hon. Gentleman was suggesting that we ought to slow the rate of progress on the reserves agenda, but if anything we need to speed it up. I would just tell the hon. Gentleman—seeing the Chairman of the Defence Committee, my right hon. Friend the Member for North East Hampshire (Mr Arbuthnot) in his place—that if he believes Ministers will not be regularly scrutinised from morning till night by the Select Committee and at Defence questions in this House throughout the implementation of the programme, I do not know what planet he is living on. Of course we expect to be scrutinised.

[Thomas Docherty]

If the Secretary of State had been paying a bit more attention, he would have heard me say that it is quite clear that he does not intend to respect any such vote in Parliament. I am sorry, but this Parliament, not Ministers of the Crown, should be sovereign. If he is not confident of carrying his plans for the Army in Parliament, something is fundamentally wrong.

--- Later in debate ---

[Thomas Docherty]

I am grateful for that intervention. I hope that it would not be a career-damaging move if I called the hon. Member for Beckenham (Bob Stewart) my hon. Friend, because I have had the pleasure of serving with him on the Defence Committee for the past three years. That is a perfectly reasonable suggestion and I am sorry that the Secretary of State has not offered that option.

There is genuine good will on both sides of the House. The armed forces and the defence of the realm are not issues that should be party political. This has been a good debate so far because we have managed, on the whole, to keep party politics out of it.

I agree with the Chairman of the Defence Committee about the growing value of cyber-warfare. When the Defence Committee visited the United States earlier this year, we went to cyber command and saw at first hand the key role that is being played by reservists. I think that Members on both sides of the House would agree that we need more such reservists coming through.

The problem is that the bald facts show that we are not recruiting sufficient reservists. When the generals appeared before the Defence Committee earlier this year, they said that we needed to recruit 6,000 reservists annually. I am sure that the Secretary of State has the most up-to-date figures, but I doubt whether a huge number of reservists have been recruited in the past few days. We are clearly falling short and we have been falling short for years. This is not just a teething problem; it is an ongoing problem.

As the Chief of the General Staff has said, there is no plan B on this project. It is therefore crucial that we get it right. At the moment—I say this in a genuinely bipartisan manner—the Government are not on track to meet these important targets. It is entirely sensible for the House to ask for a pause so that the Government can get back on track. The excellent observation was made earlier that that would help to focus minds. Having robust targets and the threat of a pause hanging over the Ministry of Defence might get it to pull the finger out.

The point on which I disagree gently with the hon. Member for Canterbury is that the problem until now has been that the regular generals have been siphoning off the money. They have not made enough progress.

[Mr Philip Hammond]

indicated dissent.

[Thomas Docherty]

The Secretary of State shakes his head, but the £180 million that was allocated to the reserves in the first year was spent on upgrading the regulars. The generals told the Defence Committee that that was what they did. The threat of a pause if they do not get things sorted might compel the generals to make greater progress.

Aircraft Carriers and UK Shipbuilding

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Wednesday 6th November 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

First, I am happy to join my hon. Friend in paying tribute to the tireless work that has been done by my hon. Friend the Member for Portsmouth North (Penny Mordaunt), who, since I have known her, has talked about almost nothing but the shipbuilding industry in Portsmouth. Let me confirm for him that we will do everything we can to ensure that the support package for Portsmouth will be put together in a way that genuinely diversifies the local economy. That is what is needed now, and that includes support for SMEs. I will make sure that my right hon. and hon. Friends in the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills are aware of his comments.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

Given that BAE Systems has announced that there will be job losses at Rosyth and given the Secretary of State’s wider comments about ship maintenance, I am sure that he will be happy to have an urgent meeting with one of his Ministers and me to discuss the future of Rosyth. May I press him to say what will happen if Scotland chooses to become a separate nation in September next year? Will the Type 26 order stay on the Clyde?

[Mr Hammond]

The Type 26 order will not be placed until the design is mature, which will not be until towards the end of next year, and so the hon. Gentleman’s question is premature. A significant number of workers who are nominally based on the Clyde are being bussed on a daily basis to Rosyth to boost the work force during the carrier assembly phase, so the announcement made by BAE Systems should be read in that context. My understanding from Babcock is that the yard at Rosyth has a bright future with private sector work—offshore work—as well as with the programme to assemble both the Queen Elizabeth and the Prince of Wales, which itself will keep the yard busy until 2020.

Reserve Forces

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Wednesday 3rd July 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

It will be for individuals to point the finger, although I can guess where it is most likely to be pointed. I should say that, having previously declined sharply, numbers have stabilised. Of course that is not enough, but it is at least a start; the hole is not getting deeper. The purpose of announcing the measures in the White Paper is to provide the backdrop for what will now be an aggressive recruiting drive to bring through the recruits who in two years’ time—it will of course take two years—will have become fully trained members of the reserve forces.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

I am incredibly disappointed about the shambles today, not least because I learned only 20 minutes ago that Dunfermline was to close. I hope that the Secretary of State will explain the rationale behind that decision. However, written in hand on the summary sheet for this omnishambles of a statement is the word “Kilmarnock”. Will the right hon. Gentleman clarify whether that is a late addition or someone’s homework? What exactly is going on with Kilmarnock?

