Post Office (Horizon System) Offences Bill (Instructions)

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Monday 29th April 2024 Commons Chamber

[The Minister of State, Department for Business and Trade (Kevin Hollinrake)]

I thank the hon. Lady for giving way. I have met the Scottish justice Minister twice online; the reason I met the Northern Ireland Ministers physically is that they came here to Parliament to meet us.

May I push back on something that the hon. Lady said a few moments ago? She said that this Parliament is sovereign. Absolutely, it is sovereign, but on these matters, her Parliament is also sovereign. [Interruption.] Clearly, as she said earlier in her remarks, there is legal controversy on these matters—she has admitted that herself. This Parliament is taking the legal risk in that area, but is the hon. Lady aware of her Lord Advocate’s position on this particular matter? These are her actual words:

“It is important to recognise that, in Scotland, there is an established route of appeal in circumstances such as this…and that due process must be followed.”—[Scottish Parliament Official Report, 16 January 2024; c. 14.]

Does the hon. Lady not believe that in that situation, her Parliament should act to overturn these convictions?

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

I am quite anxious that we do not have too many long interventions so that, if hon. Members want to catch my eye, there is plenty of time for debate.

[Marion Fellows]

Madam Deputy Speaker, I hate to disagree with you—as you know, I do not do that—but there will be no more time for some Members to speak on this Bill if it does not include Scotland. In his intervention, the Minister said that the Scottish Parliament is sovereign—well, there is a surprise. We on the SNP Benches all want Scotland to be sovereign, but it is the people who have sovereignty in Scotland, not the Parliament.

We are dancing on the heads of pins, Madam Deputy Speaker, which is not my intention. It is very clear—so clear that it is transparent— that party politics is involved in all of this. Six days ago, the Secretary of State for Business and Trade described the Scottish Parliament as lazy, and asked why it did not put through its own legislation. Believe me, it can and it will if it has to, but why should Scottish postmasters wait longer for justice? On Second Reading in this place, I said that there was likely to be to-ing and fro-ing, and that it would probably be July before this Bill is passed.

--- Later in debate ---

[Marion Fellows]

I just want to ask the Minister: what did the Scottish postmasters say to you—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

Order. The hon. Lady knows she must not refer directly to the Minister in that way, but do so through the Chair.

[Marion Fellows]

I beg your pardon, Madam Deputy Speaker. What did the Scottish sub-postmasters say to the Minister this afternoon? Were they pleased, were they happy and did they feel they were getting justice through this action?

--- Later in debate ---

[Marion Fellows]

As far as I am concerned, and as far as the SNP is concerned, politics does not come into this. It is about getting justice for Scottish sub-postmasters and postmasters across the rest of the United Kingdom at the same time.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

I want to make it clear that interventions need to be questions to the person making the speech.

[Marion Fellows]

Does the right hon. Gentleman not agree?

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

The hon. Lady has got it!

--- Later in debate ---

[Marion Fellows]

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. At no time have the Scottish Justice Secretary or the Scottish Parliament said that they will not pass legislation—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

Order. The hon. Member for Rutherglen and Hamilton West (Michael Shanks) has finished his speech. If the hon. Lady would like to make a few comments, she can. She does not need to do so through a point of order.

Buckland Review of Autism Employment

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Thursday 25th April 2024 Commons Chamber

[Marion Fellows (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)]

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. Running through my mind are the words, “Follow that!” I thank the right hon. and learned Member for South Swindon (Sir Robert Buckland) for producing this outstanding report. His family’s lived experience has absolutely made for a much better report, and I thank him for all the work that he has done on it. To follow the right hon. Member for East Ham (Sir Stephen Timms) is always a privilege and a pleasure—he has taken away some of my best lines, but I will carry on regardless.

It is a real pleasure to speak in the debate, which I signed up for immediately, having spoken many times in this place on the subject of autism. I think it would be remiss of me not to mention Dame Cheryl Gillan at the start of my remarks. One of the first debates that I spoke in was on the closure of the autism One Stop Shop in Motherwell back in 2015, and Dame Cheryl was so kind and helpful to me when I spoke to that important topic. I should point out that I am very close to someone with three autistic sons. My own youngest son has never been diagnosed, but I do not think there is much doubt that he is somewhere on the spectrum, and I think he would admit that himself. I also thank Ambitious about Autism and the National Autistic Society for their briefings, which are always helpful.

