Northern Ireland (Ministers, Elections and Petitions of Concern) Bill

Lord Hay of Ballyore Excerpts

2nd reading
Monday 29th November 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hay of Ballyore (DUP)]

My Lords, I join other noble Lords in welcoming the Minister to the Dispatch Box. I have no doubt his experience working in the Northern Ireland Office will have prepared him well for his brief here. I wish him well in his new role.

I broadly support the Bill before us. It reflects what was agreed in New Decade, New Approach, where there was agreement on a wide range of issues. While there may be disagreement regarding some aspects of that agreement, the Bill presents an opportunity for us to strengthen the legislative framework—to make the institutions in Northern Ireland more workable and more stable. Equally, it is the case that the Northern Ireland Assembly is the place for discussion and debate of issues that relate directly to the daily lives of people in Northern Ireland.

If we are to continue to move forward in Northern Ireland, we must continue to try to do so with some form of consensus. We must not repeat some of the mistakes of the past, where decisions were rushed through without much local scrutiny. We must not adopt a half-in, half-out version of the devolved settlement, whereby this Parliament is seen to be changing agreements, passing new legislation or bypassing the sitting Northern Ireland Assembly altogether. Such an approach would lead only to mistrust, discontent and disillusionment and, in the longer term, would only undermine devolution in Northern Ireland.

The noble Lord, Lord Dodds, spoke about the petition of concern in Northern Ireland. As a former Speaker of the Northern Ireland Assembly, I can tell your Lordships that I saw that petition used by all the political parties in Northern Ireland. You would think from some party leaders now in Northern Ireland that they never used the petition of concern; it was only one or two parties. That certainly was not the case while I was Speaker of the Northern Ireland Assembly. It is true that in some instances this mechanism was not used properly, nor as it was originally intended, but it would also be true to say that in many instances it was used purely because on some key issues cross-party consensus could not be found.

The Northern Ireland Assembly and the institutions of government, certainly since St Andrews, were built on the idea of consensus. It would also be true to say that there is certainly room for improvement in respect of this. As the noble Lord, Lord Browne, said, we must remember that the parties of government in Northern Ireland are different not just constitutionally speaking but in that they come from across the political spectrum, from left and right. Any manner of coalition government with parties so different will always be very challenging.

The only way of moving forward and progressing is by getting round the table and finding consensus. The answer is not found by legislating for one party’s wish list, nor by bypassing the Northern Ireland Assembly altogether. The issue we have in Northern Ireland is that we have a party that does not believe in consensus but also believes that if it comes here, it will get what it wants anyway. That is the problem when we try to get consensus in Northern Ireland: we have a party that does not need to reach consensus because it gets what it wants here anyway.

I assure noble Lords that, where an opportunity presents itself to improve the scheme in a fair, balanced and appropriate way, we should take it. Where an opportunity presents itself to improve the quality of debate and discussion in a devolved setting, we should seek to take it. We want a devolved institution that works for all the people of Northern Ireland. We want a Stormont that offers good government to all the people of Northern Ireland.

The current situation, brought about by the Northern Ireland protocol arrangements, is, as ever, deeply regrettable. The protocol continues to damage Northern Ireland economically and constitutionally; I stress “constitutionally” although it has had a serious effect economically as well. The barrier to trade between parts of our United Kingdom damages internal business, lacks cross-community support and fundamentally undermines the core principles that underpin the democratic structures in Northern Ireland. We hold our discussions about changes to our institutions at a time when the future of those same institutions has been threatened by the ramifications of this flawed arrangement.

Only by fully restoring the integrity of the United Kingdom internal market will the political, economic and social stability of Northern Ireland be safeguarded. I say this to the House: do not underestimate the strong feeling that there is in the entire unionist community on the Northern Ireland protocol. We would be fools to try to write that situation off because there is strong unionist opposition to what is going on in Northern Ireland. If the EU insists on imposing a border in the Irish Sea, the Government must fulfil their commitments to protect Northern Ireland and its people. Triggering Article 16 is only a start, and needs to remain a real option. The people of Northern Ireland rightly expect the Government to act decisively on this. Does the Minister agree that the time has now come for decisive action to end the current uncertainty around the Northern Ireland protocol?

[Baroness Hoey (Non-Afl)]

My Lords—oh, sorry, I did not see the noble Lord there.

Northern Ireland Executive Formation

Lord Hay of Ballyore Excerpts

Thursday 16th January 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Duncan of Springbank]

The noble Lord is right to remind us that the RHI scandal has been a challenge for all in Northern Ireland, not least those affected by it financially. The agreement brokered with the five parties recognised that issues were brought to the fore as the inquiry unfolded regarding the working of government and the responsibility and role of special advisers and the Civil Service. Within the agreement that has been reached is a strong view that this needs to be reconsidered and examined in a way that provides a proper structure to ensure that such a situation never happens again. I believe the report of the RHI inquiry will be published soon, but that is a matter for the Northern Ireland Executive—it is quite nice to be able to say that for the first time in a very long time. As to the other questions raised by the noble Lord, he has raised them in the past, and I understand why, but at this moment I will comment on them no further.

