BBC: World Service

Lord Triesman Excerpts

Tuesday 27th November 2012 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Bakewell]

My Lords—

[Lord Triesman]

My Lords, the decisions that were taken in 2005 about reducing the number of eastern European language broadcasts, largely because there had been a great development in the democratic media in many of those countries, released money for the Farsi language service and for the 24-hour Arab service. I am very familiar with the decisions taken at that time. Would the noble Baroness agree that the cutting of those services, to the extent that they are being cut—and we should be under no delusion: they are being cut back—is going in the opposite direction of identifying where there are problems and addressing them?

[Baroness Warsi]

The noble Lord may well be comforted by the fact that, despite these budget reductions in the current financial climate, the FCO has been able to maintain the World Service’s share of the overall FCO budget at, or at about, the level that it was in 2007-08.

Bahrain

Lord Triesman Excerpts

Wednesday 21st November 2012 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Warsi]

We have discussions at all levels in relation to this matter, including with the Prime Minister. The specific issue regarding the revocation of citizenship has been raised and our concerns have been registered. There is a right of appeal. We are pressing the Bahraini Government to consider these matters seriously during that right of appeal.

[Lord Triesman]

My Lords, I share the concerns expressed in the central proposition of the previous question. There has been progress but, on the most fundamental issues, the progress is woeful. It is against a background of a grim record and, if anything, Bahrain’s record is getting worse, rather than better. We have called for a dialogue but, for reasons that I understand, that dialogue has been limited. I noted that, at the end of October, the United States Navy Fifth Fleet was anchored off Bahrain, not because I think it intended to intervene but as a show of support. Can the Minister tell us whether a co-operating force of the United Kingdom and the United States—a diplomatic force, not a military one—might, if it took a sufficiently firm and determined view, have more impact than all of us trying to do it separately?

[Baroness Warsi]

That is something that I will take back. However, I can assure the noble Lord on our bilateral relationship. Earlier this week we set up a joint working group and political and diplomatic reform and assistance with human rights are central to it. We hope that we can use that working group as the basis for some of these more serious discussions.

Middle East: Gaza and Syria

Lord Triesman Excerpts

Tuesday 20th November 2012 Lords Chamber

[Lord Triesman]

My Lords, I thank the noble Minister for repeating the Statement made in another place. It is right that the Statement should include in its title the “Middle East peace process” and bridge a number of issues, although I wish later in my remarks to comment on whether there is such a process. However, allow me to start with Gaza.

This outbreak of hostilities is a tragedy for the entire region. If ever there were a day for calm minds, calm reflection and a self-denying ordnance on our part about blame focused on any one side, that is surely today. Today’s task is the achievement of a durable ceasefire and to thank and encourage the Egyptians for their efforts in arriving at that conclusion. All of us will feel the deepest dismay and abhor the acts of violence that are causing a loss of lives on a great scale, and we have witnessed this mounting calamity day by day. Since Operation Pillar of Defense began last Wednesday, as the Minister has reported to us, more than 100 Palestinians and three Israelis have died, mostly civilians.

It was in response to rocket attacks from Gaza that Israel launched its military response four years ago. The express goal of destroying the apparatus of terror, as they said at the time, left 13 Israelis and 1,400 or more Palestinians dead. Yet, despite that, over 1,000 rockets have been launched in the past year and, as we know, some of them can now reach Tel Aviv and the outskirts of Jerusalem. The certainty of a greater loss of life in any ground assault should make the objective of the international community and the United Kingdom the immediate cessation of violence and the urgent negotiation of a durable ceasefire.

We support the call by the United Kingdom Government for no extension of the conflict through a ground offensive. We welcome the decision of the Israeli Government not to launch such an offensive at this stage but we also urge that diplomacy is given a chance under Egyptian and United Nations stewardship, and urge all parties not to insist on any artificial deadlines. Experience shows that heightened tension, rather than a desire that propels people towards peace, tends to follow an artificial deadline when a viable negotiation is in play. The rocket attacks on southern Israel are wholly unacceptable. No Government, least of all the Government of this country, would tolerate the targeting of its citizens. The failure over many decades to achieve a two-state solution continues to lie at the heart of the problem.

