Northern Ireland (Welfare Reform) Bill

Lord McAvoy Excerpts

Tuesday 24th November 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord McAvoy (Lab)]

My Lords, first, I pay tribute to the Minister, who has carried quite a heavy burden tonight. Quite a few of us have been here for the same length of time, but not carrying the same burden. He has stuck to his guns, sometimes even under pressure from the Privy Council Bench—on his own side, not from this side. I also pay tribute to all our colleagues from Northern Ireland who have spoken. To be here at this time of night shows their commitment to what they have been saying and to Northern Ireland, which is commendable and appreciated by all of us.

I will try to curtail my remarks out of—I will not admit to compassion; that would ruin my reputation—some consideration for our colleagues who have been here all night. We will not be opposing the Bill this evening. As I have said before, we fully support the need for this and the Government bringing it forward. The noble Lord, Lord Alderdice, said quite rightly that it is not a new situation to be dealing with legislation such as this. We have been here before and we recognise the necessity of it.

It is important to acknowledge how difficult it has been in Northern Ireland over the past few months because it is in that context that we are debating this piece of legislation. It has appeared at times throughout the year, culminating in the past 11 weeks, that the talks were going nowhere. I understand the despair that people were feeling. As the noble and right reverend Lord, Lord Eames, said, it is to the huge disappointment of all of us that collectively we have not managed to do anything about the legacy of the past. Notwithstanding that failure to come to a conclusion on how to deal with the past, the noble Lord, Lord Hay of Ballyore, very generously mentioned all those involved in coming to this agreement, including the Irish Government and Members of Parliament, and that is also appreciated.

It has been said before that without an agreement there was the real risk of the collapse of devolution or indeed the return to direct rule, either of which would have been unthinkable. However, that has been avoided and that is why we believe that this agreement is significant and why we are lending our justified support to the Government. As part of the agreement, a consent Motion was agreed by the Northern Ireland Assembly to allow us to legislate for welfare reform at Westminster—a measure designed to ensure that the reform can take place as soon as possible without further financial penalties to allow stability to return and normal government arrangements to proceed.

It is never ideal when Parliament is asked to agree fast-tracked legislation—that has been made clear on all sides of the House—but it can be necessary. In this case in particular, expediting this legislation is the right thing to do. The agreement reached has also allowed other very significant measures, aside from welfare reform, to be adopted and other money released for the benefit of the people of Northern Ireland. This includes additional funding to the PSNI to combat the continuing terrorist threat; money and increased efforts to tackle paramilitarism and cross-border crime; and funds for community initiatives such as bringing down the peace walls.

The Bill will enable the Secretary of State to reform the welfare system. We still disagree with much of the present Government’s welfare reform and will continue to speak out against it. However, we accept that the agreement allows Northern Ireland certain welcome exemptions and the ability to mitigate the impact of these cuts. This certainly demonstrates that the Government’s welfare cuts, and indeed their austerity programme in general, are as much a problem for Northern Ireland as they are for any other part of the UK.

As the noble Lord, Lord Glentoran, mentioned, this agreement ensures stability and means the Northern Ireland budget can function properly, but of course we believe, as the noble Lord believes, that jobs, growth, prosperity et cetera represent a better way to manage the economy than cuts. Crucially, what is needed alongside any welfare reform is a focus on a programme for jobs and growth. The Government must now engage in rigorous work with the Northern Ireland Executive and Northern Ireland businesses to give such a programme greater urgency. Reforming welfare is about more than cutting benefits, it is about training, skills, opportunity, and tackling low aspiration and educational underachievement. That has to be recognised, and new programmes are needed.

I turn very briefly to the specifics of the Bill. If the Minister does not have the information to hand, I am more than happy to accept a letter. First, can he clarify the timetable and process for the Orders in Council which will follow this paving legislation? Secondly, what scope is there for consultation with respect to these orders? In the Assembly, the Minister for Social Development talked of agreement in principle to introduce the changes to the welfare system in Northern Ireland at Westminster. Does this mean amendment is possible? Thirdly, can the Minister detail which welfare parts of the Welfare Reform and Work Bill this legislative process actually covers? Finally, this legislation falls at the end of 2016—will the Minister confirm why this date was chosen?

We will not be opposing this legislation as we are of the view that the dangers of an agreement not being reached were huge, with potential restoration of direct rule. This has been averted. Northern Ireland political institutions are stabilised, notwithstanding the continuing debate, so let us ensure that the UK Government work with the Irish Government and all the parties and that we continue to support the building of not only a peaceful Northern Ireland but one of prosperity, fairness and opportunity for all.

It is appropriate to finish by echoing some of the tributes that have been paid to Peter Robinson for his service to Northern Ireland. I have mentioned previously that Peter and I were on the Northern Ireland Select Committee together, and we became and are good friends. He has travelled a long and at times rocky road, and became absolutely essential to the peace that we have in Northern Ireland at the moment.