Animal Welfare (Non-stun Slaughter)

Debate between Lord Harrington of Watford and Lee Scott

Monday 23rd February 2015 Westminster Hall

[Richard Harrington (Watford) (Con)]

I congratulate my right hon. Friend the Member for South East Cambridgeshire (Sir James Paice) on his speech, which was moving and hugely well informed. I also congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Kettering (Mr Hollobone) on his part in this debate.

I am afraid that I do not have such experience or erudition to add to the debate, but I will make one or two points. I am Jewish. I was not brought up to eat kosher meat, and I am not agricultural. I have visited slaughterhouses on two occasions, which I will mention in a minute. I make these comments entirely because of what I have learned from speaking to my constituents—both those who are religious and those who simply follow the traditions—after debates on the subject in this House.

Perhaps I should mention that I have received a petition from nearly 2,000 members of the Muslim community in Watford, suitably supported by members of the Jewish community, who were rather fewer in number because there are rather fewer Jewish people in Watford than Muslims. It came about as a result of comments by the new president of the British Veterinary Association that appeared in The Times.

I took the petition to the Prime Minister, who seemed clear on the Government’s view, although of course the Minister will say what he has to say. The Prime Minister said that he was “delighted to support” my campaign in Watford, and that he was

“very happy to confirm that while I am Prime Minister of this country”,

both halal and kosher killing are

“safe in Britain”.

That is a clear view from the Government. If I may speak for the Opposition—I have never had the arrogance to do so before, but I think that I am right in saying this—I imagine their official view to be much the same.

I have visited two abattoirs in my life, one using conventional slaughter and the other religious slaughter. I did not visit them as a Member of Parliament, and again, I cannot compare my visits and level of observation to those of my right hon. Friend the Member for South East Cambridgeshire. I must say that I did not see a material difference between the death of the animal in the conventional abattoir, which was stunned, and the religious slaughter, which was done without stunning. I can say without discrimination that I was absolutely put off eating meat for some time by both of them—I am not a vegetarian, but I could see an argument for it —but I cannot and would not say that I noticed any material difference in the suffering of the animals in either case.

Given that it is one of our great beliefs in this country that people’s religious traditions and views should be upheld, and that the issue is important to religious Muslims and religious Jewish people, I believe that it is the Government’s job to stipulate standards of cleanliness and to deal with other more modern issues. As the hon. Member for Birmingham, Ladywood (Shabana Mahmood) mentioned, religious texts can be interpreted in a modern way, which I am sure must include modern versions of safety and cleanliness, but I cannot accept that in today’s society, religious traditions held with such belief by people in this country could be declared illegal by the Government. I will do everything in my power, modest though that power may be, to reject anything of the sort.

[Mr Lee Scott (Ilford North) (Con)]

I totally agree with my hon. Friend that people’s freedom to practise religion, and to eat meat produced as they feel it should be produced, is vital. Does he agree that this is really a matter of protecting animals? A bad abattoir is a bad abattoir, whatever process it might carry out. That is what we should stamp out: bad abattoirs, not the method by which the animals are slaughtered.

British Retail

Debate between Lord Harrington of Watford and Lee Scott

Wednesday 6th March 2013 Westminster Hall

[Richard Harrington (Watford) (Con)]

It is a pleasure to introduce this debate under your chairmanship, Sir Alan.

I chose to call a debate on retail for two purposes. From a parochial point of view, retail is a significant employer in Watford and a significant contributor to the economy. Also, the press that retail receives nationally, with glamorous Sky reporters standing in front of shops such as Blockbuster and HMV that are shutting down, gives a false impression of the sector’s overall prosperity and contribution to the economy.

Members of Parliament and the public at large should realise that retail is a big sector of the economy, and contributes in excess of 5% of GDP. Although the Government are trying to encourage growth in the manufacturing sector, the retail sector contributes more added value to the economy.

Retail is able to offer increasingly sophisticated employment. The old impression that people work in shops because they cannot do anything else is no longer relevant. Retail jobs are highly trained, and there are many apprentices. Many people, including me, started their business career in the retail sector. Following my law degree, I was a graduate trainee at John Lewis, which gave me ideas for developing my life both in business and more generally. It all went well until I became interested in politics.

