Business and Planning Bill

Debate between Lord Hain and Earl Howe

Committee stage & Committee: 2nd sitting (Hansard) & Committee: 2nd sitting (Hansard): House of Lords
Tuesday 14th July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Earl Howe]

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Hain, made some powerful and extremely significant points on co-operation between employers and employees, and putting that important principle into the context of the current crisis. I thank him for the way he did so. I also thank the noble Lord, Lord Hendy, and the noble Baroness, Lady Ritchie, who joined him in putting forward this amendment, and I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Pinnock, and the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, for their contributions.

As has been explained, this amendment would require the Secretary of State to produce a strategy for employer-employee co-operation in regard to businesses implementing the provisions of the Bill, which should be done within six months of the Act coming into force. In producing the strategy, the Secretary of State would be required to consult trade unions, other employee representatives, relevant businesses and other appropriate parties. I hope that the noble Lord, Lord Hain, will take it from me that we recognise the importance of effective employer-employee relationships, particularly in the current context. We encourage a constructive approach from both sides.

The noble Lord, Lord Hendy, asked me to say why we would object to an amendment of this kind. We do not think that a ministerially led strategy for employee-employer co-operation is necessary in the context of the Bill. The simple reason for that is that decisions on how to implement the provisions of the Bill rest best with individual businesses, their employees and their representatives, who know far more about their specific circumstances than any government Minister. We do not need to involve the Government in those processes.

I agree that workers’ voices should be easily heard, so it is worth my adding that the Information and Consultation of Employees Regulations 2004 provide another important avenue for the worker’s voice in the workplace. We have recently lowered the request threshold from 10% to 2%, which we believe will encourage employers to be more open with staff about what is happening in their workplace. This has made it easier for employees to secure information and consultation arrangements with their employer on key matters relating to the employer’s strategic direction. That is another reason why we believe that this amendment is not necessary.

The Government recognise that trade unions can play a constructive role in maintaining positive industrial relations. Indeed, to answer the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, we have worked with unions, employers and other parties throughout this pandemic to ensure that workplaces remain safe; we will continue to do so as the UK looks towards economic recovery. This is an important subject, not least because so many people owe their lives and their well-being to a great many trade union members. However, for the reasons I have given, and much as I am with the noble Lord, Lord Hain, in spirit, I am not able to accept this amendment. I hope that the Committee will agree and that, for now at least, the noble Lord will feel able to withdraw his amendment.

[Lord Hain [V]]

My Lords, I thank my co-signatories to this amendment, my noble friend Lord Hendy and the noble Baroness, Lady Ritchie. My noble friend Lord Hendy’s expertise and knowledge of employment law is second to none in this House. I am grateful to him for his support, as I am to my noble friend Lord Kennedy of Southwark—particularly for his mention of other unions such as USDAW and the bakers’ union which have been crucial in combating the Covid crisis. We can look right across the board, to UNISON in the health service, the Royal College of Nursing, the GMB and others, which have all played a vital role. This amendment seeks to get proper statutory acknowledgement for that role. I thank also the noble Baronesses, Lady Kramer and Lady Pinnock, for their support.

The Minister is always a model of ministerial courtesy and consensus. I thank him for that, but I find his argument that this amendment is not necessary, frankly, pretty shallow. The amendment is extremely modest, as my noble friend Lord Hendy underlined. All it is asking is for recognition that there should be consultation with trade unions and employees—and with other organisations where no unions are recognised. How can we combat this crisis effectively unless we are all pulling together? As we all know, we are facing an absolutely major crisis. Trade unions are performing a critical role. I find it very disappointing that the Minister is not able to support this amendment. Therefore, I give notice that my noble friends and I will seek to return with another, similar amendment on Report. Meanwhile, at this stage, I beg leave to withdraw this amendment.

Refugees and Migrants: Royal Navy and NATO Interception in Mediterranean

Debate between Lord Hain and Earl Howe

Monday 7th March 2016 Lords Chamber

[Earl Howe]

The noble and gallant Lord is absolutely right. As he knows, the UK has provided a significant contribution to the EU naval force operation countering migrant smugglers in the Mediterranean off the coast of Libya. We have been doing that since July last year. HMS “Enterprise” remains committed to that operation over the winter, identifying potential migrant-smuggling vessels off the coast of Libya. He is also right to draw our attention to the whole of the Mediterranean as an area of concern. We must not forget that Operation Sophia is just one part of the overall, comprehensive approach to tackling the migrant crisis. The migrants who come up from sub-Saharan Africa are, by and large, those who leave the Libyan coast. In the main, those arriving at the Turkish coast stem from Afghanistan and Syria.

[Lord Hain (Lab)]

My Lords, what exactly did the Minister mean when he said that any migrants picked up by British ships would be returned or sent to Greece? Does that not put even more pressure on the Greek authorities, which are being overwhelmed by flows of refugees? Can the Minister also give assurances to the House that Amnesty’s recent report on serious violations of human rights affecting migrants within Turkey is being acted upon by the Government?