Social Housing (Regulation) Bill [HL]

Debate between Lord Whitty and Baroness Thornhill

Committee stage
Tuesday 6th September 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Whitty (Lab)]

My Lords, I want to briefly record my support for the intent of all these amendments for both social and environmental reasons. The tenants of social landlords need to be prioritised by improving their energy efficiency, and hence cutting their bills. Because it is a significant proportion of our housing stock, to meet the net-zero pathway it is necessary for the social housing sector to make a step change in the improvement of its premises.

To achieve that, there are responsibilities on government, not least in pursuing the strategy that the speech and amendment from the noble Baroness, Lady Hayman, address, but there are wider responsibilities on government to create the overall policy and the legislative and regulatory framework to ensure that it is delivered. There are also responsibilities on social landlords, and that should be made explicit to them, but the Bill is primarily about the regulator. The regulator’s central duty ought to include energy-efficiency objectives. I regard that as an important missing dimension of the Bill. I would argue this in relation to almost any other legislation, in any field, that changes or introduces new regulation. We need a net-zero objective in our social and economic regulators’ responsibilities and terms of reference.

I have a couple of questions for the Minister. When pursued on energy-efficiency matters on the Energy Bill and in other contexts, her noble friend and colleague, the noble Lord, Lord Callanan, often says that part of the Government’s solution is to fund the programme of improving social housing. I find it difficult to say that that is sufficient. Does the Minister know what proportion of the totality of social housing premises, or whatever subset of that she has information on—large estates, in particular—has been addressed since the Government’s intention that social housing’s energy efficiency be improved, both by insulation and by the source of its energy, became clear? If she does not have that information today, perhaps her department and BEIS could provide me with an answer.

The second question is on planning, which clearly is within her department’s responsibility. Many social housing estates, mainly in the local authority but also in some housing association areas, are faced with major schemes of regeneration. Too often, in my view, local authorities and developers, when faced with demands or requests for regeneration, opt for demolition and rebuild. In almost all cases, demolition in each of its stages and the rebuild have a larger carbon content than most schemes of refurbishment. When will the planning process address this and ensure that it is a central issue for those planning authorities faced with propositions from social landlords?

[Baroness Thornhill (LD)]

My Lords, I will speak to Amendment 2 in my name and that of my noble friend Lady Pinnock. I wish also to echo from these Benches the support for the amendment in the name of the inspirational—I agree with that—noble Lord, Lord Best, on the same topic. The fundamental difference between the two amendments is simply that our amendment to Clause 1 would make it a fundamental objective of the Bill, while the noble Lord’s amendment seeks to ensure that the regulator has the powers to require housing associations to safeguard and promote the interests of the homeless and potentially homeless. Therefore, I am pleased to say that they work very well together.

We are seeking this simple amendment as a fundamental objective because, without it, there is a real danger that, as the Government quite rightly and understandably tighten the regulation of social housing as outlined in the Bill, social housing providers themselves, many of whom are fairly cash-strapped, will prioritise that which is being measured for fear of being named, shamed and fined. So they should, you might say, but it will have consequences for the homeless and those in temporary accommodation. This is a phenomenon that has been experienced with former council inspections and with Ofsted.

The fact that several housing associations have formed themselves into their own group, known as Homes for Cathy, shows that many take their homelessness prevention work seriously and strive to house people away from the streets, sofas and the overcrowded conditions that they might currently live in. Quite simply, we believe that this work is significant, valuable and essential, and therefore should be monitored by the regulator as part of a provider’s performance improvement plan.

During the pandemic, heroic efforts were made by government, councils, voluntary groups and housing providers to significantly reduce the numbers sleeping rough, which according to the 2022 government figures stand at an eight-year low. This is to be commended and is indeed good news, but we have to set it against the same set of annual figures that show that the numbers in temporary housing have been rising steadily since 2011. There are over 96,000 households in such accommodation as of September last year. Extremely worryingly, that figure includes over 121,000 children. We are all aware of the negative impacts this leads to, not only on a child’s education but on their general health and well-being.

Regrettably, I know from personal experience that the quality of that accommodation has deteriorated due to several factors, not least the inexorable decline in the number of social homes being built to move families on to; that is a debate for another day but a relevant factor. I will never forget the day that my head of housing came to see me urgently. Knowing that I was proud of our record of never having to use bed and breakfasts for homeless families, she was not looking forward to telling the mayor that that day we were placing families into a hotel for the very first time. Such were the pressures mounting on our housing stock. Now it is commonplace for councils to use bed and breakfasts, hotels and hostels—albeit the time for that is now limited by statute—before a move to temporary accommodation, which is when other problems begin.

Temporary accommodation, sad to say, is often inadequate—a room in a shared house that is overcrowded and in need of repairs or in poor condition. Critically, it can even be in another town, miles away from your workplace or children’s schools. It is not unusual for families to be in temporary accommodation for years. Shelter and the LGA have evidence of some families being housed in this way for a decade or more. That has to be unacceptable. Getting people off the street and out of temporary accommodation are two sides of the same coin. That should be an important function of all providers; we need it to be.

Business and Planning Bill

Debate between Lord Whitty and Baroness Thornhill

Committee stage & Committee: 1st sitting (Hansard) & Committee: 1st sitting (Hansard): House of Lords
Monday 13th July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Whitty (Lab) [V]]

I will also be brief. The Minister has successfully taken the wind out of our sails on this one. I look forward to what she will say at the end of the debate. This is strictly about off-sales. It is not an anti-pub move; it is a way of avoiding the kind of disorder that the police have experienced and many of us have seen on our screens. It is solely to do with off-sales beyond 11 pm; obviously the noble Lord, Lord Cormack, goes to bed slightly earlier than the rest of us. If the Minister comes up with an 11 pm cut-off, I will listen to the details, but I certainly do not want to detain the Committee any longer.

[Baroness Thornhill [V]]

I, too, have been asked to be brief. It is worth saying that obviously there are serious concerns about the cumulative impact of these issues where premises are gathered together. Certainly, from my experience of running a local authority with, at times, too lively and vibrant a nightlife, saturation must be looked at.

I am grateful that we had a good response on the timing but the overriding principle for me is that, in collaboration with operatives—often through good Pubwatch schemes and the local police—local authorities have come up with conditions to put on these licences. The Bill suspends those and throws them out the window, when they have been put on for good reason and through good collaboration. In principle, I feel that this is an unwelcome move.

My daughter was glassed in the face as a 27 year-old when out with her friends on a normal Saturday night. It can, and does, happen. If only that glass had been plastic. I still think that we have to have that debate on Report.

Amendment 45 in the name of my noble friend Lord Shipley is about the late night levy, which is a curious anomaly that he will expand on. I totally support any change that will allow a local authority to refund pubs for services that they have not received during lockdown while they have been obliged to pay this additional tax. I call my much-shortened remarks to a close.