The current situation regarding employment for those with autism is simply not good enough across the UK. The UK Government have consistently banged on about reducing economic inactivity and encouraging people into work, but their rhetoric is still not matched with proper support, especially for the neurodiverse, about whom we are talking today.

As we have heard, issues with access to work and the provision of workplace adjustments mean that many autistic people are slipping through the gaps. This is certainly the case for those with autism: as we have also heard, only three in 10 working-age autistic people in the UK are in employment. That statistic is five in 10 for all disabled people, and eight in 10 for non-disabled people. Ambitious about Autism’s employment survey found that 71% of those unemployed would like to be in work, but less than a third were confident that they would find work within the next year. That signifies a huge gap in the support currently provided.

I have seen at first hand the transformative power of employment when autistic and disabled people are properly supported into work. I had the privilege of visiting University Hospital Wishaw to meet some of the participants in the supported internship scheme run by DFN Project SEARCH, and met some of the students on that scheme. Some of them have now found employment. Some of them have now married. The transformation in their lives and those of their families cannot be over- estimated—I literally had to be dragged off the scene, because that was one of the most uplifting visits I have undertaken as an MP.

Employment brings fulfilment, independence and purpose, and as I have said, it can positively transform the life of the employee if they are well supported. However, even when employed, autistic people face challenges and discrimination. The Buckland report finds that autistic workers face the largest pay gap of all disability groups, earning on average a third less than their non-neurodiverse counterparts. Further, the report notes that autistic graduates are twice as likely as non-disabled graduates to be unemployed after 15 months. Only 36% find work in that period, and autistic graduates are more likely to be overqualified for the job they have. They are the most likely people to be on zero-hour contracts and the least likely to be in a permanent role. All of those things require looking at properly, because the statistics are appalling.

Morally, we should be ensuring that autistic workers are supported when trying to find employment, but it is also incumbent upon Government, employers and other stakeholders to ensure that those with autism are adequately supported when they are in work. The SNP welcomes the publication of the Buckland review of autism and employment, and urges the Government to implement its recommendations to ensure that autistic people have the opportunities they deserve. I further welcome the report’s engagement with autistic organisations, as lived experience is vital when shaping policy. That is something the UK Government do not always have a good track record on.

A lack of access to good-quality careers advice, inflexible hiring practices and non-inclusive workplace cultures are just some of the barriers facing autistic people. Once employment has been achieved, autistic people can struggle when employers do not or cannot put in place proper adjustments to support them. Autistic people process information differently and experience a built environment in a totally different manner, which can impinge on their ability to carry out their work—too much bright light, noise, or social interaction can be overwhelming. Additionally, as has been said, autistic people might need more time to process interview questions. It is imperative that employers are aware of such differences and take steps to accommodate autistic workers—or any disabled workers, for that matter. A person close to me has an autistic son who wears a badge at work to indicate his mood to his co-workers. It is a simple thing: if he is feeling overwhelmed and does not want people to talk to him or to be interrupted, he turns the badge to indicate that.

From my own experience in further education, I know that my students benefited immensely when we had autistic students in class. At first they thought it was strange—they were a bit wary—but over the year they developed an understanding of autism and a real respect for the autistic students who sat next to them. The same happens in workplaces: if we can get people into the right place and the right job, everyone benefits. Not accommodating autistic workers wastes so much talent and skill. It makes no sense for businesses either—we have already heard about the special skills that autistic people can bring to the workplace. When businesses properly accommodate neurodiverse employees, the results can be amazing. I have visited the Barclays bank campus in Glasgow, designed by a woman architect who has autistic sons. The difference in that building is awesome: it is built with neurodiverse people in mind, with big open-plan offices with chill pods and a real understanding of what needs to happen. As a result, Barclays has great employees, and people are getting good work and proper jobs.

It is imperative that the UK Government act urgently to improve support for all disabled people, including those with autism, and tackle barriers to employment. We are really worried about the Prime Minister’s recent announcement on fit note reform: pushing people into work without considering what they are suffering and what they need is appalling. As you know, Madam Deputy Speaker, I get very passionate about this topic, so I will try to rush through.

It is important that Access to Work is reformed, as the Buckland report calls for, and reforms to sick pay also need to be introduced for when people need time off. In Scotland, the SNP Government try our best. We are trying to be a fair work nation and are investing money in autism, as well as in simple things such as working within education to get initial teacher education courses that will teach trainee teachers about autism, because as we know, education is the gateway to employment. I will stop there, Madam Deputy Speaker. Again, I congratulate the right hon. and learned Member for South Swindon, and I want the Minister to take on board all the report’s recommendations and make life much easier for those with autism in the workplace.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

I call the shadow Minister.

