Nutrition (Amendment etc.) (EU Exit) Regulations 2019

Lord Rennard Excerpts

Thursday 21st March 2019 Lords Chamber

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I congratulate the Minister on bringing forward what will obviously be needed as we approach a situation in which no deal might be more likely. I have a number of questions.

My noble friend’s department has used the right language in this statutory instrument, but I am concerned that that language is not being reflected in, for example, the discussions on the Trade Bill that we had yesterday. On food safety, our honourable friend the Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Health and Social Care, Steve Brine, talked in the other place about retaining high standards and protections for the consumer, and safeguarding public health, as my noble friend did. Can the Minister use her good offices to make sure that all departments are using the same language?

It used to be that, according to the original Article 36 of the treaty of Rome—noble Lords will forgive me, but I cannot remember which article it now is—we could ban a nutrient or any ingredient that was deemed by the European Union to be unsafe on the grounds of public safety. I am at a loss as to why parliamentary draftsmen for one Bill—the Trade Bill—do not accept that the tried and tested, recognised language used by the Department of Health and Social Care and the Department of Environment, Food and Rural Affairs should not be used by the Department for International Trade. If the Minister could make that point throughout, that would be extremely helpful.

Is the Minister able to tell the House this afternoon when the appointments to the committee are likely to be made, and when it is likely to be set up?

On the current exclusion for infant and follow-on formula, I understand that the department will issue further advice on that “once the EU exit position is clarified”. That could take a while. As our honourable friend Steve Brine said in Committee next door:

“The Department will issue further advice on that once the EU exit position is clarified, which is clearly yet to happen”.—[Official Report, Commons, Thirteenth Delegated Legislation Committee, 28/2/19; col. 10.]


I am pleased to see that he has a sense of humour.

What will the position be on sharing with us decisions taken by the EFSA panel—and indeed on access to the food alert system, which will presumably apply to nutrients as well—and the sharing of information and decisions made by the panels which will be set up in this country? I remember going to Denmark when one of the few things that used to be cheaper there was vitamin C. You could buy two or three tubes of it in one go across the counter, until it was put on the proscribed list, which is regularly updated—I had not realised that you could overdose on vitamins C and D, and so on. Many other medicinal products regularly used by women of a certain age were also limited in scope as well. It seems good practice to share the decisions that are taken in the UK by the various panels, and to continue to share information and ask EFSA to let us know what its conclusions are. Presumably, we will wish to rely on the widest possible available scientific evidence.

With those few questions, I welcome this statutory instrument. Clearly, it will be helpful to know when the committee will be appointed and set up, the position on infant and follow-on formula, and the position on best practice. However, my main concern is that all departments should be using this language, not other language that is much less transparent and even opaque.

[Lord Rennard (LD)]

My Lords, people are right to be concerned about food safety and nutrition issues, the integrity of some of the claims that are made and the effects of substances which are permitted for use as supplements for various purposes. People who are presently satisfied by the standards set by the European Food Safety Authority have legitimate concerns about future regulatory approaches and potential changes to them.

The draft nutrition regulations in this SI may provide some temporary reassurance for consumers and businesses using these products, but, as indicated by the Minister a few minutes ago, they do not provide any sort of long-term reassurance about what may happen in future. As she said, regulations in the UK and the EU will be identical on departure day—whenever that might be—but they will inevitably divert in future when different people in different bodies come to different conclusions. Can she therefore indicate what the issues will be when a UK body begins to make different regulations to those determined by the European body?

Can the Minister indicate what additional costs there may be in the long run from setting up new bodies to replace EU regulations with UK ones? Perhaps she can tell us what have been the recruitment costs for the new bodies and what will be the ongoing costs of running them. Before June 2016, many people were led to believe that they would be freed from sharing the cost of things like the European Food Safety Authority. However, what will be the costs of establishing and running these bodies, in particular the new UK Nutrition and Health Claims Committee?

We are told that the processes to be undertaken will be similar to present ones at EU-wide level, but presumably businesses seeking to sell products such as nutritional supplements across the UK and the EU will in future need the approval of both EU and UK authorities. Will this not mean that the burdens and costs of regulation for us outside the EU will be increased, rather than reduced as many people were led to believe? The extra costs and burdens of duplicating UK and EU approval processes will surely hinder future research and innovation.

Most fundamentally, will the Minister confirm that leaving the EU on a no-deal basis would mean that we deny ourselves and the rest of the EU the benefits of sharing costs and expertise on these issues across the UK and the EU?

[Baroness Manzoor]

My Lords, as always, I take this opportunity to thank all noble Lords for their constructive and valuable insights. I shall endeavour to do my best to answer the questions raised by the noble Baroness, Lady Thornton, my noble friend Lady McIntosh and the noble Lord, Lord Rennard.

I entirely agree with the noble Baroness, Lady Thornton, and am very grateful for her comments. The UK currently benefits from world-leading standards in both the safety and quality of its nutrition regulation and, as I said, we will be closely mirroring the existing regulatory framework. I reassure noble Lords, especially my noble friend Lady McIntosh, that this statutory instrument will ensure that we maintain those high standards if the UK leaves the EU with no deal.

I am also pleased to hear that the department’s presentations are clear, because it is very important that what we are saying in this area is communicated effectively and with understanding. I appreciate my noble friend’s comments.

I say again that this SI ensures a functioning regulatory system for this aspect of nutrition legislation. In response to the noble Baroness, Lady Thornton, it will ensure minimum disruption to businesses, consumers and the public. We are fully prepared. The UK has a long tradition of close scientific collaboration with EFSA, which we of course greatly value. I say to my noble friend Lady McIntosh that we will endeavour to continue to work as closely as we possibly can with EFSA. However, the SI ensures that in the event that the relevant functions of EFSA can no longer be accessed, the UK is fully prepared to exercise them.

I reassure all stakeholders and noble Lords that it is our policy intention to mirror the existing regulation as closely as possible. The noble Lord, Lord Rennard, asked about the future. I understand and appreciate that, and it is a legitimate issue to raise—the noble Baroness, Lady Thornton, also raised it—but this is an exit SI: if there is no deal, it will come into play. Everything is open for negotiation once we leave the EU. I cannot guess what may or may not happen in future; all I can say is that, currently, we will mirror current regulation as far as we possibly can and continue to work with the EU on the rapid alert system that my noble friend Lady McIntosh mentioned. If and when we leave the EU, the EU rapid alert system includes a duty of care to inform third countries, so that information will continue to be shared.

On the impact on businesses, I do not want to say to the noble Baroness, Lady Thornton, that there will be no impact. We appreciate that there may be some additional administrative burdens on companies which have to submit claims to both the UK and the EU authorities if they want to claim in both areas, but we intend that procedures for submitting claims in the UK will closely follow those already in place in the EU. We estimate that the application paperwork should take nominal time—approximately 30 minutes—to complete. I say to the noble Lord, Lord Rennard, that costs are not expected to be significant.