Oil and Gas: UK Continental Shelf

Debate between Lord Lawson of Blaby and Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth

Tuesday 9th February 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Lord will be aware that the Government have given high priority to ensuring that the recommendations of the Wood report are taken through into law. That is now happening through the Energy Bill, as the noble Lord is aware, so I think that indicates our clear commitment. He is absolutely right; this is a global problem but we are doing what we can domestically to ensure that the UK industry has all the support necessary.

[Lord Lawson of Blaby (Con)]

My Lords, as I well recall from my time as Energy Secretary, the North Sea oil and gas has had a glorious past. However, is it not clear that its future can be only a shadow of what it has been, and that the future of our indigenous oil and gas industry must lie in the exploitation of our shale resources, which are quite substantial? Will my noble friend undertake to go ahead with that as fast as he possibly can?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, I am very much aware that my noble friend has a very distinguished record as a former Energy Secretary. However, I do not think it is true to say that the oil industry is entering a period where its significance is diminished. It is perhaps not what it was, but it is still of enormous importance. The two oil fields to which I referred will be able, when at maximum production, to supply energy to 2 million homes. However, he is absolutely right about the importance of shale and the Government are determined to go ahead with exploration for it.

Paris Climate Change Conference

Debate between Lord Lawson of Blaby and Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth

Tuesday 15th December 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Baroness is quite right about the importance of the small islands in the Pacific and elsewhere, such as the Seychelles and the Maldives. It was brought home graphically to me when I met representatives from Tuvalu in the House of Lords during the summer. They said that two degrees was not going to be enough to save them from total obliteration. Although there is a measure of self-interest, it is to the credit of the world that there was a sense of international responsibility for these issues when they came up in Paris.

On the investment issues which the noble Baroness rightly raised, £122 billion is spent annually in the UK on the low carbon economy. It is of extreme and growing significance and we are well aware of it. I repeat that this global agreement has been much welcomed. It gives certainty and sense of direction worldwide, not just in the UK. We have significant investments in the UK which have taken heart from the Government’s decision. An example is Siemens in relation to offshore wind. The point is well made that economic leaders need certainty. I would not disagree with that and it will, obviously, inform our policy.

[Lord Lawson of Blaby (Con)]

My Lords, the problem is that the Statement that my noble friend read out bears only the most tenuous relationship to what is actually happening in the real world. Is he not aware, for example, that back in the real world India has just announced plans to double its coal production by 2020? Is he not aware that in the real world, more than 2,500 coal-fired power stations are under construction, particularly in India and China but elsewhere around the world? Whether he wants to see decarbonisation or not, does he agree that, bearing in mind the effect on fuel prices, which affect fuel poverty and the competitiveness of British industry—one thinks of the recent closures in the steel industry in this country—it makes no sense whatever for us to decarbonise faster than the rest of the world?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, I am very well aware of the massive deployment of coal. That is one reason why the world needed to come together to see how it will address that issue. It is also true to say that in both India and China there is massive deployment of renewables. I think that the deployment of solar is about to overtake coal in India, so I recognise the issue. That is why we need to address it. I hope the noble Lord agrees that we do need to address it; I was not sure whether that was the inference of his question. I understand the particular problems with steel, for example, that he mentioned, but this issue is not related simply to energy but also to overproduction. I also recognise that every country has to protect its own patch and its own interests. As I said, there is an element of self-interest in different countries coming to this agreement in different ways, but there is a real sense of international responsibility and a real sense that if we had not acted in the way we did in Paris, we would face very serious problems in the future. There are still challenges but this was a very important milestone, and a very important milestone for the United Kingdom in the role it played.

Renewable Energy

Debate between Lord Lawson of Blaby and Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth

Wednesday 24th June 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, it is fair to say that there is a decline in the cost of renewable generation technologies. The steepest decline is in solar PV. On my noble friend’s point about the fact that the last leader of the Opposition, Ed Miliband, had a policy on energy that was not in the interests of the country, I am pleased to say that one of the first actions of the new Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change was to write to the energy companies to say that we look forward to seeing a reduction in bills consequent on the fact that the last leader of the Opposition is not now Prime Minister.

[Lord Lawson of Blaby (Con)]

My Lords, by what date do the Government expect renewables to be cost-competitive so that hard-working families and businesses will no longer have to subsidise wealthy landlords and other green investors?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, it is not merely a question of cost. If it were the case that renewables were the cheapest form of electricity, we would not face the same challenge on climate change that we do. As I indicated, it is true that the cost of renewables is coming down. Meanwhile, it is the policy of the Government to focus on energy that is affordable, secure and clean.

Electricity Supply: Decarbonisation

Debate between Lord Lawson of Blaby and Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth

Monday 15th June 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for that welcome; I am sure it will be the start of a beautiful friendship, to revisit “Casablanca”. We anticipate that by 2025, unabated coal will account for only 1% of total generation. In relation to Hinkley B, which he also mentioned, the answer is 2023.

[Lord Lawson of Blaby (Con)]

My Lords, I echo the welcome from the noble Lord, Lord Whitty, from this side of the House. In his reply the Minister referred to the Climate Change Act, which unilaterally imposes limits on carbon emissions for the United Kingdom. I am well aware that the Government wish to secure a legally binding global agreement on emission limitations at the United Nations Paris conference at the end of this year but, should that not prove possible, will he undertake to look seriously at abandoning or at least suspending our commitments? Unilateral masochism can make no sense whatever.

European Council

Debate between Lord Lawson of Blaby and Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth

Monday 23rd March 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Lawson of Blaby (Con)]

My Lords—

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth (Con)]

My Lords, I think that it is this side and then back to the Opposition.

[Lord Lawson of Blaby]

My Lords, I quite agree with the Statement where it says that a disorderly Greek exit from the eurozone is in nobody’s interest. Clearly, it is an orderly exit that is desirable. However, I should like to revert to what my noble friend Lord Howell said about energy policy. This is very important. Is my noble friend the Leader of the House aware that over the past few years a great battle has been going on between the Commission, which wishes energy policy to be a European Union competence, and the United Kingdom, supported by Poland in particular, which says that energy policy and mix should be a national competence? So far that has prevailed. Can she give an undertaking that that is the policy of the Conservative Party as there has been a certain amount of party politics, however deplorable, in these exchanges so far? Can she give a firm undertaking that it is the policy of the Conservative Party that energy policy will remain a national and not a European Union competence?

International Development (Official Development Assistance Target) Bill

Debate between Lord Lawson of Blaby and Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth

Friday 27th February 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Lawson of Blaby]

If my noble friend will allow me—

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth (Con)]

Perhaps I could say that, after the Minister has spoken, only short questions of elucidation to the Minister are permitted on Report.