Teesworks Joint Venture

Debate between Matt Western and Lee Rowley

Monday 29th January 2024 Commons Chamber

[Lee Rowley]

The right hon. Gentleman has clearly read some of the report. I just want to draw his attention to some other elements of it. Paragraph 12.7 states:

“The project is described as the largest regeneration project undertaken in the UK covering thousands of acres of land. The project is complex and the JV between the public and private sectors brings the inevitable cultural tensions between the desire to move at pace unencumbered by bureaucracy as opposed to the expectations of accountability and transparency”.

The report itself says that there was a debate to be weighed up on that, but it also states in paragraph 6.14, on the very point about the involvement of business and regeneration, that there was “no obvious viable commercial” proposition for regenerating part of the land, and that the joint venture

“was critical to being able to reach agreement with the Thai Banks”

to start it in the first place. It was necessary, it has been done, and it will be transformative for the people of Tees Valley.

[Matt Western (Warwick and Leamington) (Lab)]

The Minister talks about this being a complex project, but I am not quite sure exactly how complex it is. As I see it, Teesworks reported a turnover of £143 million, on which it made a £50 million profit—a 35% return. The only similar return I have seen recently was Baroness Mone’s, for her personal protective equipment. Given the scale of what I think is a scandal and many view as a scandal, the public expect the NAO to undertake an independent report. I admire the Minister’s conviction, but will he not support an independent NAO report to corroborate and validate his own?

[Lee Rowley]

The hon. Gentleman appears to be questioning whether the site is complex. These are not my words, but the words of the review, which many of his colleagues have used, often out of context in the past half an hour, to throw accusations around the place. He stood up once before, on 7 June 2023, to indicate that he thought the project was “a scam”. He was not choosing his words carefully then and he is not choosing his words carefully now. He should consider whether he wants to withdraw any of them.

Oil and Gas Producers: Windfall Tax

Debate between Matt Western and Lee Rowley

Tuesday 1st February 2022 Commons Chamber

[Lee Rowley]

My hon. Friend makes a number of hugely important and powerful points.

[Matt Western]

rose—

[Lee Rowley]

The hon. Gentleman has been waiting for a long time, so I am happy to give way.

[Matt Western]

The Minister is being generous with his time. We need to put his point about the drop in the ocean and the value of £1.5 billion in the context of the £4.3 billion that the Treasury has just written off. We are talking about not dissimilar sums of money, are we not?

[Lee Rowley]

I am very glad that the hon. Gentleman raises that point. I am not sure whether he was present at the end of the last debate, but it was made clear from this Dispatch Box that that is not the case in the slightest. This Government will continue to pursue the recovery of as much of that money as possible. The Labour party can keep repeating the point if it wants, but it would not be fair, accurate or real to do so.

To come back to the Opposition motion, if it is not all about the money, the motivation has to be different. If that is the case, the Labour party should just be clear. The right hon. Member for Doncaster North knows that policy actions have consequences and decisions have reactions. He has put forward a specific proposal for a windfall tax, so he should be held to account for it.

The implications of a windfall tax structured in such a way would have to fall somewhere: on consumers, on investors or on the activity itself. I assume that the Labour party does not propose to go after consumers or to reject the idea of oil and gas as a commodity, so ultimately it will have to be the investors who shoulder the burden. If so, the right hon. Gentleman should be clear that he is expecting less of a return for pension funds and therefore for pensioners and the many hundreds of thousands of people out there who are reliant on the performance of the stock market to ensure that they can be supported in old age.

Perhaps the proposal is just a blunt tool to reduce production in general. If so, the right hon. Gentleman should just say so. That certainly seems to be the inference to draw from his statements today, and from his questions over recent weeks to other Government Front Benchers. It does not sound as if he is simply looking for a source of money to fund others; it does not sound as if he is seeking to maximise economic return; it sounds as if he is deliberately trying to penalise activity on the UK continental shelf and, if possible, to reduce it. If that is the case, he should say so out loud, because then will we know.

Shotton Steelworks: 125th Anniversary

Debate between Matt Western and Lee Rowley

Wednesday 1st December 2021 Commons Chamber

[Lee Rowley]

I know that the right hon. Gentleman will not expect me to accept that point. We accept that there is a challenge with energy prices at the moment, and we understand that that is a cause for concern for a number of energy-intensive industries, including steel, ceramics—which I debated with a number of colleagues in this Chamber and beyond in another place last week—glass and paper. We are keen to understand the detail, and it is important that we recognise that there is nuance in this debate and that different strategies are being employed by different companies.

There are also different contexts in which these energy prices are applied. A diverse group of industries are impacted by gas prices. Efficiencies are being pursued in some places, and there are hedging strategies in others. I accept the right hon. Gentleman’s challenge that energy prices are high, albeit volatile and variable, but I hope he will also acknowledge that we are really trying to work with the industry and the sectors to understand the different challenges presented by high gas prices, and that we will continue to do so over the coming weeks and months.

[Matt Western]

I applaud the Minister’s ambition in seeking to address energy costs in the energy-intensive industries that he has just identified. Would he welcome and support a move towards a greater number of onshore wind turbines, which would be one of the best providers of low-cost energy to this country?

[Lee Rowley]

If the hon. Gentleman will forgive me, I will not set out our energy strategy on wind turbines today. That would be a matter for one of my colleagues in the Department. The broader point that he makes, however, is that over the coming decades we need to decarbonise our electricity supply. We have had some success in doing that over the previous decades. By doing that, through whichever process we can achieve it, we will ensure that we have clean and green energy to support industries such as we are talking about today.

I just want to touch on a couple more points before I close. The right hon. Member for Alyn and Deeside highlighted his concern that the Government do not focus on steel. I would not accept that point. In the 10 or so weeks that I have been the Industry Minister, I have already visited two steel mills and had regular conversations with the companies involved. I have met them on a number of roundtables and will continue to do that. On a broader level, we had the announcement at COP26 and the Glasgow breakthroughs, and we will be working with a number of countries around the world to ensure that we can decarbonise the industries that are more challenging to decarbonise. That indicates a desire to find ways through difficult challenges where there are no easy answers, and the Government and communities are trying to work through how to do that.

One way is through hydrogen, as the right hon. Gentleman highlighted extensively in his speech. He was somewhat sceptical about the UK Government’s activities in this space, but I want to place on record for completeness that there has been significant movement on hydrogen in recent months. We had the publication of the hydrogen strategy in August, the hydrogen business model is being consulted on, and the net zero hydrogen fund stands at nearly £0.25 billion. We also have the UK low carbon hydrogen standard. Of course there is much more to do on that, which is why we are putting in place the frameworks for that to happen, but I hope that that demonstrates an intent from the Government to explore the possibilities around hydrogen.

Finally, I want to touch on procurement, because I know that that was an important part of the right hon. Gentleman’s speech.