I join the Minister and her noble friend the Foreign Secretary in saying that this cannot be resolved by military means—it requires a political solution. Do the Government have a view on the steps that they should take to advance the negotiations should a ceasefire be achieved—the ceasefire for which we all earnestly hope? What assistance will the Government give to the quartet and its envoy Mr Blair, who are plainly working hard in the region? Does the Minister agree that steps are imperative to assist the Palestinian Authority if it is to play any truly significant role? Would she agree that leaving Hamas in the key role without the full engagement of the Palestinian Authority would be an ill judged step in this circumstance?

Without a cessation of violence, the concept of the peace process is doomed, and a ceasefire is not the only urgent issue. Those who have seen civilians—men, women and many tiny and terrified kids—in the overstretched hospitals of Gaza will know that the hospitals already lacked many of the basic resources that they needed to treat their patients and they now face even greater burdens. What steps can Her Majesty’s Government take to ensure that medical and humanitarian personnel and the material resources that they require have unrestricted access to Gaza?

The inward flow of those resources is as vital as stopping the inward flow of arms, especially of Iranian rockets, a longstanding objective of the quartet. What discussions are we having with the Egyptians to intercept the rockets that detonated this current crisis? My right honourable friend Douglas Alexander in another place rightly said today of the peace process that there is no peace and there is no process. Mr Hague’s Statement sounds, if anything, a touch optimistic, despite the seriousness and the gravity which he has injected into it. I worry about the realism with which he talks of a peace process involving President Abbas when it is clear that President Abbas’s position is being weakened by the day.

We have called for a full United Nations diplomatic initiative and we welcome the engagement of Ban Ki-Moon in that. As a permanent member of the Security Council, what are the Government’s priorities in discussions with the United Nations? Does the Minister agree that outbursts of military action have never produced a lasting peace, whoever started the action, including those firing the rockets? Does the Minister agree that a key barrier to peace negotiations is the expansion of illegal settlements that undermine the prospects of a contiguous Palestinian state and set back almost any realistic prospects?

The Opposition believe that an enhanced status for the Palestinians should be discussed at the United Nations’ General Assembly and should be supported by the United Kingdom as an aid to negotiations. In the absence of peace negotiations, and because the process is paralysed, an initiative is urgent. It is hard to believe that the two-state proposition can survive the current impasse for very long. We believe that the Foreign Secretary does not have the balance right when considering the status of the Palestinians. What will our stance be on this issue at the General Assembly?

I turn to Syria, briefly but not with any implication that it is secondary. On the contrary, I have had the opportunity at this Dispatch Box to say how seriously I believe we should all take the crisis in Syria. I have said in your Lordships’ House that this murderous regime, venting unspeakable violence and terror on its citizens, is an affront to the entire civilised world, and all parties in the Security Council should long since have recognised that fact. It is clear that the different communities in Syria are ever more estranged and hostile to one another, and that the prospects of an agreed solution are becoming ever more remote. The likelihood of events intruding into other countries in what is already a febrile region becomes ever more likely and, for those reasons, continuously more dangerous to us all.

In our judgment, the Security Council has failed the United Nations and, perhaps even more significantly, it has failed the people of Syria. Some members have argued that all that this does is reflect the divisions in the Syrian opposition. However, we are now in new terrain that in my judgment the Russians cannot ignore. On 11 November in Doha, agreement was reached on the first vital steps to establish a new Syrian national coalition. These are early steps but they are very encouraging steps; I share that view with the Minister. The Labour Party has called on the Government to recognise the coalition, and for those reasons we strongly welcome today the announcement that they do so. That is a great encouragement.

