Infected Blood Inquiry

Debate between Lord Berkeley of Knighton and Baroness Neville-Rolfe

Tuesday 20th December 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Neville-Rolfe (Con)]

I thank my noble friend. I think I have said probably as much as I can about having an arm’s-length body, but clearly it is helpful to have Sir Robert’s advice on this important matter. No options are ruled out, and that is certainly one of the recommendations that we are looking at very seriously.

Independence in making sure that everybody gets the compensation they need and ensuring trust in the system are lessons that need to be learned. I like my noble friend’s challenge that we always need to learn lessons from mistakes that are made in government; coming from another world, it is something that I always try to do. Across all parties, we have been slow to take grip of this awful issue.

Having said that, it was the Conservative Government who set up the inquiry into infected blood in 2017. We then commissioned Sir Robert Francis to do a compensation study. The force of that study led Sir Brian—they are both involved in this; they work together—to recommend, on 29 July 2022, that an interim payment should be made. By October, we had paid that interim payment to all those he recommended should receive it. We have also ensured that it is exempt from tax and disregarded for benefits.

[Lord Berkeley of Knighton (CB)]

My Lords, as the Minister said, this is a tragedy. It is almost unimaginable what the families affected by this have gone through and are going through. My question is very simple and follows on from what two noble Lords who have spoken said. Do the Government anticipate that all the people who have suffered infection will get an interim payment, or is it limited?

Nuclear Test Veterans: Medals

Debate between Lord Berkeley of Knighton and Baroness Neville-Rolfe

Thursday 24th November 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Neville-Rolfe (Con)]

I agree with the noble Baroness that it is important to publicly acknowledge the use of lands belonging to traditional landowners for nuclear testing, both in Australia and the Pacific; I was going to volunteer that point which the noble Lord, Lord Purvis, made. We are acknowledging it publicly in Parliament, and we have to continue to do that; I am not aware of any particular research in the area that the noble Baroness mentioned, but I will certainly ask that question and come back to her if I can give her any more information. I suspect that she may know a great deal more about Australia and what is going on there.

[Lord Berkeley of Knighton (CB)]

My Lords, I very much echo the congratulations of other noble Lords on this matter finally being resolved. The points about the indigenous population and any kind of fallout are very important, because there could be nothing worse for the reputation of our country than the idea that we would conduct experiments of this sort, which are very important, and somehow poison other people’s land without compensating them and checking that it is now safe.

I, too, very respectfully suggest that there are lessons to be learned here. Bureaucracy, of course, takes a long time. Where compensation, medals and pensions are concerned, I am sure the Government would prefer not to be seen to have this matter resolved by people constantly having to campaign and drag it from them. I suggest to the Minister that we should try to be more proactive about looking ahead when these problems arise, and perhaps even come up with solutions before we need endless campaigns. It is more honourable and dignified, and it is clearly applicable to a question such as this. However, I repeat that I am very glad that this question has now been resolved.

[Baroness Neville-Rolfe (Con)]

I am glad that the noble Lord also mentioned the communities in Australia and elsewhere. Of course, as I said, there has been a government ex gratia payment, which I believe was very important. Although the 1950s and 1960s were a long time ago, it is not too late to honour the brave people involved. Those looking at these cases in the round have difficult judgments to make but, having said that, the noble Lord is right that we should learn from mistakes. That is one of the principles I have brought into government with me: learn as you go along, because you can improve in almost every area of government.

Rugby World Cup 2015

Debate between Lord Berkeley of Knighton and Baroness Neville-Rolfe

Wednesday 11th November 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Berkeley of Knighton]

Does the noble Baroness accept that in order to safeguard for the future this cornucopia of heritage of which we are all so proud, we must invest more heavily in the arts and sciences in our schools?

[Baroness Neville-Rolfe]

The arts, the creative arts and all the things that the noble Lord mentions are incredibly important in the school curriculum, and there has been a lot of investment. Of course, the whole cornucopia that has been described helps with the education process, with visits to national institutions, artistic institutions and theatres. The Arts Council does a wonderful job and will continue to do so.

Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014

Debate between Lord Berkeley of Knighton and Baroness Neville-Rolfe

Tuesday 29th July 2014 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Neville-Rolfe]

I think that the answer is that some were in the original Act, and some were introduced via secondary legislation. Of those present in the original Act, some have since been modified by secondary legislation, but I will set out more detail in a letter if the noble Lord would find that helpful.

The noble Lord, Lord Clement-Jones, also asked about the use of the European Communities Act to make changes. I am aware that this has been discussed before, but to reiterate, the Government are confident that they can make these changes by means of Section 2(2). That section allows provisions to be made in relation to obligations arising from treaties entered into by the EU. Use of this Act is therefore not limited to implementing provisions in the infosoc directive. Case law, like in the TV catch-up case, makes it clear that Section 2(2) can also cover matters arising out of or related to UK rights and obligations.

The noble Lord asked whether government had taken independent legal advice on the legality of the use of Section 2(2). Again, the Government are confident that they have a sound legal basis for the proposed changes. This analysis is presented in the Explanatory Memorandum accompanying the statutory instruments.

The noble Lord asked about what is meant by “lawfully acquired”.

[Lord Berkeley of Knighton]

I am sorry to interrupt. This may be a point that the Minister has covered; if it is one that she is about to come on to, I await the answer eagerly. If the research which she has said will be undertaken to see how the policy works finds that there has been harm, will a compensation scheme be brought about to compensate right holders who have been found to have lost out?

[Baroness Neville-Rolfe]

I thank the noble Lord for that question. I think that we will need to wait and see what the evaluation looks like—I urge him to make some input on the nature of evaluation. It is a bit of a hypothetical question. As a representative of the Government, I would be uneasy about making any promises, but I thank the noble Lord for the point made.

I should move on, as time is pressing, to say a little about fair dealing, which the noble Lord, Lord Clement-Jones, raised. Fair dealing is an established legal concept that has been part of copyright law for more than 100 years. It is a question of fact, degree and impression and will take into account a number of factors, the main ones being whether the alleged fair dealing is in commercial competition with the owner’s exploitation of the work; whether the work has already been published or otherwise exposed to the public; and the amount of work which has been undertaken and the importance of it. We did not intend to define it further in the legislation, because doing so would upset this well established case law and undermine its main benefit, its ability to adapt to the circumstances of any specific case.

The noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, asked what evidence the Government had relied on in developing their policy proposals. The Government have worked hard to ensure that the proposed changes are based on evidence. The impact assessments are based on the best evidence available and were reviewed and validated by the independent Regulatory Policy Committee.

The noble Baroness, Lady Morris, referred to cloud services. This is a difficult and very important area which was explored as part of the Government’s impact assessment. However, we were not provided with sufficient data to enable us to determine what the impact would be. The majority of evidence received related to licence services, which would not fall within the scope of the exception; for example, because they provided streamed content so were not relevant. The music industry has accepted unlawful private copying for many years, so one might reasonably assume that the ability of the consumer to make copies of CDs is already taken into account when licensing deals are negotiated. Negotiation of contracts between businesses is a matter for those businesses. If, however, this is an issue of market abuse, it would obviously be a matter for the competition authorities.

The Government have published the changes through social media and website updates and through contacting interested stakeholders, such as those who responded to the technical review. They have published plain English guidance aimed at different user groups as well as an unofficial consolidated version of the copyright Act. We would expect wider education initiatives, such as the recently announced education campaign, to include educational messages—