Speaker’s Statement

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Wednesday 21st February 2024 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

I really am going to move on now, I am afraid. [Interruption.] Okay, I will take one more point of order, from Marion Fellows.

[Marion Fellows (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)]

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. Back in October, as soon as I could after the heinous actions of Hamas, I called for a ceasefire, and I have held firm to my belief since. My constituents have written to me in huge numbers telling me to vote for a ceasefire. I carry five proxy votes, and today I have not been allowed either to vote on my own behalf or to use those five proxy votes that I hold. Let me ask the same question that was asked by the hon. Member for Peterborough (Paul Bristow): how do I ensure that the way I would have voted, which was for a ceasefire, is recorded in the House?

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

I think the hon. Lady has made very clear what she would have done, and I am sure that she and all colleagues here will find ways in which to express that view.

Post Office Governance and Horizon Compensation Schemes

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Monday 19th February 2024 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

I call the SNP spokesperson.

[Marion Fellows (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)]

I am at a loss today: another Monday, another Post Office scandal. I have tried very hard to pull together my thoughts on the statement, what was said in The Sunday Times, and what was said in this place less than two weeks ago when I led a Backbench Business debate on the culture of Post Office management.

I will ask the Secretary of State a few questions. Will she place on the record whether Nick Read wrote to the Justice Secretary last month defending the convictions, saying that some postmasters were guilty? That is a serious allegation, and I would really like to have an answer.

There has been talk all morning about damaging confidence in the compensation schemes. If there is confidence in them, can the Secretary of State explain why so many leading sub-postmasters affected by the scandal were given such derisory offers, months and months late? That is just not on. The Secretary of State cannot say that Henry Staunton damaged the compensation schemes; it was down to the Government and Post Office Ltd.

Is the Secretary of State aware that Post Office Ltd still employs 40 investigators who secured convictions? I agree with what the hon. Member for Stalybridge and Hyde (Jonathan Reynolds) said: exoneration must be hurried up and compensation must be paid sooner rather than later. I have said that every month for the last nine months.

EU Programmes

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Thursday 7th September 2023 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

I call the SNP spokesperson.

[Marion Fellows (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)]

The SNP welcomes this move, which will provide much-needed certainty and kickstart new research opportunities for key strength areas of the Scottish economy, including life sciences. The Prime Minister himself has said that rejoining this EU scheme is

“critical to a brighter economic future”.

But the SNP believes that rejoining the EU as a full member state is much more critical than that. Unfortunately, I know that this Government, and probably the incoming Labour Government, strongly disagree with that, to the detriment of Scotland.

Securing Horizon association is a matter of pressing importance. We must not forget that universities and members of the research community in Scotland have missed out on their share of the all-important funding provided by the €95.5 billion European research and innovation programme since the UK Government’s decision to pursue a hard Brexit.

We are disappointed that Euratom is not going to be pursued and is being taken separately. Although we welcome the funding, I think we all agree that it is much better that we work in conjunction with our European neighbours. Scotland has also been locked out of Copernicus, so what is the status of re-entering that and, indeed, the Erasmus+ scheme?

Illegal Migration Bill: Economic Impact Assessment

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Tuesday 27th June 2023 Commons Chamber

[Marion Fellows (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)]

For the Minister’s information, Motherwell and Wishaw has been welcoming refugees for more than 100 years—Lithuanians, Vietnamese, Congolese and Syrians. Please do not make that mistake again.

The economic assessment says:

“By setting an annual cap this should reduce the inflow of people entering the UK and therefore reduce the cost associated with processing asylum claims”,

with secondary benefits—[Interruption.] I am sorry, Madam Deputy Speaker, I do not feel well.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

If it is okay with the hon. Lady, I will move on and I will come back to her if she wishes me to.

Cost of Living

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Tuesday 16th May 2023 Commons Chamber

[Marion Fellows (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)]

Could I gently say to the hon. Gentleman that decision time happens in the Scottish Parliament? Maybe you are there more often than you are here.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

Order. We have got to stop addressing people directly. The hon. Lady is very experienced and knows how she should address people. We cannot have these conversations going on down the far end of the Chamber.

Post Office: Horizon Compensation

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Thursday 23rd March 2023 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

I call the SNP spokesperson.