If this coalition is to be a unifying force, what will Her Majesty’s Government do to ensure that it is well resourced with peaceful materiel? Will the Government say today that they will sustain the European arms embargo in order to make clear the distinction between peaceful materiel and non-peaceful materiel? I say, with genuine respect, that the £1 million worth of communications equipment is unlikely to do the job of sustaining the initiative; it is not the significant amount that is needed to do so.

Among the peaceful needs lies the need for humanitarian aid, as the noble Baroness has said in repeating the Statement. What proposals do the Government have to increase substantially the flow of that aid, which is now so desperately needed? What steps will the United Kingdom take in New York to encourage the Russians to shift from a candidly disastrous position? Even now, perhaps especially now, Russia could add its weight to diplomacy rather than to protecting Assad’s repression. What role do the Government believe NATO can play in this current crisis? It is quite right to emphasise Turkey’s security and, as a member of the alliance, Turkey will no doubt be focused on that. What are we adding to the argument?

I look forward to hearing from all sides of the House the same degree of concern about Syria that is often reserved for others in the region. It is a porous region with porous borders and levels of aggression that are, on occasion, enormous, not least as a result of the Syrian dictatorship, which poses massive risks to us. The detonator in this region could go off anywhere. Syria is a loose cannon. It is essential for us to deal with that fact as with any other if we are to see an overarching peace in the Middle East.

International Law: Use of Drones

Lord Triesman Excerpts

Tuesday 20th November 2012 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Warsi]

I am not sure what specific work is ongoing in relation to that, but I can write to the noble Lord to confirm. Of course this is a highly difficult issue; there are emotions and views on both sides of this argument. However, using unmanned air systems in Afghanistan provides vital intelligence for us in support of our forces on the ground.

[Lord Triesman]

My Lords, I wholly understand the Minister making the point that we have not used our armed drones in Pakistan or in many other settings. She plainly cannot be pressed for whether we believe it was legal or not because, on that basis, it is legal. Can she tell the House what will be the character of the evidence that we might give to the UN special rapporteur? Will it be made available to the House through the Library, so that we can get a full appreciation of the circumstances in which we use drones and make an assessment for ourselves?

[Baroness Warsi]

The noble Lord will be aware that there is an ongoing legal matter—a judicial review—in relation to some of the questions that he raises. In relation to the specific evidence and discussions that we will be having with the special rapporteur, I will certainly consider that and, if appropriate, report back to the House.

Nigeria: Violence

Lord Triesman Excerpts

Tuesday 13th November 2012 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Warsi]

I cannot answer the specific point in relation to the individuals that the right reverend Prelate refers to, but I can say that we are funding a huge amount of work through DfID on conflict resolution, and specifically trying to create the right forums for interfaith discussions, including “Enduring Peace in Jos: Arresting the Cycle of Violent Conflict”. We are also involved in a programme to train youth peace ambassadors from both the Christian and Muslim communities. We are providing £800,000 over three years for work towards creating spaces where the different communities can come together to discuss some of these matters. We have also established the Nigeria stability and reconciliation programme, which specifically aims to address the grievances that can lead to extremism and terrorism.

[Lord Triesman]

My Lords, north-south relations in Nigeria are often very complex and can seldom be accurately described in simplistic terms as merely religious or tribal divisions—as the Minister has said, problems arise on both sides. Boko Haram’s objective is plainly contrary to any kind of modern view of democracy, freedom of belief or social inclusion—or indeed to the objectives of the Harare principles. What role might the Commonwealth have in assisting Nigeria to develop as a modern and inclusive country? Should we not encourage a Commonwealth Secretariat assessment, since that will be seen to be far less colonial and far more inclusive in global terms?

[Baroness Warsi]

The noble Lord is right that the conflict in Nigeria, which spans many decades, has many facets to it, including a religious facet and many ethnic tensions. His is an interesting idea in relation to the Commonwealth’s role. He will be aware that we already have discussions with both the African Union and the European Union in relation to joint work, but it is a matter that I will take back.