[Mr Hammond]

The hon. Gentleman is right that Dunfermline is closing: 154 Transport Regiment is to move to Bruce House Territorial Army centre, in one of a significant number of consolidations. In most cases, consolidations do not give rise to site closures because there is more than one unit on a site, but in some cases, where a consolidation removes the last unit or all the units on a site, logically the site closes. I emphasise again that the driver for these changes is not to vacate sites; it is to create a structure that will deliver the military capability we require and allow reservists to receive the training offer that we have set out to them today. I regret that, in some cases, that will mean that people have to travel to an Army Reserve centre in an adjoining community, but I should mention that reservists receive home-to-duty travel allowance and will therefore be reimbursed for the costs of making the journey.

Army Basing Plan

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Tuesday 5th March 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

I can assure my hon. Friend that it is going ahead as planned. It is under way now. As I said in my statement, my right hon. Friend the Minister for the Armed Forces will be making an announcement in due course about other moves on the technical training estate.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

I join the right hon. and learned Member for North East Fife (Sir Menzies Campbell) in saying that the Royal Electrical and Mechanical Engineers and the Royal Scots Dragoons will get a warm Fife welcome when they arrive, but may I press the Secretary of State to say why the decision has been taken not to proceed with MOD Caledonia?

[Mr Hammond]

As I think the hon. Gentleman is aware, Caledonia will remain as a naval facility without any Army presence. The Army plan has been looked at from the bottom up by the Army. The considerations are particularly around patterns of training activity, so that units that need to train together are located together. Because we are severely capital constrained, we have had to look at how to make the best use of the existing estate infrastructure, which in some cases has meant not going ahead with proposals that would have involved significant new capital investment. But this is an Army-designed, military-led plan that will allow us to generate our military capability at the best value to the taxpayer.

Deployment to Mali

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Tuesday 29th January 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. This training support should be seen in the context of our ongoing and very good relations with the Anglophone countries of west Africa, where we already have in place excellent military-to-military relationships and provide some training to them. This is very much a continuation and a stepping up of an activity for which there is established precedent, and I hope that the House will support it on that basis.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

The Secretary of State will have seen the report in Friday’s Le Monde about atrocities that have allegedly been committed by Mali Government forces as they have seized back territory. Will he explain why we are not making it an absolute requirement on the Malian Government to investigate and co-operate fully with the International Criminal Court before we give them a single shilling?

[Mr Hammond]

We are making the point very clearly to the Malian Government that if they want to benefit from the support of the United Kingdom and other members of the international community, they must respond swiftly and effectively to the allegations that have been made. The French forces command in Mali is also very focused on the need to address this issue promptly.

Army 2020

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Thursday 5th July 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

I am grateful to my right hon. Friend. That final comment is the point: the Army gets things done. When it has to deal with a situation, it makes it work. He is right that key to the strategy is the effective integration of the reserves. There will be a new deal for reservists. There is ring-fenced money for kit and training in a way that there has not been in the past. That kit has already started to arrive. This year, reserve formations will train overseas. The number of units training overseas this year will be 26 and that will increase over time. Vital to this process are the integration of the reserves, the deal for employers and the deal for reservists, which involves a greater commitment on our behalf, but also expects a clearer commitment from them about their liability to deployment. I have published a written statement today that sets out further details on how we intend to take the process forward.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

The Secretary of State said that this announcement would have no impact on the basing review, which started last July. May I press him to say whether the proposal for a multi-role brigade to come to Scotland will still go ahead? Specifically, what will happen to Caledonia and Leuchars? Will the Minister meet me and the right hon. and learned Member for North East Fife (Sir Menzies Campbell) to discuss those two bases?

[Mr Hammond]

The right hon. and learned Member for North East Fife (Sir Menzies Campbell) has often reminded me of the concerns about Leuchars. I can only repeat that there will be no impact whatever on the basing review, and our intentions on basing remain as set out. We are doing the work to enable us to deliver them, and we have set out a time scale for doing so.

Defence Budget and Transformation

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Monday 14th May 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

Yes, I can reassure my hon. Friend of that. There is a perception that UORs have effectively delivered equipment far more quickly, and often far closer to the original estimated budget, than conventional procurement. We have got to see what we can learn from those processes that will translate across into the main procurement programme.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

The Defence Secretary has today made exactly the same claims about having balanced the books as his predecessor did some 12 months ago, yet 12 months ago the ministerial team refused to give the Defence Committee a single strand of evidence. Will the Government give that evidence this time?

