Value Added Tax: Listed Places of Worship

Debate between Lord Sassoon and Lord Bishop of Bath and Wells

Tuesday 24th April 2012 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sassoon]

My Lords, I confirm that there are indeed transitional arrangements in place for approved alterations to listed buildings, which cover contracts in place before Budget day. Contracts in place on that day will retain the zero rate if the work is performed by 20 March 2013. Our consultation paper specifically asks for comments on whether the transitional period is sufficient. We will of course listen to any reasonable comments about these transitional arrangements and will consider whether any more generous arrangements could be implemented.

[The Lord Bishop of Bath and Wells]

My Lords, of the 563 churches in my diocese, 503 are listed—some 89 per cent. Their upkeep relies almost entirely on voluntary fundraising and support from their congregations. In promoting the big society, many wish to open those buildings to wider community use. What incentive does the Minister believe is being created for congregations to do so by making them pay VAT up front only to claim it back through a scheme that is not adequately funded? Would not a simpler and real incentive for local churches to improve their buildings be to retain the current exemption on VAT?

[Lord Sassoon]

The right reverend Prelate raises some important points. I can give him only partial comfort, or the answer that he wants, in respect of some of his question. First, as I have already explained, we intend to make sure that the compensation number fully reflects the additional costs of the Budget change. The element that troubles us most is that under the previous VAT arrangements the incentivisation worked in favour of alterations of listed buildings as opposed to repair and maintenance. We do not want to see anything that incentivises people against repairing and maintaining and therefore preserving the core heritage features of the property, so we think that it is right to put alterations, repairs and maintenance on an even basis. Therefore, although I cannot give the right reverend Prelate the comfort that we intend to revisit that issue, I stress again that we want to make sure that the churches are fully protected against the impact of the Budget change.

Government: Savings

Debate between Lord Sassoon and Lord Bishop of Bath and Wells

Thursday 24th June 2010 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sassoon]

My Lords, while there are those six Permanent Secretaries in addition to the Permanent Secretaries in each department, we have over 600,000 civil servants in total. The main question is how we reduce the total number of civil servants, which increased by 28,000 under the previous Government.

[The Lord Bishop of Bath and Wells]

My Lords, while recognising the need for child protection and health and safety matters, will the Minister also recognise that at present over 4 million volunteers are being lost to the system due to what one might describe as overzealousness in these areas? Can serious attempts be made to focus on what is absolutely essential in these matters, rather than on that which seems to be ongoingly pervasive?

[Lord Sassoon]

I thank the right reverend Prelate for that question. I would stress that by having a target of a one-third reduction in administration costs, which we hope to exceed, we will be able to target the expenditure on where it really matters, including in the ways that he has described.