Piracy

Lord Triesman Excerpts

Wednesday 24th October 2012 Lords Chamber

[Lord Triesman]

My Lords, I join the House in thanking the noble Lord, Lord Luce. I admire his long attention to the detail of this issue. I also thank other noble Lords who have taken part in the debate, as well as the committee of the noble Lord, Lord Teverson, which has added a great deal to our knowledge.

In the United Kingdom there has always been an interest in Somalia, not least because so many Somali citizens live here, and I used to find that many in the interim Government held dual citizenship. Indeed, the interim President, President Yusuf, who did not hold dual citizenship none the less declaimed frequently to me that he was partially British as he had a British liver. He told me that he was the longest-surviving transplant patient with a British liver and he held this country in great esteem.

Greater action has always been needed to address state failure, failure in the rule of law, failure in civil institutions and fratricidal clan warfare—the failures on dry land, as the noble Baroness, Lady Nicholson, described them, which lie behind the piracy. The instability both internally and internationally, in the Yemen and through the Horn of Africa all make us focus on this issue. It is quite right to say that the African Union has a vital role to play. I believe that it needs and deserves greater support in what it does. It has always had painfully small resources and it has always addressed the reality that military action is not the sole response. There needs to be a much wider palette of opportunities for response.

At present, as I understand it from the One Earth Future foundation’s analysis—there are probably other analyses—the annual headline cost of piracy is in the order of $6.6 billion. Just 1% of that amount is spent on building Somali anti-piracy capacity and on prosecution. Ban Ki-Moon’s special adviser on Somali piracy reported last year that just one in 10 captured pirates are brought to the point of prosecution. Convicted prisoners are held in a variety of countries, as we have heard, and many of those countries are themselves under considerable pressures, as is the Seychelles. I share the concern of the right reverend Prelate and the noble Lord, Lord Greenway, that many victims of piracy will feel that this is hardly an adequate response to some of the things that they come to suffer at the hands of the pirates.

I also know, and accept, that there have been advances, but, as the noble Lord, Lord Luce, said, the problems are still there. The advances are significant and they cover what my noble friend Lady Warwick described as 2.5 million square miles—something like 4 million square kilometres—of ocean. One good year—and it has been a good year—is not a guarantee of good years in the future. There is still a huge amount to be done, although the noble and gallant Lord, Lord Stirrup, has been absolutely right to celebrate the successes that there have been.

My feeling this evening as we debate this is that in the previous Government we sustained a naval and supply presence. That has now been cut, notwithstanding the priorities expressed by the Prime Minister. Those are matters that should concern us if we take the issue as seriously as the Prime Minister urges us to do. Therefore, what aid have Her Majesty’s Government provided and will they provide to create sustainable economic opportunities in Somalia? What careful and pragmatic analysis has been made of trade opportunities that would assist? What arrangements have been made with Somaliland, Puntland and their neighbours in Kenya and Ethiopia to assist in dealing with many of the problems? My question includes Ethiopia because of the outstanding assistance that was consistently provided by the late Prime Minister, Meles Zenawi, whenever he was asked to enlist his help, particularly with clan factions.

Should not the United Kingdom, as chair of Working Group 1 of the CGPCS, deploy its frigate more frequently, and preferably permanently? The noble and learned Lord, Lord Howe, and others described that help as being a very interesting EU naval role and one that could well be better co-ordinated with NATO assistance, and I am sure that that is true as well. What future role does the Minister see the Navy playing?

Can the Minister also tell us what pressure has been brought to bear for internationally agreed standards for accredited private security companies? Those standards have been promised for a long time. How close are we to agreement on them? When will the United Kingdom ratify the 2005 protocols concerning acts of terrorism at sea and the enforcement powers that are sought to deal with it? Before the Minister tells me, perhaps I may say that I readily accept that we did not do so in the latter part of the Government in which I served; I am merely eager to know what progress there is now.

