Strathclyde Review

Debate between Lord Morgan and Baroness Evans of Bowes Park

Thursday 17th November 2016 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Evans of Bowes Park]

Again, I will look at the points that the noble Lord has raised.

[Lord Morgan (Lab)]

My Lords, briefly, I agree with all the rightful praise that the Government have received. I particularly appreciate the comments of my chairman, the noble Lord, Lord Lang, who is chairman of the Constitution Committee—we are very fortunate to have him—that there has been abuse of the procedure for delegated legislation. However, the reason for my standing up is that I think there has been abuse at a more fundamental level. The noble Lord, Lord McNally, observed that the House of Lords should preserve the right to say no, but there are different ways of saying no. One way, in effect, of saying no is not to be allowed to speak, and I feel that the understanding of financial privilege has been incorrect and confused for many years. We had that with many important measures such as that on welfare reform, and I heard the noble Lord across the Chamber—a former Clerk of the House of Commons—taking the same view. The view that we have taken of financial privilege has been very broad and vague, and not in accordance with what Mr Asquith said in passing the Parliament Act 1911. As long as the House of Lords is restricted in a way that I regard as incorrect and unhistorical, we will continue to have problems.

[Baroness Evans of Bowes Park]

I will reflect on the noble Lord’s comments. However, I end by saying that this discussion and debate has shown that we work best when we work together.