[Lord Hay of Ballyore (DUP)]

My Lords, like other noble Lords I welcome the Statement. The Minister has come to this House on a number of occasions with negativity on Northern Ireland. This is a very positive Statement, and I and my party see it as a new beginning for Northern Ireland. After three years we now have a working Assembly and in particular an Executive made up of the five main parties in Northern Ireland. We have Ministers elected by the people of Northern Ireland and accountable to them, which is vital.

Yes, this Executive will face many challenges; there are huge challenges out there, but I have no doubt that they will face them with good will, whether in health, education, economic development or investment. I have no doubt whatever that they will do what they can to represent all the people of Northern Ireland. This Executive can show a lead to the people of Northern Ireland on how both communities in every community can live in peace and harmony. That is what this Executive need to be about.

I welcome the funding coming with the package. I know there may be some questions as to whether it is new money or from the Barnett formula or whatever, but it must be welcome. I also welcome, at long last, the £45 million of capital ring-fenced for the medical school in my own city of Londonderry. This has been ongoing for some time and I welcome it very much. I know that many, if not all, of the politicians in this city will welcome what has been achieved. I pay tribute to the Minister, his officials and the people who were at the coalface of getting this agreement over the line; after several weeks, several hours and several days, we got there. This whole House and the other place should welcome this agreement in moving Northern Ireland forward.

[Lord Duncan of Springbank]

The noble Lord is right that this agreement can move Northern Ireland forward. The important thing to recognise is that, because of the absence of an Executive, it has slipped back. In moving it forward we are just trying to bring it into parity with the other nations in the United Kingdom. That is important to emphasise. A journey now has to be taken, and it will not be achieved quickly or in a single step. I am pleased to be able to welcome the £45 million for the city of Derry/Londonderry, given the number of times I have not been able to talk about it because I was never able to make that clear. Now I can make it very clear indeed. I also personally pay tribute to the officials in the Northern Ireland Office. I know how much they care, how hard they worked on this and how much they have helped me as I have tried to deliver on these issues as well. I hope now that this deal does what it says on the tin and makes us move into the new decade in the right way.

Northern Ireland (Executive Formation etc) Act 2019: Section 3(5)

Lord Hay of Ballyore Excerpts

Tuesday 7th January 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hay of Ballyore (DUP)]

My Lords, I am sure that all political parties in this House want to see the devolved institutions restored in Northern Ireland. Let us all hope that an accommodation can be reached to restore the institutions in the next number of days. However, whatever accommodation is reached, it must be fair and balanced. It cannot be a situation where one party takes all.

Three years from the collapse of the previous Executive, people have a right to be angry and frustrated at the absence of an Executive in Northern Ireland. As my noble friend Lord McCrea has indicated, we have only to look at our health service, which is in a critical mess. We have health workers—thousands of them—coming out on to the streets because of the whole issue around the imbalance of pay between Northern Ireland and the rest of the United Kingdom. Our education system is suffering greatly. We have only to speak to our educationalists across Northern Ireland, to speak to many of our principals and schools and colleges, to learn that all their budgets are in the red by thousands and thousands of pounds. It is so bad in education that schools cannot afford even to buy toilet rolls. They expect the parents of children at these colleges and schools to pay some money towards resources. This just cannot continue.

There needs to be a resolution, but not specifically around education, health, economic development, inward investment or job creation; all areas are suffering from the lack of an Assembly. One area where there is severe suffering is mental health provision. More people have died since the Troubles through suicide than died during the Troubles. That figure is a dramatic but true representation of what is happening to mental health in Northern Ireland. We urgently need more investment in mental health. Northern Ireland has a much higher need than the average across the United Kingdom and the need is certainly growing.

The noble Lord, Lord Adonis, touched on higher education in my own city of Londonderry. He has visited Northern Ireland on several occasions and has visited the city as well. I know that he has met nearly every political party in the city. Unfortunately, however, he has not met the largest unionist party in the city. When he comes to the city again, we as a party would be keen to meet him and talk to him about the future of higher education in the city. He is right: this issue goes back well over 50 or 60 years. There is a long drawn-out debate about whether the university should have been in the city or in Coleraine. Coleraine built the university; the city did not. But it would be wrong to say that the city does not have a university. The city of Londonderry does have a university. All right, there is a cap on the students that can go there, but for any viable university there is a huge economic off-spin for the city.

We have the whole issue around the medical school in the city. Once again I am told by reliable sources that this cannot move forward without ministerial approval. The business case is done. It is sitting there and ready to go. A lot of work has been done through the two universities, Queen’s and the university in Londonderry, but nothing can move without a Minister. It is important that the Minister clarifies that position again.

I believe there is a notion across Northern Ireland that with the Assembly up and running all the ills in Northern Ireland will be solved. That will not be the case, but it would certainly help if we had local Ministers in charge taking local decisions on behalf of the people of Northern Ireland. Let us hope that these talks are successful as we move forward over the next couple of days.