United States: Haggis Ban

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord De Mauley

Thursday 15th January 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord De Mauley]

My Lords, what a good idea. As the noble Lord does not appear to like the taste of the,

“Great chieftain o’ the pudding-race”,

I recommend a large tot of whisky.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, given the seriousness of this matter, should the Government not consider appointing a special envoy with energy and imagination to go to the United States and stay there until this matter is resolved? Could I suggest that Alex Salmond is currently looking for work?

[Lord De Mauley]

My Lords, I was going to say that it is a question of priorities, but that is an eminently sensible suggestion.

EU: Regulation on Chemicals

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord De Mauley

Wednesday 27th November 2013 Lords Chamber

[Lord De Mauley]

My Lords, I touched on the matter of cost earlier, but the noble Lord will appreciate that this is definitively a complex area, regardless of how we regulate it. Chemicals are a complicated business and they need careful attention. However, I am now going to go into some technical language.

Adding a substance to annexe 14 is a multi-stage process involving several factors. The ECHA has recently finished conducting a public consultation on its draft recommendation. It will then consider the opinion of the member state committee in its final recommendation to the European Commission. It is important to stress that this is a recommendation. The ECHA does not have the power to ban a chemical. It is the European Commission, in conjunction with member states and the European Parliament, which decides whether to take a recommendation forward to add a chemical to annexe 14. I emphasise that if a substance is added to the annexe, it does not constitute a ban. Instead, it is the trigger for industry to make the case for continued authorised use of a chemical.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, is my noble friend’s quote from the trade association not a classic example of how big business loves regulation which destroys small business and removes its competition? What has happened to the Government’s initiative to stop the continuing gold-plating of legislation from Europe? Is it simply to say that nothing can be done because we cannot change European regulations?

[Lord De Mauley]

As my noble friend asks about gold- plating, perhaps I may say that REACH is a directly acting regulation so there is little scope for gold-plating. However, the UK approach is in fact the opposite of that; for example, our approach to enforcement is to help companies get back into compliance. My noble friend might like to know that the Environment Agency has developed helpful tools for that process. It uses its expertise to look for illegal use of restricted chemicals, and it can then focus on suspected wrongdoing with little or no burden on compliant companies.

Agriculture: Common Agricultural Policy

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord De Mauley

Tuesday 30th July 2013 Lords Chamber

[Lord De Mauley]

My Lords, the noble Lord makes a very good point. If I have understood him correctly, no, it is very much our intention that they should not be adversely prejudiced.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

My Lords, notwithstanding the progress being made on greening, what progress is being made on pruning the CAP?

[Lord De Mauley]

Well, my Lords, that is indeed a question. In the context of the reduced CAP budget, the UK’s key aims for the CAP reform negotiations were to increase the resilience, market orientation and international competitiveness of EU agriculture; to improve the CAP’s capacity to deliver environmental outcomes; and to simplify the CAP for farmers and authorities. We want an efficient and responsive agricultural sector in the EU and globally, and we want the future CAP to achieve this.

Horsemeat and Food Fraud

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord De Mauley

Monday 11th February 2013 Lords Chamber

[Lord De Mauley]

My Lords, I agree wholeheartedly with the right reverend Prelate that it is essential that people can have confidence that what they are eating is what it is made out to be. There is responsibility throughout the food chain. Suppliers are responsible for what they supply onwards to other organisations and businesses. We are reminding public bodies of their responsibility for their own food contracts. We expect them to have rigorous procurement procedures in place with reputable suppliers. We expect caterers and suppliers to public institutions to have appropriate controls, including testing and sampling regimes, in place to ensure the authenticity of their products. If caterers have any doubts about the provenance of their product, they should seek assurance from their suppliers.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

When I was Secretary of State for Scotland, I had to deal with an E.coli crisis, the BSE crisis and a problem with some radioactive gas being delivered to the Barr’s Irn Bru factory. Therefore, I have considerable sympathy with my right honourable friend in dealing with a food crisis of this kind. Will my noble friend accept our congratulations on the way in which the Secretary of State has handled it and reject the criticisms of the noble Lord, Lord Knight, who I am not sure realises that the chairman of the FSA is one of his colleagues—the noble Lord, Lord Rooker? Between them, the noble Lord, Lord Rooker, the Secretary of State and his colleagues have done an excellent job in balancing the need to give the public information with the need not to destroy businesses. Going back to the BSE crisis, the French unilaterally imposed a ban on Scottish grass-fed beef, which lasted for several years and did enormous damage. My right honourable friend is to be congratulated on not operating in a way that is damaging to the interests of businesses throughout the United Kingdom and, indeed, throughout Europe, while at the same time taking sensible measures which are required to protect the public interest.