[Marion Fellows (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)]

I thank the Minister for his statement. Of course, I welcome what he outlined, and, as chair of the all-party parliamentary group on post offices, I am very grateful to him for keeping me updated.

We now have three streams for former postmasters and sub-postmasters who were affected by Horizon to claim compensation—that is really important. The Minister has talked about achieving parity, and I think he will agree that that must be done. I would be keen to for him come back to the House to tell us that it is happening and that the latest compensation scheme will not run out of time.

I think it worth mentioning again the hard work done by the JFSA, by journalists such as Nick Wallis, by Members of this House and by former Members who are now in the other place. They have all been of great help to the APPG. I came into the House not knowing anything about Horizon—I wish I did not know what I know now. I congratulate the Minister and his predecessor, the hon. Member for Sutton and Cheam (Paul Scully), on grabbing hold of this matter and making things happen. So many people will be grateful.

Prepayment Meters: Ofgem Decision

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Monday 6th February 2023 Commons Chamber

[Marion Fellows (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)]

I hope I can be coherent, because I am so angry. People with disabilities and their families face a monthly cost in excess of £600 a month for a single person and over £1,000 for a family with a disabled member in it. Right throughout this cost of living and energy crisis, they have suffered more than double the amount that normal households have. The Minister says he wants to focus on suppliers who are not doing things correctly, but I want you to focus on people who are—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

Order.

[Marion Fellows]

I beg your pardon, Madam Deputy Speaker; I did say that I would try to be coherent.

I want the Minister and the Department to focus on those who are affected by this abhorrent practice and to stop it—not pause it, but stop it immediately. When will he do that?

Conduct of the Right Hon. Member for Uxbridge and South Ruislip

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Tuesday 30th November 2021 Commons Chamber

[Marion Fellows (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP)]

I truly wish it was a privilege and a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Hitchin and Harpenden (Bim Afolami). Has he heard of the word “mandate”? Actually, the one he knows really well is “deflection”.

I had hoped that the Prime Minister would step up to the mark when he assumed high office. I tell my granddaughters that I am disappointed, not angry, when they conduct themselves badly, but I am truly disappointed and angry, but not surprised, with the current Prime Minister, given his predilection for saying what he thinks people want to hear, and changing his mind and breaking promises when it suits.

I wish Scotland were not part of this Union, but while we are, SNP MPs like me must and should censure the current Prime Minister for dishonourable conduct that reflects badly on the UK both here and internationally. The Prime Minister seems to believe that it is okay to say one thing and do another, or to plough ahead with policies, in the middle of a pandemic, that cause real hardship to ordinary families and even more so to our vulnerable communities. Woe betide any person or organisation that gets in the way of what the Prime Minister and the Conservative party see as their divine right to govern how they like. Their attacks on the Parliamentary Commissioner for Standards and on MPs who disagree are vile and undermine all independent checks, which are supposed to protect us all from abuses of power. The Westminster system is broken, and the sooner Scotland can break free of it, the better.

This Prime Minister thinks he can say or do what he likes without hindrance. We as MPs owe it to our constituents to challenge him and his Government to disabuse them of that notion, hence this motion today. Pork barrel politics is now the norm for this Conservative Government. It is much more likely that a Tory marginal seat will receive Government funding than an area that truly needs and deserves it. Seven out of 10 Cabinet Ministers were in low-priority most developed areas, but first in line for significant funding. As we say in Scotland, they do not even put a face on it. The Good Law Project has mounted a legal challenge to the levelling-up fund allocation to assess whether the funding is based on Tory ministerial bias and toeing the party line on certain issues. The Prime Minister believes in helping cronies and Ministers, and the devil take the hindmost. He enjoys unaccountable power, and can and has dismissed independent advice on alleged breaches of ministerial rules.

I want to focus this speech on how what the Prime Minister has done affects disabled people and families with disabled children. We are still in the middle of a public health crisis and inflation is now running at 5%, energy companies are failing, the cost of heating our homes is even higher and mortgage increases are likely. These things worry people in Scotland and the rest of the UK—I work hard for my constituents, and I challenge this Government on a daily basis to make their lives better—but none of this seems to concern this Prime Minister. What matters to him is money and protecting those who have it. There is yet another case going through the courts raised by two employment and support allowance claimants who are claiming that the Department for Work and Pensions acted unlawfully and discriminated against disabled people by not giving the uplift to those on legacy benefits. This sleazy UK Government, headed by a Prime Minister who does not understand how disabled people struggle to live, must look to the Scottish social security system, which is based on the principles of dignity, fairness and respect.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

Order.

