Financial Exclusion

Debate between Lord Holmes of Richmond and Lord Bates

Wednesday 4th July 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bates]

I accept what the noble Lord says, but one of the points about the ground-breaking nature of the framework agreement with post offices on banking services is that 99% of personal financial services can now be transacted at the post office. That is helping to keep post offices open as an important part of the community. Some 95% of banking services can be provided by post offices as well. However, although this is a ground-breaking development, we are keeping it under review.

[Lord Holmes of Richmond (Con)]

My Lords, does my noble friend agree that, while in no sense contradicting what the noble Baroness has said, there is a key role for fintech to play in addressing financial inclusion? Will the Government look at all the opportunities arising in fintech and consider promoting them to all vulnerable consumers?

[Lord Bates]

Again, as another member of the ad hoc Financial Exclusion Committee, my noble friend initiated an important debate on the digital economy. We do believe that fintech, in which the UK is a leading force in the world, can be a powerful way of introducing significant change in this area for the benefit of those who need it.

Financial Inclusion: New Technology

Debate between Lord Holmes of Richmond and Lord Bates

Thursday 6th July 2017 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Department for International Development (Lord Bates) (Con)]

My Lords, I join other noble Lords in paying tribute not only to the address of my noble friend Lord Holmes and to his securing this timely debate but to the productivity and passion that he brings to the topic.

Normally, we have a set speech and then we come to some of the questions raised in the debate, and invariably we run out of time. Therefore, perhaps I may go straight to some of the questions and then come to some of the set remarks that I have before me.

I will start with the Financial Exclusion Select Committee. Its report was widely acknowledged as a very thorough, detailed and comprehensive look at this area. It is a classic example of the use of the ad hoc tool within your Lordships’ House to produce a really worthwhile and stimulating report. Its timing was not necessarily perfect in the sense that it was published on 25 March, just ahead of the announcement of the general election, and therefore there was a slight hiatus during the period of purdah that followed. However, as the noble Lord, Lord Stevenson, mentioned, it contained 22 substantial recommendations, which are being taken very seriously. They are the subject of discussion across Whitehall and we will respond to them very shortly. Perhaps we might have a debate on them when the response has been published, but it seems to me that the report will be an essential piece of work.

This debate also comes immediately after the Financial Guidance and Claims Bill had its Second Reading in your Lordships’ House. The noble Lord, Lord Kirkwood, served on the Financial Exclusion Committee, along with my noble friend Lord Holmes, and he also spoke in yesterday’s Second Reading debate, which I read. A number of points have been raised in this debate which I will feed back to my noble friend Lady Buscombe, who is the lead Minister on the Bill, to see whether we can move forward.

We were blessed with two brief interventions, from my noble friends Lady Stedman-Scott and Lady Stowell. They focused on young people and the financial inclusion initiatives. One of the great advantages of responding to the debate is that I was able to look up on my smartphone the Government’s digital strategy to see whether it mentions young people. I was relieved to find that, even in the executive summary, there are a number of mentions of young people, with digital skills being placed alongside numeracy and literacy as key skills that people need for the future.

On my noble friend Lady Stowell’s point, the Government introduced financial education to the secondary school curriculum in England in 2014. It is for the devolved Administrations to talk about what is happening there. However, we can follow through on some additional elements of the efforts to include young people, because I share my noble friend Lady Stedman-Scott’s view that this has the potential to be a real leveller, as young people have great aptitude already in this technology. The E in PHSE stands for economics, and when it is well taught it increasingly involves fintech. We hope that that will be a key element, and we welcome that the issue was raised.

The noble Lord, Lord Kirkwood, asked about Verify being developed with the Cabinet Office. We are working with the Cabinet Office on this, but identity in financial services can be tough to crack. However, we look forward to following up on that.

The noble Lord, Lord Stevenson, referred to the G20 high-level principles. It is worth noting for my noble friends Lady Stowell and Lady Stedman-Scott that principle 6 refers to the strengthening of digital and financial literacy. The noble Lord, Lord Kirkwood, referred to my two hats, one of which is from DfID. One area in the G20 that we are following very closely is that of remittances. Remittances are a major part of economic development, amounting to around $420 billion per year—twice as much as overseas development assistance. Yet the cost of remitting money back to countries can vary between 3% and 17%. There is a great deal that we can help with there. The Government’s position on the G20 high-level priorities is that they are working closely with the Global Partnership for Financial Inclusion, or GPFI, which supports the implementation of the high-level principles on financial inclusion.

I go back now to some of the points raised by the noble Lord, Lord Holmes. He asked about the FCA’s role, and I was pleased that he recognised it as an excellent and innovative regulator in this area. Its role in financial inclusion was raised by the Select Committee report and the Government will respond to that. As for the single financial guidance body, it will provide information and guidance, and help people manage their finances.

