Northern Ireland (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill

Debate between Lord Maginnis of Drumglass and Earl Attlee

Tuesday 4th March 2014 Lords Chamber

[Lord Maginnis of Drumglass]

I get the impression that the noble Baroness is coming to the end of her response. She has clarified the issue about the soldiers involved in the 1972 incident in Londonderry, and I understand that answer. However, I still fail to understand the issue of the 187 letters because she was not clear on that. She said that they are not letters of comfort because the people concerned can be further investigated. When I asked her whether she had knowledge of the police investigating any of those 187 cases, she talked vaguely about the Historical Enquiries Team. Therefore, I extend the question: are any of the 187 people currently being investigated by the HET? I hope by now that she has some knowledge of this.

[Earl Attlee (Con)]

My Lords, the House has been extremely flexible about what we have discussed. We are really supposed to be discussing Amendment 1 and whether or not we should adopt it. My noble friend the Minister has answered quite a few questions and we ought to let her wind up this debate and move on.

[Baroness Randerson]

I will, however, answer the noble Lord’s question. I am not speaking of specific numbers because that is also for the inquiry, but the issue is this: letters were sent following inquiries from a number of people. Those who received a letter that said “There are no known issues against you” were therefore free, if they wished, to return without fear of prosecution. Not everyone who made an inquiry received a letter of that nature. Does that make it clear to the noble Lord? By implication, therefore, there were ongoing inquiries in many cases. That is an important fact that reveals the nature of the exercise; there were and are ongoing inquiries in many cases.

Patrick Finucane

Debate between Lord Maginnis of Drumglass and Earl Attlee

Wednesday 12th October 2011 Lords Chamber

[Lord Maginnis of Drumglass]

My Lords, I want to make it very clear first that I condemn every killing that occurred in Northern Ireland and I spent 12 years of my life ensuring that both loyalist and republican killers were brought to justice. That is my justification for saying that, while I thank the Minister for bringing the Statement here, I totally disagree with and resent the term “collusion”. Can you imagine what it is like to live 24/7 in a situation where people are being murdered, and people are talking about this in cars, in homes, in pubs, in clubs and in the workplace because they are struggling to survive the violence that we had to endure. If that is collusion, then collusion took place, but my experience over all those years, working with police and the regular Army and in command of members of the Ulster Defence Regiment, was that there was no organised collusion, and I resent that term deeply.

Let me further say that there are so many victims, and victims who are close to me: Harold Sinnamon, the brother of my assistant teacher in the school where I was principal; the Dobson brothers, whom I went to school with, two people who were not involved with anything, shot in their business office; George Shaw, who contributed to his community, who took me to my first scout camp; Eric Shields, whom I worked and played rugby with and who was not a member of my party but of the Alliance Party; all these people. Was there collusion there? Are they even considered?

In finality, I was sued by the Finucane family for saying that they were an IRA family. That is what they were, an IRA family. They sued me. When they were forced by the courts to put up or shut up, they withdrew their case against me and paid my costs. Why did that happen? Let us look at the whole picture with 40, 30 or 20 years of hindsight, at what those of us who lived through the Troubles had to endure, and see whether it is prejudiced.

[Earl Attlee]

My Lords, once more I try to remind the House of the benefits of a short question and that also, on behalf of the House, I have a very long memory.

Counterterrorism Review

Debate between Lord Maginnis of Drumglass and Earl Attlee

Wednesday 26th January 2011 Lords Chamber

[Lord Maginnis of Drumglass]

My Lords, can I thank—

[Earl Attlee]

My Lords, we have not yet had a Conservative Back-Bench question.

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Maginnis of Drumglass]

My Lords, can I thank the Minister—

[Earl Attlee]

My Lords, if we are quick we can get one more round in. I suggest Cross Bench, Liberal Democrat, Labour.

[Lord Blair of Boughton]

My Lords—

[Lord Maginnis of Drumglass]

My Lords, I suggest to the Minister—

[Earl Attlee]

My Lords, I suggest that we hear from the former Commissioner of the Metropolitan Police.