What are the Government doing to assist the Seychelles on the imprisonment problems it plainly has and which are stretching its resources to breaking point? What progress is being made on the new maritime intelligence co-ordination centre in that nation—another issue raised by the noble Lord, Lord Hannay, earlier?

Will we contribute to the Dutch-German joint investigation team which has been tasked with pursuing what they have described in their terminology as the “kingpins and financiers”, the “money launderers”? It is obviously not whatever the maritime and piracy equivalent is of the term “foot-soldiers”. Those are pursued, but not many are brought to trial. What about the people who organise them, finance them, and benefit from them?

Finally, what is our contribution to assist the new Somali president to build the authority of his Government, his courts and civil institutions? We have here a permanent presidency. It will succeed or fail on the basis of the tangible support that it receives, and the expertise that we are prepared to deploy.

I accept that not one of these issues is easy, but they are all essential to progress, both on land and on the water.

Arms Trade Treaty Negotiations

Lord Triesman Excerpts

Tuesday 24th July 2012 Lords Chamber

[Lord Howell of Guildford]

My Lords, I have said that we are not going to sign a weak consensus. I know that the noble Lord, who is very versed in and a master of these negotiations, would not expect me to make statements about our negotiating position at this crucial stage. I repeat that a weak consensus or a feeble abandonment is not what is contemplated.

[Lord Triesman]

My Lords, we, too, wish the negotiators well, but I think the noble Lord will understand why we are apprehensive. On 13 July, the BIS Select Committee in the other place concluded that the Government seem to have adopted a different policy from that of the previous Administration and appear to be ready to weaken the arms trade treaty in order to placate the arms exporting countries, looking for what would emerge as a lowest common denominator approach. That apprehension is shared in New York. Any discussion with colleagues there will show that. They are deeply concerned that we did not sign the strong text of support calling for a strong treaty, already signed by 74 countries, and that we should consider showing that intent and good will now. Will the Government do so?

[Lord Howell of Guildford]

I think that that apprehension is ill founded. Ambassador Moritan, who chairs the process, obviously has had to manoeuvre. We have to be realistic that there are sceptics and that there are countries which, from the start, have been outright opponents of anything other than broad political agreements. We have to accept that. Our determination is not to be deviated from the pattern which was reflected under the noble Lord’s own Government, and I repeat that we are determined not to sign a weak consensus but to go for a robust treaty. That remains our position.

Syria

Lord Triesman Excerpts

Tuesday 3rd July 2012 Lords Chamber

[Lord Howell of Guildford]

Regrettably, I can confirm that the Russians are continuing to supply attack helicopters and equipment to the Syrian regime, which of course is a regime of unparalleled violence that is using its equipment in the most evil and oppressive ways. I am afraid that I cannot give any confirmation as to what weapons actually shot down the Turkish fighter. The Syrians have offered to hold an inquiry with Turkey, but that is being resisted for the moment. It is a very serious matter and the Turks are arguing that it is an attack on NATO as a whole. I am afraid that the circumstances are all in dispute and I cannot confirm the first part of what my noble friend said.

[Lord Triesman]

My Lords, I think the House will understand the concern in the Question of the noble Lord, Lord Wright, and indeed in parts of the Answer; there will be general support for the arms embargo and a desire not to see any increased volatility. However, alongside the concern about the spread of armed conflict, it is wholly understandable that people should seek to defend themselves from a barbaric and murderous regime, and that is another key part of this equation. If we are to sound sincere—and not sanctimonious—what do Her Majesty’s Government believe can be done to assist those people who may have an ambition to acquire munitions, if they are to feel that there is any other hope of achieving at least a degree of safety as the regime tries to kill them?

