Iran

Lord Dholakia Excerpts

Tuesday 30th November 2010 Grand Committee

[Lord Dholakia]

My Lords, Iran has secured constant headlines over the past few years because it has a dismal record on human rights, the capacity to produce nuclear weapons and a fragile democracy. These are matters of serious concern to the free world. This debate gives us the opportunity to probe the coalition Government’s stance on issues identified so far by many noble Lords. It is tempting to cite some revelations that emerged from WikiLeaks. I do not condone the unauthorised release of classified information. Governments cannot operate effectively if confidentiality in matters of security is leaked, but this is not the case with Iran, and diplomats ought to exercise care in the way in which information is communicated. Let me give the Committee an example. We are shocked that it took years of legal battles in this country and in Europe to formalise the status of the PMOI. Some of the information used by the Foreign Office at that time could not stand the scrutiny of the courts. It is here that our system of justice is supreme, and the PMOI has now been removed from the list of proscribed organisations.

Why are we afraid of organisations fighting for democracy and the civilised rule of law in Iran? The civilised world cannot accept the death penalty for more than 135 child offenders now on death row in Iran. In many cases, dissent against the regime is followed by systematic public hangings; 120,000 political prisoners have been executed since the 1979 Islamic revolution. Amputation, lashing and stoning seem to be the norm. Mobile communications, particularly mobile phones, have made it possible for the world to know how fragile the state of democracy is and how power seems to fluctuate between the politicians and the mullahs.

The nervousness of neighbouring Arab states is easy to understand. So far, tact and diplomacy have not yielded positive outcomes, and the process of uranium enrichment continues. We need to know more about what role the regime is playing in Iraq, Afghanistan and Lebanon, but the priority at this stage is to protect the life and liberty of those who are in Camp Ashraf, a point well made by the noble Lord, Lord Corbett. The world cannot stand by and allow the constant persecution of the residents there. The shift of power after the Iraq war between the Sunnis and the Shias has opened up a new front in which Iran exercises considerable influence in that region. It is no surprise that the unremitting violence against Camp Ashraf residents is the direct result of Iran's influence.

There are a number of questions that I need to put, but I shall stick with two. Will the Minister ensure that Mrs Maryam Rajavi is given a visa to travel to the United Kingdom so that we can learn how best to promote democratic changes in Iran, and will he facilitate a cross-party delegation of parliamentarians to visit Camp Ashraf?

--- Later in debate ---

[The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office (Lord Howell of Guildford)]

My Lords, in the brief time left after this series of brilliant vignettes and short speeches about the situation in Iran, it will not be open to me to do full justice to all the questions, and I shall try to contact noble Lords whose questions I do not answer adequately.

I shall begin at the end because the noble Baroness, Lady Symons, spoke with great strength about matters about which we all feel: the gross abuse of human rights in Iran and its appalling practices. She mentioned, in particular, the practice of executing juvenile offenders, which revolts the entire world, and I can tell her that the European Union continues to raise this again and again, with other death penalties, and my honourable friend Alistair Burt, the Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, discussed this with the Iranian ambassador when they met a few weeks ago, but those are words and our disgust must be expressed in much stronger words than that, and will continue to be.

The challenges posed to the international community by Iran’s behaviour in all its aspects are stark. I commend particularly the opening comments by the noble Lord, Lord Corbett, who not only feels strongly but conveys the strength of his feeling about the behaviour of this grim regime. We have no doubt at all that a nuclear-armed Iran would be a disaster for the Middle East region and deeply damaging to the integrity of the international system for preventing nuclear proliferation. Several noble Lords referred to that, and I take the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Mitchell, about the dangers and about how the habit of extending existential threats to other nations merely reinforces the whole atmosphere and makes the danger all the greater.

Iran’s treatment of its own people, its appalling record, to which I referred, and its support for terrorist groups in the Middle East demonstrate the true nature of the Iranian state. We have no doubt about that. It is confirmed by everything that has been said and there is, indeed, the malign shadow of Iran over the Middle East and over prospects for peace. Those prospects would be enhanced if Iran were no longer able to use, for instance, the Israeli-Palestine argument, debate, quarrel, differences and conflict somehow to champion every kind of hostile and difficult element in the region.