[Lord De Mauley]

My Lords, I will pass on my noble friend’s comments to my right honourable friend.

Economy: Growth

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord De Mauley

Wednesday 18th July 2012 Lords Chamber

[Lord De Mauley]

I congratulate the noble Lord on his performance; we are more focused on the economy. Of course growth is of concern but unemployment is falling. In the three months to May, the number of unemployed fell by 65,000 and 181,000 new jobs were created. Since the coalition took office in May 2010, more than 840,000 private sector jobs have been created, manufacturing output is up and exports of goods to outside the EU are up by 35% quarter on quarter from the first quarter of 2010 to 2012. Noble Lords will also know that inflation has fallen.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

Does my noble friend agree that we will only get growth from businesses being able to sell goods and services competitively throughout the globe? Would it be a good idea for the Secretary of State, Mr Cable, to spend his Summer Recess thinking of ways in which he can reduce the cost of doing business for our firms throughout the country? That, not demand, is the key to getting further employment and further tax revenues for the Treasury.

[Lord De Mauley]

My Lords, my right honourable friend the Secretary of State for Business thinks of little else.

Companies: Executive Remuneration

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord De Mauley

Wednesday 13th June 2012 Lords Chamber

[Lord De Mauley]

My Lords, I am not sure what binding votes on an optional basis might mean, but that is not what is proposed.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

My Lords, is not one of the difficulties with the Government’s proposals that the people who act for the shareholders are the fund managers and the institutions—as the noble Lord, Lord Myners, is well aware—who are themselves paid huge sums of money, which, unlike with directors of public companies, are not disclosed?

[Lord De Mauley]

Presumably unless they are quoted, my Lords. Institutional shareholders are showing a great deal more interest in taking action on this than they have previously, and we have every hope that they will take advantage of the tools that we propose to give them.

Defence Budget

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord De Mauley

Monday 14th May 2012 Lords Chamber

[Lord Davies of Stamford]

My Lords, the noble Lord’s Statement today—

[Lord De Mauley]

My Lords, there is plenty of time. We have heard from two Labour Back-Benchers already. Let us hear from my noble friend Lord Forsyth.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

My Lords, would my noble friend take this opportunity to pay tribute to the role which Scottish regiments have played in the British Army and reaffirm that the best future for regiments such as the Black Watch, with its proud tradition, is in Scotland’s remaining part of the United Kingdom and continuing to play such an important role in its defence?

Barnett Formula

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord De Mauley

Wednesday 15th June 2011 Lords Chamber

[Lord De Mauley]

My Lords, I am most grateful for the opportunity this evening provided by the noble Lord, Lord Barnett, to debate his eponymous formula. It is an important subject that is of great interest to all parts of the United Kingdom. I thank all noble Lords who have participated. I listened carefully to what they said. I congratulate in particular my noble friend Lord Stephen on his maiden speech, and look forward to many more of the quality that he showed us this evening.

It might help if I explain briefly the background. Changes in the departmental expenditure limit block budgets of the devolved Administrations are determined by the Barnett formula. The calculation in outline is the change in provision of the respective United Kingdom departments in the spending review, multiplied by the relevant departmental comparability factor—which, for example, would be 100 per cent for health, as health is fully devolved—multiplied by the appropriate population proportion. The population figures are updated at the spending review to reflect latest ONS estimates of population, and the comparability percentage is also revisited.

The previous Government decided at the time of devolution in 1999 to retain the block and Barnett formula arrangements for determining the budgets of the devolved Administrations. This was the basis on which the devolution referendums were held. It is worth noting that responsibility for allocating spending in England to the English regions and local authorities lies with UK departments. They make these decisions once departmental settlements have been announced in the spending review. There is no single formula for allocating money within England.

Several reports have recently been published that examined the funding of the devolved Administrations. All were referred to by noble Lords this evening. The Calman commission on developing the Scottish devolution settlement, which was commissioned by the previous United Kingdom Government and the Scottish unionist parties, reported in June 2009 and covered funding to Scotland. The Holtham commission on Welsh funding, commissioned by the Welsh Assembly Government, published in the summer of last year its final report on the Barnett formula and on devolving taxation and borrowing in Wales. The House of Lords Select Committee on the Barnett Formula reported in July 2009.

