Financial Services and Markets Bill [HL]

Debate between Lord Stockwood and Lord Mackinlay of Richborough

Committee stage
Monday 6th July 2026 Grand Committee

[Lord Stockwood (Lab)]

My Lords, Amendment 142B would require the FCA to ensure that financial institutions that are registered or regulated by the FCA facilitate the payment of inheritance tax by executors before probate is obtained through the direct payment scheme.

I appreciate that the purpose of this amendment is to make it easier for estates to pay inheritance tax. I am sorry to hear of the issues that the noble Lord, Lord Mackinlay, has had with the current system and I am very happy to take that up with HMRC to explore why M&G Prudential is not a member of the current scheme.

I can assure your Lordships from the research for this question that HMRC internal analysis suggests that most taxpaying estates are already able to fund at least a first instalment of inheritance tax before applying for probate. The direct payment scheme allows executors to ask banks, building societies or investment account providers to pay some or all of the inheritance tax due from the deceased person’s accounts. The scheme works well in its current voluntary form and provides an important mechanism to help executors pay any tax that is due.

We need to be very careful here. Releasing funds from a deceased person’s estate before probate is granted carries risk for financial institutions. Those institutions need to ensure that those payments can be made lawfully. The current system enables financial institutions to assess whether it is appropriate to make payments directly to HMRC on a case-by-case basis, ensuring that institutions make payment only if satisfied that the personal representative is indeed acting on behalf of the deceased’s estate and that they are releasing those funds correctly. FCA rules cannot put this issue aside as it is a matter of the wider law. Financial institutions would need to ensure that making these payments is appropriate whatever the FCA rules say. This would leave financial institutions on an uncertain legal footing.

I understand the spirit of this amendment but I do not agree that it is the right solution, and the existing voluntary scheme is working well on the whole. But I will definitely pass on the point the noble Lord raised about HMRC and will come back to him on that. I therefore ask the noble Lord to withdraw the amendment.

[Lord Mackinlay of Richborough (Con)]

I listened carefully to what the Minister had to say; I thought he was on a good track for a while but he finished rather poorly.

I am grateful for the very sensible words from my noble friend Lady Neville-Rolfe, who understood the situation completely and absolutely, and for the comments of the noble Baroness, Lady Kramer. If people actually listen to what happens in this Committee—I am sure the audience is fairly skinny—I will give a word of advice to them that is exactly on the tack of the comments of the noble Baroness, Lady Kramer. It is not a problem of a multitude of nationalities that might exist. I recommend to anybody who is getting a little older to make their affairs that little bit simpler, so that, once they depart, they are easier to unwind.

I will give your Lordships a very easy example—this is aimed at the point made by the noble Baroness, Lady Kramer. If one holds shares that are denominated in, say, Jersey—it is not uncommon, and there are listed shares on our stock exchange that are headquartered in an overseas territory, which is quite typically Jersey—one would then need to go through the whole probate procedure just for those Jersey-registered assets. There would be cost and aggravation, and my advice is to sell them.

I do not really have a criticism of HMRC, and I am sorry if my speech came across with any criticism. There are two systems. There are relevant assets, which are typically property that cannot be easily realisable into cash to pay IHT. The system has accepted that for many years, and one can pay the tax due on those types of not easily realisable assets such as property or land over 10 instalments over 10 years ahead. But the 7.75% interest applies, so most executors—I am particularly thinking about the beneficiary—would like to clear the inheritance tax as quickly as they possibly can, because 7.75% is not a good deal in terms of an interest payment. That has been flexed for the BPR/APR assets that come in next year, of £2.5 million each, where the 10-year instalment plan will be interest-free. But the point is that the 7.75% interest rate makes it essential that people try to pay.

I do not accept the Minister’s observation that there is risk for the financial institution. In my experience over many years, I have found that 99% of institutions are happy to take that very small degree of risk, because the money will be residing in HMRC’s bank account, which is a safe place for money to reside. The risk is not just small but extremely small. If things have gone wrong, you just ask for it back, or somebody will, from HMRC. Given the speed of operation of HMRC, it might take quite some time to get the money back, but at least it is somewhere safe. So I do not accept the risk, because it is somewhere where there is no risk. It is unfortunate that this has fallen in a family issue, but M&G Prudential is the only institution that I have ever come across that simply says no.

Can the Minister go back to his officials and consider it further? I would be very pleased to meet him or his officials for blue-sky thinking about this. We have Report ahead of us. I am happy to withdraw my amendment.