Retail contributes employment and taxation not only through pay-as-you-earn and corporation tax but through business rates. The sector is a big contributor to urban regeneration. People do not think of retail as a factor in urban regeneration, but they only have to look at places such as Westfield on the Olympic site. When I went to work in Watford’s Harlequin centre, which is now known as Intu, in 1980, it was the poorest part of town, notwithstanding the efforts of John Lewis and other old retailers that had been there for 50 years, 100 years or more. The Harlequin centre was certainly not the sort of place people would want to go unless they had to go shopping.

[Mr Lee Scott (Ilford North) (Con)]

I congratulate my hon. Friend on securing the debate. Does he agree that the vibrancy of high streets that are under pressure from some of the multiples is also down to niche independents? Allowing niche independents to thrive and grow is vital.

[Richard Harrington]

My hon. Friend makes a good point, and I would expect nothing less. Independents are very much part of the story, and they are necessary, but large companies developing real estate and operating shops create massive employment, massive taxation and a massive contribution to urban regeneration, although that takes nothing from the validity of my hon. Friend’s point.

Things have changed. Everyone knows that in the past, apart from the high street, most towns had parades of shops. The developers of the masses of residential areas across London and the home counties from the time trains opened up those places would, for every few hundred houses, build a parade of shops that included a fruiterer, a greengrocer, a fishmonger, a general grocer and so on. Various things in the cycle, certainly in my lifetime, have kept those parades going.

I remember when the supermarkets started to take hold and some of those shops became empty and were replaced by banks, which were opening chains of local branches. It is hard to imagine now, but there was a big fight for which bank could get there first. Then there were estate agents. Again, if there was a spare unit, people would open an estate agency. There always seemed to be something, but that is not the case now.

With the internet there is less demand for individual units. There is plenty of supply, because, in many cases, the units were built before the second world war, if not before the first world war.

Property Market

Debate between Lord Harrington of Watford and Lee Scott

Tuesday 25th January 2011 Westminster Hall

[Richard Harrington (Watford) (Con)]

I have an interest to declare, which is in my entry in the Register of Members’ Financial Interests, because I have for many years been a director of a company involved in, among other things, the development of housing, although I have no active involvement in the company. I thank Mr Speaker for selecting my debate; it is much appreciated.

Housing is on the mind of most Members of Parliament, as much of our correspondence relates to it. I am pleased to see the Minister for Housing and Local Government here; I am sure that he will, as a Watford grammar school boy and former Watford resident—he has gone on to greater things and places—find some of the points I shall make very relevant to that place.

Housing has the attention of the media, and a recent article in The Guardian, following an interview with the Minister, was headed “Minister pledges an end to the housing price rollercoaster”, which I was pleased to read. However, for people who are struggling to get on the first rung of the ladder, things have never been more difficult. In my constituency in 1996, the average price of a house was more than £73,000. By last year, notwithstanding some reductions in prices, it had reached £234,000. It is easy to see how difficult the situation is for first-time buyers whose average age, calculated locally, has risen to 37 years old. I was delighted that it was announced in the comprehensive spending review that the Government will increase housing supply

“by reforming the planning system so it is more efficient, effective and supportive of economic development.”

I am delighted that the Government have recognised the problem and are committed to tackling it.

It is fashionable to place the blame for the current situation on the recession and the banks, but I believe that for many years, from before the recession, there has been a consistent structural problem—a fundamental demand for housing which greatly outstrips the supply. Only an increase in supply will meet demand, tackle the problem effectively and create greater opportunities for first-time buyers.

[Mr Lee Scott (Ilford North) (Con)]

I congratulate my hon. Friend on obtaining the debate. Does he agree that while the blame does not rest totally with banks, they are making things increasingly difficult for first-time buyers and, indeed, for other people who want to move home?

[Richard Harrington]

That is correct, and a valid intervention, which I intend to discuss briefly.

The demand side of the equation is clear. Short-term economic factors may have reduced it, but the fundamentals are as bullish as ever. The south-east, according to all the research that I have seen, is expected to continue the population growth trend, and despite all the incentives that the Government may provide for a change in regional preferences I think that the trend is unstoppable. Without going into too much detail, the factors include migration, the social trend towards more households following divorces, the population getting older and the great predilection for living in small households. Above all, I do not think that anyone can say that the demand side will change much.

My hon. Friend the Member for Ilford North (Mr Scott) mentioned lending. At the moment, one of the biggest obstacles is the decline in lending. The figures show that the contraction in UK mortgage lending since 2007 has been the most severe on record. In 2008 and 2009, about 500,000 loans were granted for house purchase. That is a lower figure than for any year since 1974.