On the subject of the Calman commission, the Scotland Office published a Command Paper in November 2010. It accepted the recommendations that there should be improved financial accountability, including more tax devolution—the noble Lord, Lord Foulkes, referred to this—and that as a consequence the Barnett-determined block should be reduced by the forecast amount of the 10p devolved income tax receipts. It also accepted taking forward the devolution of other taxes, including stamp duty and landfill tax, and introducing new borrowing powers for the Scottish Executive. Implementing the Command Paper will require legislation: a Scotland Bill has been published and is currently going through Parliament. I listened to the comments of my noble friend Lord Forsyth and of other noble Lords, and certainly I will pass them back to Her Majesty's Treasury. The noble Lord will have ample opportunity to make his points on the Bill as it passes through your Lordships' House.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

Why did my noble friend leave out, in his list of conclusions from the Calman report, the acknowledgement that we would have to move to a needs-based system of funding?

[Lord De Mauley]

I was going on to say that the House of Lords report recommended replacing the Barnett formula with a needs-based formula. I will deal later with needs-based issues. The previous Government welcomed the House of Lords report, as noble Lords said, although they remained opposed to replacing the Barnett formula. Following the Holtham and House of Lords reports, the coalition Government said in their programme for government that they recognised the concerns expressed about the system of devolved funding, but that the priority must be to reduce the budget deficit and therefore any decisions to change the current system must await the stabilisation of the public finances. In addition, the Government announced in the spending review that there will be consideration with the Welsh Government of the proposals in the final Holtham report, consistent with work being taken forward in Scotland following the Calman commission.

The Government welcome all views on the future of the Barnett formula. I will ensure that Her Majesty's Treasury is made aware of what has been said this evening. In the past, the formula proved to be a durable and robust method of calculating changes for the devolved Administrations. Even the House of Lords report concluded that the Barnett formula had qualities such as simplicity, stability and the absence of ring-fencing. However, we recognise the concerns that are often expressed about it, and were expressed this evening.

There is perhaps a perception, especially in English regions such as the north-east, that Scotland in particular is overprovided for. Comparisons tend to be made using figures published in public expenditure statistical analyses on identifiable total managed spending per head. My noble friend Lord Shipley mentioned some figures. Those for 2009-10 are £8,531 per head for England, £9,940 for Scotland, £9,709 for Wales and £10,564 for Northern Ireland. On a comparable basis, the north-east has the second highest spending per head in England at £9,433.

The perception in England that the devolved Administrations may be overfunded may be exacerbated because they can afford more generous policies; for example, on university fees and the free provision of services. The noble Lord, Lord Barnett, referred to this. I must emphasise that the devolved Administrations have not received any additional money to fund those policies. They have accommodated them within their existing budgets. One of the purposes of devolution is to allow the devolved Administrations to make these different policy choices. This was set out in 1997 in the previous Government’s statement of principles:

“The key to these arrangements is block budgets which the devolved Administrations ... will be free to deploy ... in response to local priorities”.

I am sure that the devolved Administrations themselves do not regard their spending review settlements as generous.

My noble friend Lord German and the noble Lord, Lord Wigley, were concerned about the Barnett squeeze convergence property of the Barnett formula, whereby the percentage increases in spending tend to be lower than in England. The Holtham commission in Wales, in particular, has called for a floor to be placed under the formula to prevent further convergence with England. The expression “Barnett squeeze” reflects that the Barnett formula provides the same absolute increase per head but a lower percentage increase because of the higher baseline levels of spending in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland inherited from the past. Of course, the percentage reductions will tend to be smaller than those for many UK departments when spending is cut, as it was in the last spending review. I will return to the subject of Wales in a moment.

Some have raised concerns about the transparency of the existing system. The House of Lords report itself concluded that the quality of data on public spending has improved since 1999. The Government have provided further information about the allocation of grant to the devolved Administrations, based on data which the Treasury provided to the committee and which was published in the committee’s report.

Several, if not all, noble Lords criticised the Barnett formula because it does not take sufficient account of needs. In a similar discussion in your Lordships' House in 2009, the noble Lord, Lord Davies of Oldham, said for the then Government,

“there is no doubt that the Barnett formula has stood the test of time from its development 20 or so years ago”.—[Official Report, 15/12/09; col. 1392.]

The Barnett formula has indeed provided a simple, stable and robust method for funding the devolved Administrations over the past 30 years. It is, of course, for the devolved Administrations to decide how to allocate their overall budget to individual programmes reflecting their own policies. The Barnett formula allows them the freedom to do this, without being second-guessed by the UK Government or any other body on their needs.