--- Later in debate ---

[Marion Fellows]

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. May I ask the Member to withdraw the remark about the worst health record in the world? I want to save him from embarrassment in the press.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

I am sure the hon. Lady will understand that I am not responsible for what the hon. Gentleman says. I am sure—[Interruption.] Order. I am sure that if he feels he has said anything that is incorrect, he will want to correct the record.

Protecting Britain’s Steel Industry

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Monday 21st June 2021 Commons Chamber

[Marion Fellows]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. He actually did the next part of my speech, so I can move on and let more Back Benchers in.

It is quite hard to talk about global Britain when a UK foundation industry, such as steel, is being put to the wall by a Government who seem not only not to understand manufacturing but to think that it is okay to allow a foundation industry to try to compete with both hands tied behind its back. The UK Government said that they wanted to “take back control” from bureaucrats, but they are allowing the TRA, an unelected body, to make shattering decisions on the steel sector. This is a Government just like Thatcher’s Government, who closed Ravenscraig in my constituency. The UK Government have the power to protect steel jobs, but they are actively undermining steelworkers and the steel sector and risking jobs. Boris Johnson is finishing off Thatcher’s mission to destroy Scotland and the rest—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

The hon. Lady should not really refer to the Prime Minister by name; she should say “Prime Minister”.

[Marion Fellows]

I am sorry—the Prime Minister is finishing off Thatcher’s mission to destroy Scotland and the rest of the UK’s industrial base.

Contrast that with what the Scottish National party Scottish Government have done for steel in Scotland. The Scottish steel taskforce was set up at the same time as the UK taskforce, or a few months later, to save the Dalzell works and the Clydebridge plant. From day one, the focus was on making these plants productive again. The Lanarkshire steelworks had closed in 2015 and the Fort William smelter was poised to close before the Scottish Government interventions in 2016. The Scottish Government helped Liberty Steel to reopen Dalzell, and direct job numbers have recovered. In Lochaber, 165 direct jobs have been saved—not many, but in Lochaber, that is a huge number of jobs—and 44 new jobs were created by the GFG Alliance.

The Scottish Government and Scottish Enterprise supported Liberty’s acquisition of Dalzell and Clydebridge steelworks. Scottish Enterprise provided support through a £7 million commercial loan to Liberty Steel and the business has successfully re-entered the heavy steel plate market. Scottish Enterprise recognises the challenging environment for businesses in Scotland right now and the significant economic benefit that Liberty Steel brings in terms of jobs, the supply chain and the future safeguarding of Scotland’s steel industry. Scottish Enterprise is in discussion with Liberty Steel on repayment of the loan funding, and, of course, debt forbearance is not uncommon in the current market.

The GFG Alliance has said that its Scottish businesses are performing strongly and have access to sufficient resources for their current needs. There has been no call on the Government guarantee and the Government receive a fee from the business for providing the guarantee, and the guarantee is backed by security over its assets. In Scotland, there is political will to support the steel industry. Where is that will in the UK Government? It appears that this UK Government are happy to give a hand to their cronies, but are willing to allow steel, a foundation industry, to founder under unfair competition and high energy prices. There is a reluctance to help an industry that provides decent, well-paid jobs and that could supply steel for the green energy industry and infrastructure for recovery after this coronavirus pandemic.

Finally, will the Minister be added to the list of his predecessors who talked a good game, but refused to actually help the steel sector? Minister, we are waiting.

Business of the House

Debate between Marion Fellows and Baroness Winterton of Doncaster

Thursday 21st January 2021 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)]

Those are simply marvellous quotes, I am sure. I remind Back-Bench colleagues that we will have a ministerial statement before we get on to this afternoon’s Back-Bench business, so could they keep questions short and ask just one with perhaps not too many quotes? Equally, I ask the same of the responses.

[Marion Fellows (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) [V]]

A study by the consumer organisation Which? has warned that the use of cash, on which many rely, is in danger. Thirty per cent. of Scots reported being unable to pay with cash at least once when trying to buy something since March. Last year the UK Government vowed to bring forward legislation to protect the cash network. Natalie Ceeney, chairman of the Access to Cash Review, has warned:

“We are sleepwalking into a cashless society”,

and time is running out. Will the Leader of the House therefore agree to speak with his colleagues in relevant Departments and ensure that the promised Bill is introduced in the coming months?