The noble Lord, Lord Kirkwood, asked whether the Government should amend the Financial Services and Markets Act 2000 to create a requirement on the FCA to set out a reasonable duty of care for financial services providers to exercise towards their customers. Issues of duty of care are for financial services providers, as a requirement of the FCA. The Government will respond to this recommendation as soon as possible. In the FCA’s mission document, published in April, and in its response to the Lords’ Select Committee on Financial Exclusion report, sent to the noble Baroness, Lady Tyler of Enfield, in June, it committed to publishing a discussion paper to explore the duty of care further.

The noble Lord, Lord Holmes, asked about the DWP proof of concept, and he is right to say that this received positive feedback. It is examining this issue and will conduct further work before taking a decision on pushing these ideas forward.

I turn now to some of the key messages that we are seeking to get across in this debate about our position at the moment. As I have said, the Government will publish their response to the Select Committee’s report shortly. The pace of change—which was referred to I think as “innovative and disruptive” by the noble Lord, Lord Holmes—in this sector is frenetic. We are witnessing the emergence of a new wave of general purpose technology: big data, analytics, machine learning, peer-to-peer lending—that term probably needs to be qualified in your Lordships’ House—networks and distributed ledger technology, each of which can bring potentially far-reaching changes for people traditionally excluded from financial services.

We should think, for example, how much online budgeting tools can help to give people unprecedented control over their finances—empowerment, as the noble Lord, Lord Holmes, said. Indeed, the Department for Work and Pensions is exploring ways to give tenants more control over their spending via smartphones. This could include not actually paying rent monthly. If it is digital, why not pay it daily or weekly, which is sometimes easier to manage? The Government believe strongly that a flourishing fintech sector will lead to further innovations that will help reduce financial exclusion across the UK. It is worth noting that the development of fintech is not limited to London. There are strong fintech centres in Leeds, Manchester and Edinburgh, and across the UK.

In terms of how we will approach this, we suggest three pillars. First, we will create the most welcoming regulatory environment in the world for fintech, without compromising financial stability or consumer protection. The Financial Conduct Authority’s Project Innovate, which has been referred to in the debate, is recognised around the world as a gold standard in this field. Secondly, we will ensure that the legislative and regulatory framework is fit for purpose as new fintech products and services emerge. The Government are taking action. We have overhauled the regulatory and tax regimes to accommodate new peer-to-peer lending models and we are taking steps to ensure that customers have the option to share their financial data with fintechs safely and efficiently. Finally, we are promoting UK fintech at home and abroad. We have created fintech bridges with Singapore, China and Hong Kong. In April the Chancellor and the Governor of the Bank of England hosted the inaugural international fintech conference.

Several studies have ranked the UK as a leading global hub for fintech development and the Government are committed to building on this to make sure that UK fintech goes from strength to strength. However, this debate is specifically about how to use the UK’s success in fintech as a lever towards financial inclusion and capability. I can point to some early successes. The FCA has led the way globally. It has provided direct support and access to its sandbox to a number of firms focusing on social inclusion, such as Oval, an app that helps users build up savings by putting aside small amounts of money every week.

Beyond the regulatory sphere, the Government are also acting directly to stimulate exploration of potential fintech support for financial inclusion and capability. In March of this year, the Government’s digital strategy announced that we would launch a competition, to be run by Tech City UK, to encourage digital approaches to support financial inclusion. There is a clear need to ensure that we reduce the number of those who do not have any kind of account—the so-called “unbanked”. A financially inclusive society is one that allows its citizens to manage their money more effectively, securely and confidently. For their part, the Government aim to boost inclusion and ensure the widest possible free access to basic bank accounts.

I have some additional data which noble Lords may be interested to receive. In the first half of 2016 alone, nearly 500,000 basic accounts were opened in the UK. There are just under 8 million basic bank accounts open now in the UK, and 4.1 million basic accounts were completely fee-free at the end of 2016.

I move to my conclusion. The Government have two separate objectives. We are creating the conditions for fintech to flourish in the UK in general, but we are also taking specific action to ensure that these technologies are harnessed to tackle the problem of financial exclusion. These twin strategies will help us in the mission we all share of equipping everyone in our society, young and old, with the financial tools they need to live the lives they want. I finish by thanking once again the noble Lord, Lord Holmes, for introducing this debate and all those who have contributed so well to it.

[Lord Holmes of Richmond]

My Lords, I thank all noble Lords who contributed to the debate, not least my noble friend the Minister. It seems harsh to pull him up on one tiny detail, but I feel I must. He said that the timing of the publication date of the report from the ad hoc Financial Exclusion Select Committee was not perfect. The timing was perfect; perhaps the timing of the general election was less so. For different reasons, everybody around the House might share that sentiment.

We have a phenomenal opportunity in this country if we get fintech and financial inclusion right. We will not just have a world-leading, world-beating fintech sector, but through the financial inclusion that that will deliver we will address perhaps one of the most pernicious, iniquitous elements of our society: that all too often those on benefits and those who have the least find themselves having to pay the most, not least for the most essential utilities. If we can address that, it would be a profoundly positive element—one of many that can come from the excellent connection between fintech and financial inclusion. I thank again all noble Lords who participated.