[Mr Hammond]

First, my right hon. Friend the Member for North Somerset (Dr Fox) said that he had broadly balanced the defence budget and he was correct. What we have done over the past few months is go that last mile, to be able to say that it is fully balanced over the PR12 period. As for information, I have made it clear that once the National Audit Office has completed its review, we will publish its report and a summary-level equipment plan, with the same level of detail in it as has routinely been published about the defence budget. That may not be the level of detail that the hon. Gentleman would like, but it just is not possible, for security reasons and for commercial reasons, to publish a 10-year programme in minute detail without making the situation that the MOD faces impossible.

Carrier Strike Capability

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Thursday 10th May 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

The STOVL configuration of the carrier in the carrier-enabled power projection model means that the carrier will embark both fast jets and helicopters—Chinook, Lynx and Merlin. It will also be able to embark Marines. It is a very large ship, as we have mentioned this morning. It will have the capability to carry troops and embark helicopters and fast jets in a way that will facilitate amphibious warfare.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

Even a first-week midshipman could tell the Prime Minister that adopting two 180° U-turns takes us back to where we started two years ago. Will the Secretary of State give a commitment that the Government will continue to stand beside the use of Rosyth dockyard for the long-term maintenance of the carriers when they enter service? Will he tell the House what we will achieve, except squandering he knows not how many millions of pounds, by flogging our Harrier fleet for spare parts for a peppercorn, scrapping a generation of fast-jet Harrier pilots, and leaving the nation with—

[Mr Speaker]

We have got the gist. I am most grateful to the hon. Gentleman.

Afghanistan (Troop Levels)

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Thursday 26th April 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

The announcement that I have made is not in any way provisional on that report. The United States will recall its surge troops during the course of this year, bringing its force level in Afghanistan back down to 68,000. The discussion that General Allen referred to is about the trajectory of US force levels beyond that figure. We have no definitive read-out of that discussion yet, and we have as yet made no definitive plan for our own draw-down beyond the end of 2012.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

Understandably, much of the focus has been on the role of the British Army, but may I press the Secretary of State to say a little about what role, if any, the Royal Air Force may provide post-2014 either in direct combat operations or in combat-enabling operations?

[Mr Hammond]

I should first say that members of all the armed forces will be involved in the Afghan national officer training academy, so there will definitely be a tri-service presence in Afghanistan after 2014 in that capacity. Beyond that, we have made no decisions about the nature or scale of any continuing support that we may provide. As I said earlier, the conversation about that will begin in Chicago, but I do not expect it to be concluded quickly.

Hostage Rescue Operation (Nigeria)

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Tuesday 13th March 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

I do not think that the course of events would have been changed in any way. In fairness, if the boot was on the other foot, UK Ministers would undoubtedly feel the need to know what was going on with an operation that would impact on the life of a UK citizen. I do not think that the Italians’ concern is in any way unreasonable, I just think they need to understand—I believe that they do, now—that, as regards the pace at which the operation developed, they were informed as expeditiously as possible. As I have said many times already this afternoon, the lines of communication between the intelligence agencies were pretty much continuously open.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

The House will recall the tragic cases of Kenneth Bigley and Margaret Hassan, who were killed by their captors in Iraq some years ago, as well as the steps taken by my right hon. Friend the Member for Blackburn (Mr Straw) to ensure that the families received adequate ongoing support. May I press the Secretary of State to say what ongoing support will be given to the family of Mr McManus?

[Mr Hammond]

The Foreign Office has a well-established way of dealing with those issues after such an event. I know that Foreign Office officials have been in continuous contact with the family and will continue to provide support to them.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Monday 14th November 2011 Commons Chamber

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

The Secretary of State will know that Rosyth in my constituency does the refitting for the current carriers and that it is expected to do the refitting for future carriers that may be used in Libya-style operations. Will he confirm that, if there was a separate Scotland, the Ministry of Defence would have to look again at the long-term refitting options for our aircraft carriers?

[Mr Hammond]

I was not quite sure where that was going. The hon. Gentleman is of course right: it is unlikely Her Majesty’s forces would wish to use facilities in a fully independent Scotland in the way they would wish to use them within a United Kingdom.

Afghanistan

Debate between Lord Hammond of Runnymede and Thomas Docherty

Tuesday 18th October 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

My hon. Friend is, of course, right. The plan for post-2014 has to include a credible way of protecting UK civilians involved in reconstruction and development, and a solution for those who have served the British forces and who might be at risk as a result.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

I hope that the Secretary of State will find time in the near future to read the Defence Committee’s report, “Operations in Afghanistan”. Will he say more about what assessment the Government have made of the role of women in the future of Afghanistan?

[Mr Hammond]

The Select Committee’s report is in my box and I was hoping to have read it before today, but alas! I will certainly put it high on my reading list. It is clear that a sustainable future for Afghanistan has to include all parts of the population. We have to build on the enormous gains that have been made, particularly in the education of girls. That is already beginning to flow through into changing the nature of Afghan society. We must build on those gains, and we are clear that they are part of the sustainable future that we crave.