[Lord Howell of Guildford]

I share the sentiment behind the noble Lord’s views. He asked what can be done. My right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary has made very clear indeed what can be done, both at the ministerial action group over the weekend in Geneva and at previous meetings, and will continue to make that clear: namely, that we want to find a basis on which we can bring forward a robust resolution by the UN Security Council that has the support of all those, including the Russians and the Chinese, who hitherto have not been ready to display the robust action and condemnation of violence and terror that we would like to see. We would like to see the text for that resolution worked on this week—in fact, we are pressing that it should be so—but there is the obvious obstacle, of which the noble Lord will be aware with his experience, that not all members of the P5 are in agreement.

Iran: Capital Punishment

Lord Triesman Excerpts

Thursday 24th May 2012 Lords Chamber

[Lord Howell of Guildford]

The answer to the first part of the noble Lord’s question is almost continuously. However, we are constrained by the fact that our diplomatic relations with Iran are now at a very low level. As he knows, there are no ambassadors between the two countries because our embassy was attacked and had to be evacuated. So far we have not got any agreement from Tehran to our request for a protecting power to look after our interests and maintain contacts. However, that does not stop us almost continuously working with the UN special rapporteur to keep this kind of horror on the UN agenda and to keep up the international pressure in every way that we can.

[Lord Triesman]

My Lords, I recognise that it is difficult to exert direct pressure on and have a conversation with a country with which we no longer have, for understandable reasons, diplomatic relations. I welcome the Minister’s mention of the European Union sanctions. I wonder whether, in any of the discussions, the list of things being provided by the European Union to the Iranians, alongside all the issues about the development of their nuclear capability, has been included and whether there has been any response from the Iranian Government on those items. If there has not been, would it be a moment to perhaps urge the European Union to make the discussion more comprehensive?

[Lord Howell of Guildford]

The discussions with Iran are going on continuously at this moment in Baghdad. They have not yet stopped; they were due to do so yesterday but the Iranian team, as I understand it, is still in Baghdad this morning. Those discussions are, of course, focused on Iran’s nuclear programme and its weaponisation ambitions, but behind them is the obvious point that the EU sanctions—and particularly the oil embargo—clearly concern the Iranians. They keep raising the issue, which is a good sign that they are worried. As to the other items to which the noble Lord referred, these will come in at the right opportunity. I cannot assure him at the moment on everything that he referred to—I am not sure whether his full list is included—but he can be sure that, within the present climate of trying to get Tehran to make some sensible concessions and to comply with the IAEA, these issues will all come up.

Democratic Republic of Congo

Lord Triesman Excerpts

Tuesday 15th May 2012 Lords Chamber

[Lord Howell of Guildford]

The noble Lord is on to an excellent cause and a very good concern. Our view is that the PROMINES programme, which now will be launched in October and for which we have high hopes, will raise the standards and control better all activities of mining, including artisanal mining of the sort which employs children. That programme includes explicit activities to address the issues of child labour, including supporting initiatives to enable the artisanal mining subsector to comply with supply chain diligence standards which are increasingly being applied—for instance, in connection with the OECD due diligence guidance. We see the PROMINES programme as the avenue through which to increase the pressures and to overcome the appalling deprivations and dangers which are evident particularly for children in this sector.

[Lord Triesman]

My Lords, I accept of course that there are a number of transparency conventions in Europe and on a world basis, some of which have been useful in dealing with topics such as the illicit mining of diamonds in the past. Given the difficulties that have just been described, particularly in relation to children and the lack of transparency in supply chains, would there not be a good case for company reports in the United Kingdom to be candid and be required to say how transparency issues have been dealt with so that the legitimacy of their operations would be clear to everyone?

[Lord Howell of Guildford]

Yes, that is exactly the kind of proposal that Clare Short, as chair of the EITI, is examining in her strategic working group. Of course, not every company and certainly not every country has signed up to the EITI. Those that have are required to make certain reports, although those reports do not cover all the issues we are discussing now. Her idea, and that of the EITI, is to see whether the requirements for standards for signatories to the EITI can be increased and, obviously, for other countries—and the DRC being a candidate country—to sign up to the whole initiative.