The international community has demonstrated unity and resolve. We have adopted a twin-track approach to Iran, referred to by your Lordships, of pressure and engagement. The aim is peaceful pressure, through sanctions, designed to persuade Iran to come to the negotiating table. In the past six months, we have secured tough new sanctions at the UN and at the European Union. The noble Baroness rightly asked whether we were bringing the allies along. Sanctions must be comprehensive. If they are undermined or weakened by various loopholes, the entire process becomes more difficult to conduct. I assure the noble Lord, Lord Maginnis, that the sanctions will be tough. We are in high-level discussions with China on the need for it to support them. If trade routes are being undermined and investment in Iran continues from other quarters, our sanctions, particularly financial, are weakened.

We are running those sanctions in parallel with serious efforts to talk. The noble Baroness, Lady Ashton, speaking on behalf of the E3+3, has offered talks for next week, at the beginning of December. That is the latest in a long series of good-faith offers to talk. We do not know how Iran will respond, but we hope that it will do so quickly—the location is yet to be finally settled.

Many noble Lords referred to human rights. Iran’s record poses a direct challenge to the international community. Last year, the world witnessed via TV and YouTube brutal state suppression of the post-election protests in June. That rightly caused international outrage, which we fully shared. We have lobbied the Government of Iran to improve their human rights record and continue to do so. My colleagues and our team of Ministers in other departments regularly raise cases and issues of concern directly with the Iranian authorities. We have regularly lobbied the Iranian Government on the case, for instance—I am not sure whether it was mentioned in our discussion—of Mohammadi Ashtiani since her case came to light in June 2010. We were all revolted by the proposed method of her execution; it was a hideous case.

We are working all the time to get stronger international condemnation of Iran’s very bad human rights record. Last week, 80 countries from every continent voted in favour of a UN resolution—I think that it was raised by one of your Lordships— condemning Iran’s human rights record and calling on its Government to take urgent action. The resolution passed with the largest positive vote for eight years, indicating the breadth of international concern.

We will continue to push for the full implementation of UN resolutions calling for the disarmament of all armed groups supported by Iran and to give our full support to the UN sanctions committees that are pursuing and investigating sanctions violations. I do not want any doubt to be left about that.

I turn to the crucial questions about Camp Ashraf that were raised with such telling conviction by the noble Lord, Lord Corbett, my noble friend Lord Waddington, and others. I am not sure that anything I say will meet their full concern, because I can understand their strength of feeling. However, I have to say to them that, although we must act with as much power as we can, there are bound to be some limits to what we can do. Officials have visited Camp Ashraf four times in the past year, most recently in August. Noble Lords will know that Camp Ashraf is in a sovereign and democratic Iraq. We stress the need for the Iraqi authorities to deal with the residents of the camp in a way that meets international standards, and we will do so again and again.

Several noble Lords asked about seeking to facilitate a visit by noble Lords and Members of Parliament to Camp Ashraf. We would certainly try to do that. Whether one can guarantee that the Iranian authorities will provide the necessary facilities is another matter, but I am quite happy to say here and now that we would consider that possibility and see whether it could make a positive contribution to the situation.

I want to say one or two other things about Camp Ashraf, because I know that the feeling is so very strong and I ought to answer it absolutely fully in the last two minutes I have available—I can see the red light in front of me. On October 25—that is, just a month ago—the chargé d'affaires at our embassy in Baghdad went once again to the Iraqi Human Rights Minister and raised the matters there. Our embassy officials regularly discuss the situation with the Camp Ashraf special adviser in the United Nations Assistance Mission for Iraq, most recently on 21 October, and with EU colleagues and the Iraqi Government’s Ashraf committee. On 24 October, officials also spoke with the US about the latest developments at the camp. In addition, as I have already reiterated, officials have visited it four times in the past year. That is the situation now. It is not satisfactory. One’s heart as well as one’s head says that to see this continuing situation is a grim possibility that somehow must be headed off.

I have to conclude that Iran’s policies and behaviour towards the international community and its neighbours are matters of crucial concern. We will pursue honest engagement with Iran on the basis of offers we have made in good faith. Through sanctions, we will maintain pressure on the Iranian Government to engage over their nuclear programme. We will work closely with regional countries to combat Iran’s attempts to promote regional instability and continue to put pressure on the Iranian Government to treat their own people with dignity and respect, in line with international human obligations. There is much more to say but no time to say it. I am grateful once again to the noble Lord, Lord Corbett, for initiating this very important but short debate.

[Lord Dholakia]

My Lords, do we not still have two minutes, according to my clock in front of me? Would the Minister be able to say something about the visit of Mrs Rajavi to this country?

[Lord Howell of Guildford]

There is no time now. I must write to the noble Lord about that.